Game Thread: Cavs vs. Warriors - 1/20/07

Discussion in 'Golden State Warriors' started by Doctor Kajita, Jan 20, 2007.

  1. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

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    <div class="quote_poster">Kensaku Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">The Cavs played a good game. We didn't have Baron, and we were playing with two new starters who don't know the playbook. Considering those things, the W's played pretty good.</div>

    True, just not defensively. [​IMG]
    And we were ahead in the first half because of the almighty threeball we seem to rely for survival with/without Baron/Jrich/or whoever. That's just how badly we need size all the more. Guards shouldn't have to emulate the type of inside offense/defensive play bigger players need to provide for a team. We need those roles pretty soon or the hype won't be for real. That's all I'm saying. Mulln's next goal should be figuring out with Nelson what kind of big guy can I get that would thrive in an uptempo setting and still do stuff in the halfcourt and play it defensively?

    Very few players like that, but I hope we get something to make up for settling on the wrong bigs in the past.
     
  2. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Mulln's next goal should be figuring out with Nelson what kind of big guy can I get that would thrive in an uptempo setting and still do stuff in the halfcourt and play it defensively?

    Very few players like that, but I hope we get something to make up for settling on the wrong bigs in the past.</div>

    KG or Dirk [​IMG]

    Oh, how about Chris Bosh or Dwight Howard. Go for it Mullin.
     
  3. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">Kensaku Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Yup. Plus, J-Rich is a good defensive rebounder. Once healthy, he could make-up for the defensive rebounding liability Harrington is. But, I do think Harrington's rebounding numbers will go up on this team.</div>

    My point is that this team needs a power forward. They have a surplus of guards. Thus, they should trade a guard to get a power forward. We could try to trade SJax or Pietrus straight up for someone, but if we want a top-tier PF, we'll have to give up something. JRich and Pietrus is a top-value package that would entice teams.

    JRich + Pietrus for Pau Gasol

    JRich for Kirilinko

    or, how about:

    Foyle + Pietrus + Barnes for AK-47 -- that one would be sweet. But it would never happen.

    If the team wants to get a top PF, they're probably going to have to give up JRich or Baron. Or, they could get a mid-level PF but then why bother? Or, the team could wait until the off-season and just play Harrington / Barnes at PF. But people don't seem to be enthused about that...

    I'd try to get Gasol or Ak-47.
     
  4. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

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    Like Kensaku mentioned. KG or nothing! [​IMG]

    I like Pau. Can he run though? I've never really seen this guy get up the floor the way that Amare Stoudamire or Dirk can do. Grizzlies have always tried to play some kind of defense or organized offense if they could.
     
  5. Warriorfansnc93

    Warriorfansnc93 JBB JustBBall Member

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    I never said anything about Kirlenko. I want Gasol...
     
  6. Gohn

    Gohn JBB JustBBall Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Alleyoop:</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah -- Stephen Jackson really impressed me tonight, and not just because of his team-high 29pts. I was reluctant to have him come to this team, based on my impressions I had of him. Isn't it funny how things can change so quickly? SJax is my new best friend!! Man, that guy is a terrific player, in every area of the game. He's probably the Warriors best outside shooter now, right alongside Rooney. He plays superb defense, rebounds well, passes well, doesn't make stupid turnovers, he's a super-value for the $$.</div>
    I think you are overrating SJax a bit. What I like about him is that he has confidence in his game, but sometimes that can shoot the team in the foot. He started off shooting well but near the end of the game he cooled off considerably, though that could be a fatigue issue since he played so many minutes. He ended shooting 10/15 which is 40%, right about his average. Also Jackson for his career is more of a streak shooter.

    Jackson also had 6 TOs tonight. He got picked trying to dribble the ball a few times and also got it picked on the post up a few times. The Cavs did a good job of collapsing and reaching in for the strip everytime the W's entered the paint.

    I do think that Jackson will help the team but he has his flaws.
     
  7. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

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    <div class="quote_poster">Warriorfansnc93 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I never said anything about Kirlenko. I want Gasol...</div>

    My bad. I mean to AlleyOop. Sorry. I got names mixed up! [​IMG]
     
  8. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah -- Stephen Jackson really impressed me tonight, and not just because of his team-high 29pts. I was reluctant to have him come to this team, based on my impressions I had of him. Isn't it funny how things can change so quickly? SJax is my new best friend!! Man, that guy is a terrific player, in every area of the game. He's probably the Warriors best outside shooter now, right alongside Rooney. He plays superb defense, rebounds well, passes well, doesn't make stupid turnovers, he's a super-value for the $$.

    Honestly, I think a JRich + Pietrus for AK-47 + equalizer would be a great trade for GS.

    Baron
    Monta
    Jackson
    AK-47
    Beans

    with Harrington, Barnes, Sarunas, and Foyle off the bench.

    Despite being a bit skinny, AK-47 is stronger than most people his size. He has a mirey strength, much like Barnes who often out-powers bigger players (and SJax, who is another very strong player with a somewhat thin frame). Ak-47 can hold it down at the PF. He's a great defender as well.

    I love JRich, but he's getting paid a ton of $$ to sit out and watch right now. If we could get AK-47, we'd have to consider it. Who else would do that?</div>

    Agree on your points about SJax. He's my new best friend, too. [​IMG].

    I'm not sure if Utah would want Pietrus and I think AL is more suited to be a small forward than power forward. It's early, but he may not be the answer at the PF spot.

    SJax can play both the small forward and SG position, but when JRich comes back I'm sure he'll slide down to SF. If we can keep MP, then he can man the SF and PF backup positions and should get steady minutes especially if he can nail the 3-ball.

    Getting Rooney also puts Monta's role as PG in doubt. Monta may play more SG now when Baron comes back. Rooney was a sleeper in the deal and such a great pickup!!! He's my second new best friend!!!
     
  9. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
    Getting Rooney also puts Monta's role as PG in doubt. Monta may play more SG now when Baron comes back. Rooney was a sleeper in the deal and such a great pickup!!! He's my second new best friend!!!</div>

    Monta is a "combo guard" like Arenas is.

    Question, is Monta showing more promise than Arenas was in his second year?
     
  10. AnimeFANatic

    AnimeFANatic JBB JustBBall Member

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    Al Harrington On Tonight's Game

    “I know I was 4-21, but I had the most fun I’ve ever had in my pro career tonight. This is a great way to play. I apologize to my teammates, because if I had made some shots we definitely would’ve won. Overall I think our energy was huge, we just didn’t get a win tonight. But it’s something positive to build on. We should have a great practice tomorrow, get B.D. back, and go into L.A. with one goal and that’s to win the game.”

    “It’s disappointing. Even without Baron, we feel like we have enough power. I put it kind of on myself because I feel like if I made three or four more shots we’d be sitting here smiling instead of sitting here talking about a loss. We’re a very deep team, and it’s very encouraging even though we lost.”
     
  11. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">AnimeFANatic Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Al Harrington On Tonight's Game

    ?I know I was 4-21, but I had the most fun I?ve ever had in my pro career tonight. This is a great way to play. I apologize to my teammates, because if I had made some shots we definitely would?ve won. Overall I think our energy was huge, we just didn?t get a win tonight. But it?s something positive to build on. We should have a great practice tomorrow, get B.D. back, and go into L.A. with one goal and that?s to win the game.?

    ?It?s disappointing. Even without Baron, we feel like we have enough power. I put it kind of on myself because I feel like if I made three or four more shots we?d be sitting here smiling instead of sitting here talking about a loss. We?re a very deep team, and it?s very encouraging even though we lost.?</div>

    I love his attitude. He is genuinely happy to be here. The players we traded genuinely hated being here.

    Did you see Harrington's smile while cheerleading from the bench?
     
  12. Clif25

    Clif25 JBB JustBBall Member

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    Al Harrington isn't going to lead this team anywhere. I think he is going to be another employee for the Boss just like Pietrus. Hopefully Harrington can control his shooting and learns to pass. When Jason comes back there will be a lot of players trying to take a lot of shots. That type of conflict might ruin the type of chemistry that we saw recently, even on Wednesday with only 8 players the chemistry there was so strong. If Harrington can't post up and if he continues to miss layups and get packed by Marshall a la Murphy, then things may not be so jolly. The Warriors' half court set was all haywire tonight. Hopefully it can get turn around with Baron.

    AK will fit in with the defense and team with his ability to block shots and get steals. Gasol would be great since he would be a legit go-to guy in the paint. The Warriors really need a guy to start some inside-out offense, which was kind of the problem tonight. I am not sure how efficient or important AK would be offensively, but he definitley seems easier to get than Gasol...I am not sure if trading one the Warriors' main offensive scoring option for AK will be so good in the end, but we should learn a lot within a week or two.
     
  13. Zhone

    Zhone JBB JustBBall Member

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    I think Monta has a lot of promise, but I wouldn't say more than Gilbert. Gilbert as a sophomore pretty much forced his way into being the starting point guard and did a lot of things well. Although Monta shoots at a way higher percentage and is lightning fast, Gilbert was a bit better at handling the ball, shooting from outside, and getting foul calls (and making them). Gilbert's also got that attitude that can either win games for you or completely frustrate you. Monta doesn't have that clutch quality yet, though it's tougher on a team with bigger egos, so maybe I'm just missing it.
     
  14. Custodianrules2

    Custodianrules2 Cohan + Rowell = Suck

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    I think Clif and Gohn are right about the trade and where we should be going from here. I've always believed a team should win with an inside/outside game and adjust to a variety of tempos and not play just one tempo. Some day... I hope.
     
  15. Run BJM

    Run BJM Heavy lies the crown. Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Ugh, just got home from the game. I've got a lot to say but I'm extremely tired from all the ups and downs and the long-ass-bitchingly-aggravating drive home. For now I'll give my impressions of the players:

    Harrington- He was terrible from the field tonight, he acknowledged that in the quote Anime posted but there was also a lot to like about his performance. Based on his past numbers and performance we have reason to believe that he'll improve his FG shooting and with Baron he'll get better shots and won't have as much defensive focus on him from the other team. I think normally he'd be a good option to go to for scoring but tonight there was just nothing there. I love how he pushed the ball and I know Nelson loves that too, he made some nifty passes but often they were a bit too flashy when a simple pass would have done the job, I think once the team gets the chemistry down there won't be as much confusion with guys not expecting passes and whatnot. He was definitely sincere in that he was excited to be here, you could tell from before the game when he was warming up to the end of the first quarter when he hit some shots and absorbed all the love from the fans. He's an ideal PF for our system if he can hit his shots and keep rebounding like he did tonight. His defense was decent, probably better than Murphy and Ike but still nothing special and many more skilled post players will probably beat him routinely.

    Jackson- He was the closest thing we had to a go-to scorer tonight and his defense really impressed me. Took a few shots that he shouldn't have but he was pretty hot in the 2nd Q so I guess it was understandable. He seems to be automatic when he gets an open set shot from 3, rebounded fairly well tonight, he can actually get to the rim and his handles are solid. I don't know if they showed it on TV but before the game he had some words for the fans about how he and the other Indy guys are thankful that we are their fans and all that BS, it was cool thing for him to do and of all the people to do it I didn't think he would have been the one. I think he'll be a pretty solid player on this team and if he thrives I think it would really make trading JR a smart move to make. He could become a Nellie favorite because he can shoot, penetrate, post up, hes 6'8 and can play SG/SF, if he can rebound, continue to play defense, and continue to play with some attitude I think he'll be a very good player for Nellie. I'm really starting to like this guy.

    Rooney- I liked what I saw form him tonight, the offense ran much better when he was running the point, we really got nothing from the lineups with Monta running the show. He can shoot and showed very good ability to find the open man and make crisp, accurate passes so the guy doesn't have to move to get the ball. Very solid.

    I have to note that when we run lineups with some combination of Jax/Pietrus/AZ/Barnes its really overwhelming to the opponent. They've all got quick hands and feet, defend well, are long and very athletic, they really just cause a lot of problems for other teams. I'm really starting to get sick of Barnes though, ever since that article about him knowing he's going to get a fat paycheck at the end of the season hes been playing like crap. Trade him for whatever you can get Mully.

    I really want to make a note that all the guys we got (except Powell) seem ecstatic to be here and feel the love from the fans (even though the Oracle sucks in terms of being a tough place to play). Its really obvious to see how happy they are with the freedom they've got from Nellie after being so heavily restricted by Carlisle.
     
  16. Zhone

    Zhone JBB JustBBall Member

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    Pau is very mobile for a big man, he runs the floor very well and he can even drive, as he's got a nice first step. When he was coming out people weren't sure if he was going to become a traditional big man, because he can move like a small forward. He's got a long contract max contract, and he's making about $12 million a year. I doubt the Grizzlies would part with him, and I don't know the relationship between Mullin and West, though.

    More than likely to get Gasol we'd have to give up a package of Richardson and young talent (probably Ellis), because West is a very stubborn negotiator. I just don't see it happening, because even Mullin would say that's a lopsided deal.

    P.S. Yes I'm really slow at replying, I'm doing too many things at once.
     
  17. Fitch4Delk00

    Fitch4Delk00 JBB JustBBall Member

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    Whos the odd man out once J-Rich and B Diddy is back? Kelenna, Barnes, or Pietrus.
    Send kelenna back to the D-league or trade on of the others.
     
  18. Run BJM

    Run BJM Heavy lies the crown. Staff Member Global Moderator

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    As for the game in general...

    The refs were just awful, no surprise there really but it was very bad tonight. We got NOTHING and I mean nothing at all, I still think the team blew the game but if the refs called a fair game I think we would have squeaked by. Terrible.

    WTF was Barnes doing on that last play of regulation? The guy has Fisher syndrome, pass the fucking ball man, you're not Jordan, hell you're not even Mike Dunleavy Jr. so let someone else shoot the ball, you just focus on rebounding and playing defense.

    Sarunas to Andris connection is very nice, Rooney is pretty damn good on the pick and roll and made some very good passes. As long as hes not playing defense on someone who is lighting him up he's pretty solid. Can't wait to see him shut down MDJ when we play the Pacers.
     
  19. Run BJM

    Run BJM Heavy lies the crown. Staff Member Global Moderator

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    <div class="quote_poster">fitch4delk00 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Whos the odd man out once J-Rich and B Diddy is back? Kelenna, Barnes, or Pietrus.
    Send kelenna back to the D-league or trade on of the others.</div>

    Definitely Barnes IMO but if Jax can give us about 16 ppg, 6+ rpg, on good FG% and solid defense I think we should move JR for a big because they will be taking away from each other and JR will get us back more in a trade and hes less versatile (although a better scorer).
     
  20. Clif25

    Clif25 JBB JustBBall Member

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    I think Barnes is still very good. I will be honest that I don't have an answer to who the Warriors should keep or who the odd man out will be. I think that Barnes is still a good player for the team. No he should not be in the game late in the 4th period especially if he thinks he is in the role of being the main man. This can be seen by the last two games. But he is still pretty active, good at rebounding, he's a nice scorer and shooter. Maybe we got a little carried away with how he was scoring earlier. The Warriors needed to rely on Barnes previously and he showed up and did well when Monta and Jason were injured. I am not going to knock him down too much for his recent performances for not coming out as good as he had before. I still think he is a good player to have on this team, and it is not to any fault of Barnes' if he does become the odd-man out. I think he has done a lot and will definitley get a lot of looks from many teams if he isn't with the Warriors.

    Luckily the Warriors have a month to develop a plan for the trade deadline including what to do with Barnes/Pietrus/JRich/Azubuike/Major. Maybe the odd man out will be Jason Richardson like Run BJM said.
     

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