Pistons Enter Kobe Sweepstakes

Discussion in 'Los Angeles Lakers' started by Shapecity, Oct 25, 2007.

  1. Really Lost One

    Really Lost One Suspended

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Ed the Decider)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Am I the only one that thinks that Amir, Tay, Rip and a first is to much for Kobe?</p>

    </div></p>

    Yeah. It seems the type of team that will be okay, built around Billups, Kobe, and Sheed...but with a shelf life of about 1-2 years...and thats just at around 50-54 wins I'd think, which is definitely not a favorite to win the title. I think the Lakers might accept Prince/Hamilton, but Kobe might veto that.</p>

    Though, the more Kobe has lingering small injuries, plays unexpiring ball, the package will continue to be dragged down and down. A deal with the Bulls will have to take place after December 15th in reality (for Nocioni to be involved, Joe Smith, etc.).</p>

    A lot can change in that. If the Bulls are running away with first place, why would they make a trade? If Gordon is averaging around 25 PPG, and Kobe is averaging less than that, how do you justify including Gordon in a Kobe trade? That would make both Gordon/Deng untouchable. If Tyrus is starting to break out, they won't include him in a trade...he's a big man...big>small.</p>

    Lots of things will happen between now and December 15th...and come that date, the packages will probably look like:</p>

    Phoenix Suns: Shawn Marion + Barbosa
    Dallas Mavericks: Jason Terry + Josh Howard
    Chicago Bulls: Kirk Hinrich + Andres Nocioni + Joe Smith
    New York Knicks: Eddy Curry + Jamal Crawford
    Detroit Pistons: Richard Hamilton + Tayshaun Prince</p>

    I think Kobe will veto both the Knicks/Pistons scenarios. This situation is a complete mess. Lakers are going to continue to be a 38-42 win team with Kobe, with what they'll get in a trade for Kobe, they will likely be in the same range...with no prospects of rebuilding.</p>

    The Lakers simply waited too long. If they were proactive during the free agency period, they probably could have gotten Gordon, Thomas, Noah, and a sign and traded PJ Brown for Kobe. They would have had prospects, they would have then traded Odom to create capspace. Gone out, just handed Gordon the ball, tanked the year. Took their Derrick Rose with their top draft pick. With the right cost cutting moves, they could have created enough capspace to give Gordon a contract starting at 10 million (75 million over 6 years), and then signing two more max players.</p>

    Sign Josh Smith to fill their small forward void, and then say keep Elton Brand in hollywood...shifting teams.</p>

    The Lakers could be looking at a nice team, featuring:</p>

    PG-Derrick Rose/Derek Fisher
    SG-Ben Gordon/Javaris Crittenton
    SF-Josh Smith/Luke Walton
    PF-Elton Brand/Tyrus Thomas
    C- Andrew Bynum/Joakim Noah</p>

    Obviously its too late for such a scenario. Lakers management waited on this too long</div></p>

    Your posts are ridiculous. If those are the trades being offered for Kobe Bryant, we would be better off keeping him on the roster and letting him opt out of his contract in order to gain cap space. If you actually think you guys are going to get Kobe for Kirk Hinrich, Andres Nocioni, and Joe Smith, you are on some good stuff. Kirk Hinrich is a good player, but given how we already have Derek Fisher, Jordan Farmar, and Javaris Crittenton, all three of whom have been playing terrifically in the preseason, his services are not needed. We have enough point guards as it already is. I would rather have Gordon or Deng to be honest. Nocioni is a good ROLE player. Nothing more. He's also not even that young, and I highly doubt he's ever going to get any better than he is now. He is no deal breaker. He's certainly not someone I'd go around crapping my pants for.Joe Smith? Are you kidding me? The trade you proposed for Kobe is absolute high way robbery for the Bulls. And even if Mitch does agree to this deal, no way does the Buss family sign off. Do you have any clue how much money they would lose from that deal? There is nobody on that roster who will draw any sort of attendence to the crowd</p>
     
  2. Jumpman

    Jumpman And Your Nominees Are...

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticKing)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Yea I meant Amare plus others. If you had that offer on the table and the Bulls one, which would you take?</p>

    </div></p>

    I would take Amare and filler in a heartbeat. Same goes for Dwight Howard, but Kobe wouldn't want to go there. Then I use Bynum for trade bait.</p>

    </p>
     
  3. Really Lost One

    Really Lost One Suspended

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    A duo of Amare Stoudimire and Andrew Bynum in the future does sound pretty good to me. Certainly better than some Hinrich, Nocioni, and Joe Smith crap</p>
     
  4. Dark Hero

    Dark Hero Can't Tell Me Nothing

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    Amare and fillers for Kobe?Hell yeah would I do that trade in a heartbaet.But you guys realize that Kobe/Marion/Nash would be in control of the West for a long ass time.</p>
     
  5. Clangus

    Clangus BBW Elite Member

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    i just wish tey would make something happen. i'm sick of the rumors with nothing appening.</p>
     
  6. Jumpman

    Jumpman And Your Nominees Are...

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dark Hero)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Amare and fillers for Kobe?Hell yeah would I do that trade in a heartbaet.But you guys realize that Kobe/Marion/Nash would be in control of the West for a long ass time.</p>

    </div></p>

    Yeah, that's the point. We'd go into rebuilding mode and have a young frontcourt in Bynum and Amare.</p>

    </p>

    </p>
     
  7. DynastYWarrioR6

    DynastYWarrioR6 JBB SmurfY

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    I'm in consensus with everyone, Amare + Fillers sounds nice right about now lol</p>
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Bulls may be out of the running for Kobe. Tonight, Wallace and Thomas and Noah left the game with injuries.</p>

    </p>
     
  9. member 20000

    member 20000 Member

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    Shape, where did you hear the rumor about Nocioni AND Deng, plus Gordon? That is the biggest load of crap I've ever read, it's one or the other...The Lakers are rumored to covet Nocioni more than Deng, as well. The Bulls won't gut their team for Kobe, it'll be Nocioni or Deng, Gordon, and someone else and some picks.</p>
     
  10. Really Lost One

    Really Lost One Suspended

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    Yeah, and why the hell would the Lakers choose Nocioni over Gordon and Deng.</p>
     
  11. Денг Гордон

    Денг Гордон Member

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    Maybe the Lakers think Nocioni is a good talent. Not necesarily better than Deng, but acceptable at the very least.</p>

    Nocioni scored at a better rate than Deng in preseason.</p>

    Last year, Nocioni was averaging 15.9 PPG 6.3 RPG in 28 MPG. Deng was averaging 17.9 PPG 6.5 RPG in 36 MPG. Deng shot 56.9 TS% in this time, while Nocioni shot 59.1 TS%.</p>

    The Lakers probably see Nocioni as a 20 PPG scorer post trade.</p>
     
  12. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (member 20000)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Shape, where did you hear the rumor about Nocioni AND Deng, plus Gordon? That is the biggest load of crap I've ever read, it's one or the other...The Lakers are rumored to covet Nocioni more than Deng, as well. The Bulls won't gut their team for Kobe, it'll be Nocioni or Deng, Gordon, and someone else and some picks.</p>

    </div></p>

    It was reported on a radio show out here. The host is a native of Chicago and actually has some good sources within the Bulls organization. There's no way the Lakers covet Nocioni over Deng sounds like a Sam Smith fabrication to me.</p>

    Deng + Gordon or Hinrich + Noc does sound farfetched, but I'm just the messenger here.</p>

    The offers I've heard have been centered around the Lakers receiving either Big Ben or Deng plus fillers in return for Kobe. Originally the Lakers wanted Big Ben, but Kobe said he doesn't want to go to Chicago unless Wallace is there. So the Lakers asked for Deng and now Paxson has said he's untouchable. This puts the deal at an impasse for now.</p>

    As for the Amare trade, I'd go for it in a heartbeat aswell. It will be tough to watch Nash-Kobe-Marion make a run at it, but I think they'd have a short window based on Nash's age and the possibility of Marion opting out. If he doesn't like the lack of attention now, just imagine how little he'll get with Kobe in town.</p>

    The Lakers should still make the playoffs with a frontline of Bynum-Amare-Odom, that's beastly right there.</p>

    </p>

    </p>
     
  13. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Maybe the Lakers think Nocioni is a good talent. Not necesarily better than Deng, but acceptable at the very least.</p>

    Nocioni scored at a better rate than Deng in preseason.</p>

    Last year, Nocioni was averaging 15.9 PPG 6.3 RPG in 28 MPG. Deng was averaging 17.9 PPG 6.5 RPG in 36 MPG. Deng shot 56.9 TS% in this time, while Nocioni shot 59.1 TS%.</p>

    The Lakers probably see Nocioni as a 20 PPG scorer post trade.</p>

    </div></p>

    Those are great stats and makes a lot more sense if the Lakers are focusing on winning NOW. However, if they trade Kobe they will be going with a youth movement and at 22, Deng would be the target.</p>

    </p>
     
  14. Денг Гордон

    Денг Гордон Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shapecity)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BG7 Lavigne)</div><div class='quotemain'></p>

    Maybe the Lakers think Nocioni is a good talent. Not necesarily better than Deng, but acceptable at the very least.</p>

    Nocioni scored at a better rate than Deng in preseason.</p>

    Last year, Nocioni was averaging 15.9 PPG 6.3 RPG in 28 MPG. Deng was averaging 17.9 PPG 6.5 RPG in 36 MPG. Deng shot 56.9 TS% in this time, while Nocioni shot 59.1 TS%.</p>

    The Lakers probably see Nocioni as a 20 PPG scorer post trade.</p>

    </div></p>

    Those are great stats and makes a lot more sense if the Lakers are focusing on winning NOW. However, if they trade Kobe they will be going with a youth movement and at 22, Deng would be the target.</p>

    </p>

    </div></p>

    Of course Deng (and Gordon) make more sense than Nocioni. But that doesn't matter if you can't get them, which appears to be the case.</p>

    </p>
     
  15. Run BJM

    Run BJM Heavy lies the crown. Staff Member Global Moderator

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    I think the Detroit deal makes the most sense. No way in hell is any team trading away a good, young 20/10 big man for Kobe either. The whole point of Kobe changing situations is that he can paly with another star, preferrably a big man, so trading off a stud post player for Kobe wouldn't do any good. As awesome as Kobe is I think most teams would much rather keep their big man and go after a run of the mill 2 guard who can score 20 ppg, they are pretty abundant in this league.</p>

    A deal of Rip, Tayshaun, Amir Johnson, and a 1st round pick for Kobe would be good for both teams. The Lakers get two borderline all-stars and a promising young PF to pair with Bynum in the future plus their team will remain competitive. Detroit gets back into the running for a championship by adding arguably the best player in the game to put alongside a core of Chauncy, Sheed, Maxiel, McDyess, Stuckey, possibly Webber if he re-signs. Kobe is exactly what Detroit needs to counter Wade and LeBron who always kill them in the playoffs.</p>

    Amare for Kobe is unlikely IMO. I don't think either team wants to trade their stars within the division and if Phoenix didn't trade Amare for KG I doubt they would move him for Kobe. Who would the Suns play at PF/C? Marion would be one starter their but who else? Boris Diaw, Skinner, Sean MArks? I don't see it happening.</p>
     
  16. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    The Detroit deal is fair, but I don't agree about it making sense. Rip Hamilton is the same age as Kobe and Tayshaun Prince would be in his late twenties by the time Bynum develops into a dominant center (assuming he ever does). Is Amir Johnson any better than Ronny Turiaf?</p>

    The Lakers need to go young and cheap if they trade Kobe and maybe spend a couple of seasons in the lottery to stockpile talent and continue to build a foundation around Bynum.</p>

    Acquiring Rip and Tayshaun would keep the team competitive, but keeping Kobe also keeps the team competitive so it's a wash. I do think Rip and Prince would be fantastic in the Triangle though, especially Rip and his mid-range game.</p>
     

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