Warriors draft Ekpe Udoh with 6th pick

Discussion in 'Golden State Warriors' started by Run BJM, Jun 24, 2010.

  1. HiRez

    HiRez Overlord

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    From CBS: Grade D. "Analysis: With Anthony Randolph, Brandan Wright and Udoh, the Warriors have taken the power out of the power forward position."
     
  2. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Riley saying that makes me mad. Why would you play Udoh at the 5 when you already have AB, Tolliver, Turiaf, Hunter and Gadzuric. Udoh needs to complement those players, not replace them. It means we keep AB because we need some veteran players to pair with young ones.

    The Udoh pick should upset AR and BW, especially AR. Riley had told AR that he wasn't trying to trade him. Larry Riley is full of BS and is another in a long line of horrilbe Warrior GMs.
     
  3. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Grade D for doh!

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Clif10

    Clif10 Member

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    Riley said this pick could play spot minutes at the five. I don't think he was suggesting a lot there except with Nelson as head coach any forward on the roster can play minutes as the five.

    Without knowing any of the prospects I think it is good the warriors added someone that has the hopes of being able to contribute defensively and on the boards. I am not too concerned with taking pt from Wright because if history repeats itself it won't take long for him to be injured again.
     
  5. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    I'm trying to be positive, but Udoh would've been okay as the #11 pick. The BAP at #6 was Greg Monroe! That combination of b-ball skills and size was too hard to pass up. He would have been a great fit at the 5 with the Warriors and made AB expendable. New Orleans was considering Ekpe Udoh at #11.

    Here's what Monty Williams of the Hornets had to say about Udoh:
    [video=youtube;TLNyGcs1Bm8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLNyGcs1Bm8&feature=related[/video]

    At center, Gadzuric could be a nice expiring, and we could offer shotblocker Turiaf in a trade, too.

    And why did Larry Riley tell Anthony Randolph that he was not looking to trade him? Wouldn’t Riley give AR and BW more of a chance than a new PF?

    Riley did not work hard enough to trade down. There were several teams that wanted to trade up. The management of this team is a disaster. They all need to go now!
     
  6. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    I had a night to sleep on the pick. I've been reading the comments by Riley on why they made the pick and I can't argue with them.

    1) Udoh was the best player available. Who are we, the fans, to know who the best player was? We all thought Monroe was but apparently, the staff thought otherwise. The point of the draft is to pick the best player available and if the Warriors thought they did this then good for them.

    2) The Warriors were unable to move up or down in the draft because either the top 5 wouldn't budge or the teams with the lower picks didn't offer a fair deal to the Warriors. The former I believe because this was pretty much a consensus 5 player draft. After 5, it was a coin-flip. The latter statement is a little open-ended. We don't know what the Warriors truly considered fair. Riley said that they're not having a fire sale and that if they're going to trade Monta or Biedrins, they're looking to acquire equal talent back, not just to dump salaries. So if they took this same philosophy for wanting to trading down in the draft and couldn't acquire a player in addition to the draft pick, then good for them. They stuck by their guns and took what they felt was the best player available. According to Marcus Thompson, they weren't willing to trade down for just the pick and cash, for example.

    3) The Warriors' glaring holes are defense, rebounding, and size. Udoh's a defense first player. I'm not sure about rebounding, but he seems to have a more NBA-ready body than Randolph and Wright and definitely has the length. They wanted their draft pick to be able to contribute immediately. They took a seasoned college player who apparently has high basketball IQ and an overall skillset. They also feel he is more athletic than Greg Monroe. By drafting Monroe, they would have a high-post passing big man. Not a defensive stopper down low. I cannot argue with this reasoning.

    4) The Warriors didn't want to draft another 18 - 20 year old with "upside." We have too many of those players and those players haven't shown us enough. The Udoh pick directly conflicts with the futures of AR and BW. But, AR and BW haven't proven they deserve significant PT (debatable for AR, I know). Again, if the idea was to draft a player, not by position, who could contribute right away regardless of what current players we have, then good for the Warriors. They didn't worry about hurting anyone's feelings. It sends a message of urgency to AR and BW that they need to be healthy and be productive. However, I see this draft pick igniting a couple trades as there's simply no way there's enough minutes for Udoh, AR, BW, AB, RT, and DG. And I hate the idea of Udoh, AR, and BW playing center unless it's for very short spurts of time. We all know we're going to see it unless AR or BW is traded.

    So, what do you think guys? Here's what ESPN said about the pick:

    Analysis: I like Ekpe Udoh and so do a lot of NBA scouts and general managers. But taking him at No. 6 felt like a major reach, especially when you consider the Warriors' current roster. In previous years, the Warriors have selected Brandan Wright and Anthony Randolph in the lottery -- both, like Udoh, are thin, athletic players who can rebound and run the floor. Udoh may be more polished than Wright and Randolph. He's an accomplished shot-blocker and rebounder and he has a more sophisticated offensive game. But he's also already 23 years old, while Wright is just 22 and Randolph is only 20. Given all that, and given the uncertainty in the Warriors organization, Udoh looks like a classic candidate to disappoint.
     
  7. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    The scouts in OKC, HOU and SA all were high on Udoh. I think that's a positive for what they see in his abilities to contribute on the court.
     
  8. philsmith75

    philsmith75 JBB JustBBall Member

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    Those guys were also picking in the 20's.

    Maybe it was the right pick, finally someone who can play defense. Maybe so. Okay I'm backing off some.
     
  9. Legacy

    Legacy Beast

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    LOL
     
  10. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    Maybe they were high on him enough to try to trade up?
     
  11. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    That's about exactly how I felt before draft night. I put him in the same boat as Cole Aldrich -- potential NBDL players.

    As far as our current roster, I mean, you look at Anthony Randolph's upside, and Ekpe Udoh's upside, you have a potential Lamar Odom/Kevin Garnett hybrid, and a potential Malik Rose/Nazr Mohammed hybrid. I'll let you figure out who fits which mold better.

    At least Monroe has more to build on/grow on. I just can't project Udoh's ceiling much higher than decent but slow back-up undersized big man, if that even makes sense. Monroe, on the other hand, who knows, but isn't it fair to put his ceiling as potential all-star?

    Oh well. Udoh was not BAP according to just about every NBA voice. Almost all boards had him behind Monroe and Aminu, as I did myself. Although I'm actually not to enamored with Aminu anymore. But I'd definitely have taken Monroe.

    Point is, though, probably every Team had Udoh at #8-#12, so why reach at #6 when you don't even have to draft for need anyway because your whole team sucks? You should have taken BAP or traded down. Oh well.

    Let's hope Udoh becomes a stud. I guess it's possible.
     
  12. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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  13. Doctor Kajita

    Doctor Kajita Active Member

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    Check out some of these videos on Udoh. There's not much out there but I like his tenacity and energy:

    [video=youtube;ZOf661ENT0k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOf661ENT0k[/video]

    [video=youtube;8tcyM7_JDX8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tcyM7_JDX8[/video]

    [video=youtube;nsEkuOt1mhg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nsEkuOt1mhg[/video]

    He seems to be a pretty good passer and he's smart underneath the basket. He uses angles and pump fakes.
     
  14. philsmith75

    philsmith75 JBB JustBBall Member

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    Best thing I saw was him block a shot with his left hand; that's a small fundamental point that gets you quicker to the ball.
     
  15. AlleyOop

    AlleyOop JBB JustBBall Member

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    After watching those first 2 videos I'm thinking "damn" we should have drafted his teammate Quincy Acy over him lol
     
  16. jason bourne

    jason bourne JBB JustBBall Member

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    Okay, I'll play devil's advocate, Doc :).

    In this case, most people had pegged Greg Monroe @ #6 as BAP. I dare you to say you didn't and had Udoh on a stack of bibles. Udoh was wanted by New Orleans @ #11, but he was slotted to go anywhere from 6 - 9. We, as fans, can watch college games, video clips and read analysis on the players, but where a potential pick falls usually is derived by some kind of consensus expert opinion. Otherwise, how can any one person judge talent from around the world and try to peg them whether they are in the top 10, top 11 - 20, top 21 - 30, and so on. That's why if you thought Paul George was the best pick after the top 5, it would behoove you to try and move down or work a trade. The way the trade was going down, there were plenty of teams trying to move up. Surely, Riley was getting calls from other GMs once they saw Greg Monroe was available.

    Anyway, I'll give you Riley may have not have liked any of those deals, but I wonder. What I question most about Riley is what was he trying to do with his draft strategy and his plan for improving the Warriors? Most of what we have been hearing and seeing is that he is dumping salaries instead of getting players. Where in the flock is his strategy to get us the freakin' players???!!!???!!! He mentioned Chris Bosh one time, but we haven't heard much in this development since, but we've heard a lot about trading AB and Monta. Mostly, we're getting more expiring garbage for them!!!

    With the draft, we had two picks, but stooge Larry Riley traded the second for cash considerations and then for Corey Maggette and expiring contracts. I have already pointed out that the Warriors need some veteran players and young, potential all-stars in order to compete. Getting rid of salaries was fine, but now he has to make up for the production lost with Maggette. Before that, he had to make up for the loss of the other vets he got rid of. He hasn't brought enough talent in return, but he's done a great job of dumping salaries. Riley had a chance to get good players with the expiring contracts he let expire during the last trading period. WTF!!!???!!!???

    At #6, most experts had Greg Monroe as the BAP. The Warriors have sent signals out that they were willing to trade AB, so Monroe would have been the center they needed in addition to being the BAP. Riley has said he wants a center who's willing to defend, clog the middle, rebound and play defense. He had those in Andris Biedrins, so I don't get why is he trying to trade him then? The only answer seems to be in order to dump salary. Furthermore, Monroe is a player who fits what Nelson is trying to do and is a Nelson-type player -- an offensive, high post, passing big man and who can initiate a rebound and fast break. It's a hell of a time for Riley to decide Nelson is on his way out and try to put his vision of the team up :p.

    A coin flip is fifty-fifty. One would have been Monroe, but the other could have been one of Aminu, Udoh and Aldrich based on experts.

    Again, if the Warriors are not having a fire sale, then where are the players we got in return? Devean George? Radman? Raja Bell? Where is the beef? Larry Riley is a liar! It looks more like a fire sale. :lol:

    Monroe is bigger, but is more an offensive player and Nelson player. It's a hell of a time to start to focus on defense! So you mean to tell me that if Cousins was available at #6, we still would take Udoh based on this strategy? It's no secret that Riley is getting rid of Mullin players and dumping salaries. What he hasn't done is gotten us all-stars or young, potential all-stars in trade. This is his big failure. The Warriors W-L record speaks volumes! Larry Riley's performance to date speaks volumes! IT SUCKS!!!!!!

    Riley's excuses for taking a 23-year old are ridiculous. With a 23-year old, we're getting limited upside. What you see is what you get. We took AB at 18 and had time to develop him. So now you're saying he's a bust? Or what about AR? He's been here two years and has shown potential, but he doesn't get adequate or consistent PT. Like duh. Big men take longer to develop, so we should be getting ready to go with them instead of trying to trade them. Another huge fail for stooge Riley.

    I read what Riley said and the reported trade rumors of AB and AR. It would mean one or both are on the trading block since they are both Mullin picks. Riley said he's not trying to trade AR, but AR is the most likely player other teams would want! Had Riley gone with the BAP and picked Monroe, it would quash the AR trade rumors and be more in line with his trading AB.

    Bah. If we took Aminu, you could post a lot of ESPN stuff about him.

    We should have took Greg Monroe and here are my reasons why besides Monroe's obvious talents. I already posted those already and won't repeat them here, but look at where Monroe played -- Georgetown. Georgetown has shown it produces quality NBA bigs. A lot of Big East teams do, but Georgetown's record is impeccable. One cannot compare Greg Monroe to Patrick Ewing, Alonzo Mourning or Dikembe Mutombo, but recently, Roy Hibbert was considered a lesser prospect than Monroe, and Hibbert has developed nicely into one of the better young centers in the league. History would be on Monroe's side.

    Look at what Monroe's coach John Thompson III has to say:
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dy...4/AR2010062406992.html?wprss=rss_print/sports
     
  17. i hate the warriors

    i hate the warriors Slingboxing from LONDON

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    I read this on another forum:::::

    hey Warrior fans. I'm a diehard Baylor fan and I wanted to tell you what you are getting in Ekpe Udoh. I watched every second of every game that he played this past year. I think you will be extremely pleased with this pick.

    There is a story that sums up what Ekpe is all about that took place in his transfer year from Michigan to Baylor. Ekpe was usually the first guy in the gym and the last one to turn the lights out. There was a blow-up in the weight room between a coach and a player. The player threw a fit and started throwing weights off the racks and emptied all the weights. While everyone left the weight room, Ekpe quietly went around and put all the weights back up. Just a little thing, but it demonstrates the kind of character he has. He leads by example. And this is contagious to a team in a positive way.

    On the basketball court:

    Pros:

    Understanding of the game is outstanding. He sees the whole court and is always thinking one or two plays ahead.

    Great passer from the post and also from the top of the key.

    He handles the ball very well. Baylor used him a lot to attack the basket from the top of the key. They also used him to break the press and he was very effective in this role- usually finding the weakness in the press and attacking it with his passing or dribbling.

    Solid rebounder- he will not overpower people with his strength. He is also not a terrific leaper. But he is very long and knows how to use his length to be in good position to get rebounds.

    Terrific shot blocker. He doesn't block shots like Dwight Howard. He usually just gets a small piece of a shot. He has great understanding of how to bother shooters. He is extremely disruptive on defense. Perhaps the greatest example of this is Baylor's defensive FG percentage. Before Ekpe, Baylor had a reputation of being a poor defensive team. Ekpe helped improve Baylor's defensive FG % by around 6% from 44% to 38%.

    He's clutch- for example his best games were in the NCAA tourney when Baylor needed it the most. He had a strong game against good bigs for Duke. Ekpe had 18 pts; 10 rebounds; 6 assists; 5 blocks; 1 turnover against Duke in the Elite 8 game.

    Professionalism- he's a lunch pail guy. This is more important in the NBA. He doesn't take nights/plays off. He keeps his emotions in check for the most part. But he just grinds it out day by day.

    Post moves- great footwork. Can finish with either hand. Very patient to get the best shot. Certainly nowhere near as strong as Tim Duncan, but he will remind you of Tim Duncan in the way that he is not in a hurry. He works until he gets the right shot opportunity or until he can set up a teammate for an easy shot.

    Cons:

    Strength- he struggled in the post against top tier talent. During the stretch of games, he often had trouble finishing. In fairness to him, he worked so hard on defense and was double teamed so often that he just didn't have enough gas in the tank at the end of tough games. This won't be an issue in the pros as much because he's not a guy that will be drawing double teams.

    Closing out on shooters on the perimeter. I often felt like he gave too much space to 3 point shooters when he played on the baseline in Baylor's match-up zone. He is an excellent man to man defender and did a much better job staying close to shooters in M-2-M. It was almost like in the zone, he felt like his job was to deny everything 18 feet and in and allowed shooters too much space in the corners.

    Athleticism- as stated earlier. He's not a great athlete, but he's the type of player you expect to see on the Boston Celtics or Utah Jazz. He'll drive opponents crazy because they will think they should be dominating him athletically, but he's too smart and too skilled to be embarrassed by a more athletic opponent.

    I would be glad to answer any questions. Congrats- you got an outstanding player and human being.
     
  18. philsmith75

    philsmith75 JBB JustBBall Member

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    Like the story about the weight room.
     
  19. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    The only downside is Nellie has never had success developing a front line player. He needs to go.
     
  20. Run BJM

    Run BJM Heavy lies the crown. Staff Member Global Moderator

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    That Baylor fan's opinion is pretty much what I think of him. I just re-watched Duke-Baylorhere. I had also seen him in a few other tourney games but obviously I wasn't as focused on him the whole game. He is an AMAZING shot blocker and looks like a damn good defender in general. Looks a little weak but he has to go up against Zoubek all night because Lomers is injured. Defensive rebounding doesn't look good for the same reason- hes mostly boxing out Zoubek and is pinned down while other Baylor players gather up boards. He gets a lot of offensive rebounds. Offensively, Baylor NEVER runs pick and rolls. Udoh gets the ball on the block with mixed success and they do use him facing up and on the perimiter. At the end of the first half they give him the ball 35 feet from the rim with 13 seconds left to facilitate the final possession.

    As I said leading up to the draft I think Udoh has a more traditional offensive repetoire than Monroe. Monroe's inside game is extremely awkward and he really doesn't get any space from his defender. I can't see that translating. Dude can barely dunk and hes 6'11. Also Udoh has a decent mid-range J from what I hear while Monroe really doesn't (though it seems like people assume he does because hes a finesse guy.The Duncan comparison is fuckin ridiculous but Udoh's got the fundamental baby hooks, he does throw a lot of pump fakes and up and unders but he knows he can't convert like Duncan so if the defender doesn't bite he usually makes a (very good) pass and doesn't force it. His moves are fundamentally sound but he doesn't actually have shot-making ability like Duncan. I haven't noticed how good he is with both hands but so far I don't see one hand being weaker than the other. Udoh makes some VERY impressive passes. Not only on the interior but he also makes really good skip passes to the perimeter for open 3 point shooters. People seem to think Monroe is the better prospect but, like I've been saying, does he really do anything better than Udoh besides pass? Hes not as good of a shooter, has a poor off hand, doesn't have any fundamental moves in the post, doesn't have as good of a J, poor athlete, considered to be soft, not much of a rebounder, probably not going to change many shots. Hes big and hes a good passer. After that Udoh is more of a prototype PF.

    Athletically hes very mobile and seems like he can keep up with some big 3s even. Hes not as explosive as Randolph/Wright but he has excellent timing and foresight and he can get up pretty high- he just won't have that violent explosiveness and ability to make fast, strong second jumps like Randolph/Wright.

    Obviously he doesn't project out as a guy who will put up 20 ppg to me. He does, however seem like a glue-guy type of PF. He prides himself on his defense and it really is amazing to see him make plays around the rim on defense. He blocked every one of Zoubek's shots in one on one situations in the Duke game and had another on-ball block on some other Dukie and a few more help defense blocks. Countless other times he changed shots. His instincts in that regard are great. Rebounding wise I fear he could be another Turiaf/Wright where hes poor on defensive rebounding. Looks like a good offensive rebounder. I don't think hes got the natural scoring ability to put up big numbers but next to Curry he could do great. Like I said hes not automatic around the rim but hes got a nice baby hook, seems difficult to block his shots, hes got a decent J out to 18 feet according to that Monty Williams interview, hes a better passer and ball handler than hes given credit for. He'll keep the ball moving if its not there for him. If it is, he can shoot or finish. On defense you know hes going to work his ass off and play soundly.

    Check out his gamelog guys. Its pretty impressive and its against good competition. Also I see some of you guys ragging on Baylor but they were GREAT this past season and Udoh was their best player and the crux of their team. They made the elite 8 and lost a close game to eventual champs Duke. Udoh has the 14/10 on a stacked college team but he also put up nearly 3 apg and 4 bpg. Check out some of those games that you can see on the link I posted and see what you think.
     

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