Politics Transgender in the military

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by SlyPokerDog, Jul 26, 2017.

  1. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    116,223
    Likes Received:
    114,263
    Trophy Points:
    115
  2. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    116,223
    Likes Received:
    114,263
    Trophy Points:
    115
    Last year, the Obama administration lifted the ban on allowing transgender troops to serve openly.

    Under the policy set by then-Defense Secretary Ash Carter, transgender troops also receive coverage for any treatment deemed medically necessary by their doctors, including surgery and hormone therapy.

    That step left a decision for Trump Secretary of Defense James Mattis to make a decision on whether to allow new transgender troops to enter the military.

    It wasn't immediately clear what Trump's announcement would mean for the approximately 250 transgender people now serving openly in the U.S. military.



    Trump’s decision is a huge blow the LGBT community, which was just coming off a win after the surprising defeat of an amendment to the annual defense policy bill that would have banned Pentagon funding from being used for transition-related medical care.


    But under the policy Carter crafted, transgender recruits weren’t allowed to enlist pending the end of a one-year implementation period.

    That was supposed to end July 1. But the night before the change was to go into effect, Defense Secretary James Mattis issued a six-month delay in the policy to study the issue more.

    In a memo explaining the delay, Mattis insisted that his decision does not “change policies and procedures currently in effect.”

    Mattis also promised during his confirmation hearing that he wouldn’t reverse his predecessor’s decisions unless a service chief brings him hard evidence the policy is having a negative effect.

    LGBT advocates were worried immediately after the election that Trump would roll back the transgender policy, which he has the power to do unilaterally since it is not a law.

    They breathed a sigh of relief after Mattis’ confirmation hearing, but have since been fighting on issues such as the enlistment policy and medical care.

    Earlier this month, the House voted 209-214 against banning Pentagon funding from being used for transition-related care. Twenty-four Republicans joined with Democrats to defeat the amendment to the annual defense policy bill.

    Mattis opposed the amendment, confirming he called its sponsor, Rep. Vicky Hartzler (R-Mo.), at least once on the issue.

    But some Republicans hoped to have a second chance, filing several similar amendments to the spending bill coming to the House floor Wednesday.

    The Rules Committee finalized Tuesday night which amendments will get a vote on the House floor. None of the transgender-related amendments made it in.

    http://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...or-ban-on-transgender-individuals-in-military
     
  3. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,957
    Likes Received:
    10,620
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
    I saw this and it's disgraceful.

    Either the people we hire for the military can kick enemy ass or not. That should be the criteria. Character does matter, too, but this isn't that kind of issue.
     
    dviss1, Sweetriverphil, H.C. and 7 others like this.
  4. Sedatedfork

    Sedatedfork Rip City Rhapsody

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2008
    Messages:
    7,936
    Likes Received:
    4,322
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Seattle
    Trump is the one that made this decision. Instead he tries to deflect, making it seem like the generals made the decision.
     
  5. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,957
    Likes Received:
    10,620
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
  6. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    42,401
    Likes Received:
    29,999
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    singer songwriter
    Location:
    Washington
    and I'm proud to be an American, let's go back to Nineteen Fifty...where if you don't agree with me, I can hang you from a tree...

    And I'll gladly stand up, next to you...as long as you're not LGBT....
     
    Minstrel likes this.
  7. crandc

    crandc Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    18,141
    Likes Received:
    23,374
    Trophy Points:
    113
    But the gays love Trump, he will be the most pro gay president in history.
     
  8. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    116,223
    Likes Received:
    114,263
    Trophy Points:
    115
    At least the gays in the military debate seems to be over. What did that take, 20 years? Maybe we can settle the transgender debate in half that.
     
  9. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    116,223
    Likes Received:
    114,263
    Trophy Points:
    115
  10. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    31,952
    Likes Received:
    40,229
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Silly question--what "tremendous medical costs" is he talking about? If he's going to identify that as his reasoning, should he at least try to back up that claim somehow? Is he saying that by permitting transgenders, the US government would be responsible for all their gender conversion procedures, and they're just not willing to support those? Are there other medical issues that don't impact competence to serve but similarly disqualify people from military service? Do they permit diabetics to serve in the military? Smokers? People with HIV? Don't all of those come with "tremendous medical costs" as well?
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2017
  11. riverman

    riverman Writing Team

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2013
    Messages:
    66,303
    Likes Received:
    64,441
    Trophy Points:
    113
    His playbook is throw emotional shit at the wall and see if any sticks...then backtrack if it doesn't...over and over and over.....Trump is not a fan of homework or research.
     
  12. EL PRESIDENTE

    EL PRESIDENTE Username Retired in Honor of Lanny.

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2010
    Messages:
    50,346
    Likes Received:
    22,528
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Damn, no more Chelsea Mannings!
     
  13. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,060
    Likes Received:
    9,014
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Per our training, any medical procedures incurred if a sailor wishes gender reassignment (everything from counseling to full-blown medical procedures) are the responsibility of the government. During the transition time the sailor is required to maintain their gender of birth. Only their assigned medical representative can deem when the transition is complete. During the transition, personnel may be placed in a limited duty status if medically required.
    As for other medical procedures, having sleep apnea is a deployment-disqualifying event (and subject to medical discharge) due to the "extreme costs" involved with being able to supply and maintain CPAP machines in a combat zone. Asthma is a similar condition whereby asthmatics are not permitted to enlist. Everything is subject to a waiver, of course, but they are not generally given.
    Now, for already-Transgendered personnel who wish to enlist? No idea.
     
    Dougnsalem, Jade Falcon, Nate and 2 others like this.
  14. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    31,952
    Likes Received:
    40,229
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good info--thank you.
     
  15. santeesioux

    santeesioux Just keep on scrolling by

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    10,720
    Likes Received:
    5,273
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Trolling the internet
    Location:
    Southern Oregon
    I don't see why it should matter what you are as long as you pass everything and don't hold your team back in the field.
     
    stampedehero and SlyPokerDog like this.
  16. SlyPokerDog

    SlyPokerDog Woof! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2008
    Messages:
    116,223
    Likes Received:
    114,263
    Trophy Points:
    115
    I was wondering about this.
     
  17. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,280
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    Well this is interesting. Everyone on the board in support of taking Trans-gender people into the military.
    The universal support certainly makes all of you sensitive people.

    So at the risk of being less sensitive, let me ask why the US Military "Needs" to do this to create the best force on earth when recruitment goals are met without doing so?

    Why would we Take Transgender people that want treatment into the military, while at the same time rejecting people that require too much dental work?

    How does the presence of Transgender people improve the combat efficiency of any unit they are assigned too?

    Can a Transgender person perform at a high level while under Transgender therapy? Or recovering from Surgery?

    If you were sending a relief squad into Benghazi to extract the Ambassador and the Consulate personnel, would it be beneficial to have a Transgender in therapy in the squad?
    Should the mission commander have to consider the possibilities of the above question?
     
    Jade Falcon likes this.
  18. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    42,401
    Likes Received:
    29,999
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    singer songwriter
    Location:
    Washington
    Wow, you have so little idea how peoples minds work, don't you?
     
    illmatic99 likes this.
  19. MarAzul

    MarAzul LongShip

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2008
    Messages:
    21,370
    Likes Received:
    7,280
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Life is good!
    Location:
    Near Bandon Oregon
    Ha! My mind? Or yours? I am not running for congress.
    Enlighten me please.
     
  20. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,156
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    If transgender people want to serve, let them.

    I am curious though, what is the cost of the surgery/process for the government? And really, not just the cost, but how many people could possibly be requesting it? Even if the surgery was expensive, I can't imagine there's a huge line of people getting gender reassignment surgery in the military.

    This just seems like an excuse to oppress these people.
     
    stampedehero likes this.

Share This Page