Nurk was pushing the ball up from what I saw of the bubble, but even when he did, they'd all just stop and go back into their normal sets... They run everything through their guards... So maybe it doesn't matter if Zach works on the other skills...
They tried a few times to run some offense through Nurk but there is basically little to no cutters, back screens, or off ball movement so it's wasting his passing ability to not have avenues to pass out of it. Super frustrating.
I admit, at my age, my memory is not what it once was. But I can't recall a "impact performance" from Zach. Ever. Keeping in mind, that what I define as "impactful" may not be the same definition as yours. I admit, he's an NBA player, every dog has its day. But my memory tells me, whenever he is much needed to make a play, (or even "play") he disappears. Or is on the bench in foul trouble. Like I said earlier. I DO remember cheering and rooting for ML. Always believed in the guy,..." next year will be his breakout, you watch!" Nope. Not doin' that again.
Guys still young and has a lot to work on, but I know he is a very hard worker and does everything the coaches ask. If somebody were to ask me if I ever remembered a game he made an impact in, this one comes to mind.
Why do we need two ball handling and passing bigs? Nurkic is already a good passer and solid ball handler for a C. I don't think we need 5 ball handlers on the court.
If you think Zach is Meyers Leonard, you're not paying attention to anything other than their skin color.
You're underrating what having proper role players does for a team. People wish he was a 15/10 guy who played no defense, but then they complain about how we have no defenders.
Nurkic has only shown the ball handling part for a few games in the bubble (that I saw). Their other forwards are guys who are looking for their own shot most of the time, or Zach. Right now the ball is in the guard's hands way too much, and then most of their actions are running laps on the parameter (I know this is hyperbolic)... They could run the offense more through Nurk and that would probably work too, but they don't.
Career arc has nothing to do with pigmentation or style of play. All the excuses and rationalizations won't make Collins a player to build around. Nor do I trust NO on the subject of extensions.
actually, defensive rebounding rate, winshares, BPM, and VORP do include defense as part of the equation it's a very small sample size, but DBPM this season: at least Zach is better than CJ and Melo. But last season is a fairer gauge: he was tied with Meyers and of course, there are two ends of the floor: 8 Blazers with positive BPM's and 10 higher than -1.0 and Zach was one of them as for DRPM last season, when you toss out guys who played less than 30 games, Zach was 23rd among PF's with a DRPM of 0.99 PF's who ranked higher included Thon Maker, Mason Plumlee, Maxi Kleber, Ed Davis, Anthony Tolliver, Domantas Sabonis, Ersan Ilyasova, Frank Kaminski, Aaron Gordon, JaMychal Green, and Thaddeus Young there were also 15 C's who ranked higher including Aaron Baynes, Jakob Poeltl, Nikola Vucevic, and Ante Zizic as I've been saying, Zach is a role player who hasn't even reached the level of Harkless or Aminu yet. Maybe all you Zach fans will eventually be proven right, and his critics proven wrong, but currently, you guys seem to be seeing a lot more 'potential' than reality. The only reason Zach was named the starter before the season, IMO, is because Olshey made sure there was nobody on the team that could beat him out for that role. Olshey has done that before
Collins has some fundamental issues that he can work on but the raw talent is there. Needs to clean up the ball handling skills. He effects the rebounding numbers in a big way. Maybe not so much by getting the rebound as much as boxing out and making it so others can. Impact on the floor is not always on box score. He also has a motor that won't quit. People forget about his energy. My bet is if you trade or replace Zach Collins at this point every Blazer fan will regret it. To the one poster that is calling him garbage we will consider the source....
They include defense as part of the equation but that doesnt mean the accurately reflect defensive ability. You think I dont know what DBPM means? C'mon. You overvalue stats, and often times cherry-pick them to fit your argument. The discussion is rarely about basketball, it's about numbers. Paragraphs and paragraphs of numbers. It sounds fancy and smart, but it doesnt change the following for me: - John Collins is a terrible defender. - Zach Collins is a solid defender. - Zach Collins has the potential to be an extremely good defender. - Zach Collins will likely be FAR superior to John Collins defensively at their peaks, thus making him a better long-term fit.
Guys, Tolliver has a higher DRPM than Collins so hes a better defender! And last year his DBPM was tied with Meyers so he's no better defensively than Meyers is, since last year is a fairer gauge than this year!
To be fair, I always was surprised Tolliver didnt pan out with us. I think his skillset is a good fit.
Despite the popular demand, I refuse to be the first person in this thread to call Zach Collins a worthless bum. Someone else will have to call him a worthless bum before I am quoted calling him a worthless bum.
what? where was it I said you didn't know what DBPM means? That makes no sense in reply to those numbers I posted comparing the two Collins, you said "none of those stats are an accurate reflection of defense". So, I posted some defensive stats. Apparently, defensive stats don't accurately reflect defense. I'd be willing to concede they can be real noisy, but both the stats and he eyeball test show that Zach has a long ways to go before he's the defender some of you hope he becomes pound sand with that insulting bullshit. I overvalue stats? fine, ok then....you overvalue your own opinion and almost always defend it by personally attacking the poster disagreeing with you....how's that? you like that? ...tell me: does that kind of attack-the-messenger crap advance a discussion? It's great for starting a pissing contest though....maybe that's why you get in so many around here another thing: it's kind of heavy irony that you slam me for "paragraphs of numbers" in a thread started with you making an 18 minute video on Zach. How many paragraphs were in that video? yeah, I'll just believe John Collins is a "terrible" defender because you say so well then here's some more cherry picked stats you'll hate (and another paragraph or two): this season, among the 98 PF's tracked by DRPM, John Collins ranked 27th; that's 27th of 98. And of the 520 NBA players tracked he was 147th. He had a defensive rating that was 2.8 points better than his team. For reference, last season, Zach had a defensive rating that was 0.5 points better than his team. 2.8 vs 0.5 those numbers certainly don't prove John Collins is a good defender. But they sure as hell imply he's nothing close to "terrible" on defense. And, a significant component of defense for front-court players is defensive rebounding; JC is quite a bit better at that than Zach. And, JC commits 5.2 fouls per/100 possessions; Zach commits 6.2 but more than that, defense is only part of the game, and not the most important part either. Wade Baldwin was a solid defender but a shitty NBA player. Same for Thomas Robinson. And remember Tyrus Thomas? Lots of solid defenders have had short NBA careers because they were poor at offense. You have to look at both ends of the floor and the best way to defeat good defense is with better offense. John Collins is pretty damn good at offense. And that's why he's an overall plus in BPM, RPM, PER etc. while Zach is an overall minus. JC is simply a better player overall, and the gap is significant right now ok then....that's the problem we're having. I'm looking at where players are now. You're arguing for a theoretical Zach that may or may not arrive sometime in the future. I remember the theoretical Meyers so I'm cynical about the theory
