Buck Williams wasn’t a role player. He was a 3 time All Star and All NBA Second Teamer. Besides, no one used the term “role player” back when Buck joined our team. It was a coaching concept coined by Phil Jackson about players put around Michael Jordan. Now people use the term for every player in the league that isn’t an All Star or fringe All Star which is stupid. As for Collins, when we let Aminu and Harkless go, it’s because we believed in Collins as our starting PF and Barkley has repeatedly said that he believes Collins is going to be a star in this league. Remember summer 2019? All the talk in this forum was about the team’s success would depend on Collins making the jump. Well he didn’t have a chance to grow into the new role because he got hurt. Nonetheless, it was clear we were a better team last season when he played. As I said, 2-1 before he got hurt and then 6-2 in the bubble.
This this this. I don’t care about all those stats. We play better when he’s our starting PF. He does a lot on the floor that doesn’t show up in boxscore. And he was just getting his feet wet. Give him a full season at starting PF and we’ll get even better.
In my opinion he was our role player that took the team over the hump. He didnt make the all star team during our hayday. rodman made the all star team. Was he an all star or a role player? Kerr made the all star team. Is he a star or a role player? speaking of stupid, how is that curry thread coming along for you?
As I watch the game last night on replay I will tell you both Jones and Covington are good on ball defenders now there real good playing passing lanes. Zach is a better on ball defender then both of them and right he probably better defender the Nurk. Stats aside and I really don't know how they figure all that crap out but physically watching the game Zach does more on defense then all them. He knows how to take angles away on help defense and I also see stay in front of guys and I actually see him guarding guards and been successful at it. When has got beat I seen get back in the play and alternate the shot. Offensely he probably won't have decent numbers as long plays with Dame and CJ matter a fact you don't see covington or Jones don't have big numbers on offense due to they play with CJ and Dame. Right now this team miss Zach he really showing up at there.
In answer to the title of the thread; He has definitely been "missing". (I guess that could be taken in two ways, now that I think about it. )
your affection for Zach is duly noted but where is the evidence that Zach is a better on ball defender than Roco/Jones or a better overall defender than Nurkic? I don't think there's any evidence at all. In fact, the number say just the opposite and why would there be any expectation, at all, that when and if Zach does return this season he'll be playing with any kind of optimal performance. He will have only played 8 games in the span of 14-16 months and would be returning rusty as hell. Likely with much reduced strength and stamina resulting in poor timing and inconsistent reactions. He just had a 2nd surgery on his ankle. That's not minor
The Blazers 35-39 record last year equates to a 5-6 record for 11 games. Suppose Zach being on the court was the cause of our 8-3 record. That's +3 extra wins in 11 games. Extrapolate that to 82 games and it means Zach should turn a 41-41 Blazer team into a 63 win team. Glue guys don't do that. Also, if Zach is such a glue guy then why, for his career, has he made the Blazers point-differential go down instead of up when he's on the court? Did he just become a glue guy last year? Mediocre teams go 8-3 and later go 3-8. It's just variance. Like we blew out GSW and then got blown out by them. I do think we miss Zach though because he's much better than Melo.
you don't understand...there is obviously some magic in the word "outcomes"...utter it and you've made a magical argument
Careful there, stating opinion as fact. I already addressed that: "I liken it to the CJ argument. When Dame is out, CJ alters his game and the team plays faster. The outcome ends up being pretty similar to with Dame. Everyone plays a little different with or without a specific component around them, and sometimes that has a big effect." Adding or subtracting a player can affect the role of everyone else, even when said player is off the court. It changes rotations, assignments, game plans, etc. All the little things you stats guys hate trying to take into account...
Why do you think Roco and Jones are good on ball defenders because there not they have hard time staying in front of there man but if you say there good in passing lanes or helping off ball then I would agree. For Zach I watch the game and don't much look at stats how a player effect the game. For Nurk he not the same defender before he broke his leg and yes all 3 players make good play here and there. If stat buff Do you know what Zach defense rating of his career on 100 possission 109 he a little down year last due to injuries but his 1st two years is quite good. Jones as also 109 and Covington 105 all 3 of them got good ratings.
Where did I say it’s fact? Do I have to preface every line with IMO? But no, no player adds 22 wins in a season without it showing up in his stats. If Zach somehow has a big positive on-court effect, by whatever means, even by magic, it would appear in his plus/minus. It hasn’t.
Probably posted elsewhere, but here's the latest news I read about him: https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/...ly-after-second-ankle-surgery-in-four-months/
Talked to a guy the other day who claimshe's good friends with a high-level Blazers scout. Supposedly the scouting team can't stand Zach because of his inability to stay healthy and would love him off the team, but his value is so low around the league they can't give him away. Third-hand and completely unsourced, but thought I'd share anyway.
Do you remember the Olshey interview at the beginning of the season with Zach practicing and he actually says “There’s Zach now”. I wonder if that was all just for show? Oh the conspiracy theories....
I really don't believe this injury prone due fact his rookie season he play 66 games and his 2nd season he played 77 games. He shoulder and ankle is freak accident and due to him having another surgery on same ankle was due to the 1st just didn't take place. I don't believe some scout said they can't stand him and his value is low because I just read some where there's teams been asking about him.
Why would the scouting team care whether Zach is capable of taking the court? Their responsibility ends (or should end) with scouting the upcoming opponents. Aren't the coaches doing all the game planning at that point, taking into account what players are available? On the other hand, if someone's going to create a totally bogus claim and try to pass it off to others, it might as well be plausible. And that certainly isn't, so maybe it's true?? "Never go against a Sicilian when death is on the line!"
The injuries to Zach have hurt. They have hurt the team and they have hurt Zach's development. However, against teams with spread PFs I prefer having Covington (and maybe even Jones) at the 4 spot. Collins does a decent job of getting out on the perimeter but that takes him away from his strengths, which IMO is being a help defender around the basket. So is he a better center than Kanter for our 2nd team? They are two completely different types of players. I guess I would have to say that he is not thee missing ingredient, but he will make us better when he is fully healthy. He adds a need with his skills.
there's another way to look at that though Zach stayed relatively healthy when he was averaging 17 minutes a game coming off the bench. But last season, he was a starter averaging 10 more minutes/game and could only play 11 games so, you could then ask what was the fluke: his last two injury-filled seasons or his first two injury-free seasons? Which pair of seasons is more predictive of the future? I don't know which scouting members preview coming opponents, but I'd imagine that's handled by the coaching staff. I'm assuming there's another group of scouts responsible for talent evaluation. And that their responsibility includes evaluating all NBA players as well as college and G-League talent. And assign grades for all of them. In that regard, it would make some sense if one of the gauges was how Portland's current player(s) stacked up by position against all the others they grade
