Does Dame fit any more?

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Rastapopoulos, Feb 17, 2022.

?

Trade Dame because he doesn't fit with the new ChaunceyBall style?

  1. NEVER!

    50.0%
  2. Maybe for a huge return, provided he's okay with it

    35.7%
  3. It's Ant's team now - time to put all traces of Olshey/Stotts in the rear view mirror

    14.3%
  1. Rastapopoulos

    Rastapopoulos Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    37,387
    Likes Received:
    21,980
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Ballin'
    Of course we do. But then what happens when it looks like it's not working?

    "Give him more time! It's only been a month or so!"
    "We'd be doing worse if it weren't for Dame!"

    And so on.

    And it remains true that Dame and Ant do not complement each other well and may even step on each other's toes. They have the same strengths, but they also have the same weaknesses. So: suppose you had to choose:

    a) Trade for players to put around Dame for one last shot at a championship (the Boston Big Three method) which would require trading Ant as he's our best asset, or
    b) Try to build a team that will succeed in Ant's time-frame (which would almost be greatly advanced by trading Dame ASAP to get his soon-to-be massive contract off the books)

    Everyone seems to think there's a third option, but I'm going to need an example in NBA history where it works (and don't say David Robinson and Tim Duncan, because both of them were all-world defense AND offense).
     
    Natebishop3 likes this.
  2. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,157
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    If we DO give it a shot and Dame comes out and looks like ass, or the team isn't playing well, how much does it hurt our trade position? Teams are going to know that we're in a bind.
     
  3. sheed30

    sheed30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    479
    Likes Received:
    504
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Common sense has entered the forum!
     
    Fairly-Hard likes this.
  4. Orion Bailey

    Orion Bailey Forum Troll

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2015
    Messages:
    26,285
    Likes Received:
    21,506
    Trophy Points:
    113
    We owe it to Dame to not trade him off of hypotheticals. FO and him should agree if it isnt working by the trade deadline he is traded. Fo should work with him like they did CJ. Be transparent.

    And who cares what anyone in here says or thinks.

    Trade deadline or bust.
     
  5. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,414
    Likes Received:
    13,349
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    Of course, and what happens if the picks you trade for flame out as good rotation players at best and whoever you get for him salary wise is not a fit? There is always a risk / reward with any of these kinds of decisions.

    It is pretty obvious that the chance of getting a superstar of Dame's caliber back is not a likely return, when all is said and done - so basically the argument for looking at the Dame / Ant combo is a much higher ceiling - where an immediate trade will likely get you a higher floor.

    The Blazers have a chance at old / young superstar combo + supporting roster - they would be fools not to explore it - because if it works out... they have a real chance of contention.
     
    illmatic99 likes this.
  6. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,157
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    The flaw in this logic is that this isn't fantasy league.... or NBA2k. Putting two players who possess similar strengths and similar weaknesses means that there's a very real chance that neither will be playing to their potential.

    These are real players who have to work together, and sometimes a combination of players simply doesn't work. On paper Dame and Ant is a formidable duo. In reality, they might make each other worse because they both need the ball, and defensively their deficiencies are amplified because they're both weak defenders. So the question becomes:

    Is Dame at 80% and Ant at 80% better than:

    Dame at 100% and Hart at 100% + whatever we can get for Ant

    or

    Ant at 100% and Hart at 100% + whatever we can get for Dame
     
  7. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,414
    Likes Received:
    13,349
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    No disrespect, but you have put your analyst hat on and you believe it is clearly the case. I would argue that many are not as certain as you are - thus the risk / reward scenario presented.
     
  8. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,157
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I definitely see value in bringing Dame back so he can, at the very least, show that he's healthy and still an elite player.

    But there's also risk because if we come out flat next season and the team is showing major regression with Dame on the floor, it can really damage our position of strength in negotiations.
     
  9. sheed30

    sheed30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    479
    Likes Received:
    504
    Trophy Points:
    93
    We WILL give it a shot, would be dumb not too, and when has Dame came out looking like an ass? Grasping for straws aren't you now?
     
  10. sheed30

    sheed30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2008
    Messages:
    479
    Likes Received:
    504
    Trophy Points:
    93
    He will push the Dame should be traded narrative all over this forum now, sometimes it's just best to leave people to their views and move on, or it will be the same ring around the rosey talk.
     
    tykendo and Fairly-Hard like this.
  11. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    20,715
    Likes Received:
    32,575
    Trophy Points:
    113
    what position of strength do you think Portland is in now? I don't think it's nearly as good as you apparently do

    you're advocating trading a 31 year old 6'2 guard on a super-max deal who is currently injured and out because of surgery to try and correct a chronic condition. And doing it directly following the worst season of his career. Teams are not going to pony up great assets to trade into that situation. Right now is selling low

    and what you're selling seems to be that Dame is not going to be anywhere close to the player he was....just 9 months ago...so dump him now at a discounted price
     
  12. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,157
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I think his value decreases every year that he ages. He's 31. He's going to be 32 in a few months. I don't think the league believes that he's drastically worse than he was 9 months ago. I think he still has high value. The difference is that you're equating value with health and output. I'm equating value with team success and perception. If the team comes out flat, there will be once again rumblings that Dame will want out. Or maybe he comes out and he's not the player that he was. Right now there's a chance that he won't be the same player, albeit a very small one. If he were to come out and play poorly next season, it wouldn't be a chance anymore. It would be a fact. So right now a team would trade for him and hope that he's going to be the same guy. I think a lot of teams would take that chance.
     
  13. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Former Member Gone New!

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    9,062
    Likes Received:
    7,410
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Currently the apartment in the Moda
    So you're one of them?
     
  14. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Former Member Gone New!

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    9,062
    Likes Received:
    7,410
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Currently the apartment in the Moda
    So you're another one of them?
     
  15. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Former Member Gone New!

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    9,062
    Likes Received:
    7,410
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Currently the apartment in the Moda
    And another one of them?
     
  16. AngryFan

    AngryFan Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2022
    Messages:
    174
    Likes Received:
    141
    Trophy Points:
    43
    If rumors of Damian wanting a 2-year supermax extension are true he needs to go.
     
  17. Fairly-Hard

    Fairly-Hard Former Member Gone New!

    Joined:
    May 2, 2021
    Messages:
    9,062
    Likes Received:
    7,410
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Currently the apartment in the Moda
    At least this one made it about money not just "Fit".
     
  18. andalusian

    andalusian Season - Restarted

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2008
    Messages:
    14,414
    Likes Received:
    13,349
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    San Marcos, CA
    That's a lot different from your earlier post which went with:

    There is always risk in these kinds of things, but I am pretty sure you were one that in the past called Simons a "failed experiment" as a PG before giving him the time to mature and learn (if it was not you, I apologize, that's what my memory says). In other words - there are certainly things that we can not for sure until we try them - and I will repeat my assertion - if the Dame / Ant combo can coexist efficiently - the Blazers have a much higher chance to become contenders than if you try to maximize Dame's trade value before exploring the pairing - so not giving this combination a try is a mistake.
     
  19. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2008
    Messages:
    20,715
    Likes Received:
    32,575
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think very few would. But one that should is the team he plays for
     
  20. Natebishop3

    Natebishop3 Don't tread on me!

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2008
    Messages:
    90,157
    Likes Received:
    52,173
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Maybe it should have said "potential value." My point is that I can see the argument why someone would want to bring him back. But I can also see the argument for trading him. I don't understand people who just flat out say, "nope this is the way." Bringing him back might work out. It might be a slam dunk. He and Simons might be awesome together. I can see that happening..... I can also see major issues with it. I try to be able to see both sides.
     
    PtldPlatypus likes this.

Share This Page