Notice Joe Cronin New GM

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by THE HCP, May 10, 2022.

  1. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Because maybe the Pelicans didn't want to?

    You guys do realize it takes two teams to agree, right?
     
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  2. wizenheimer

    wizenheimer Well-Known Member

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    except he wasn't operating in a vacuum and none of us know for certain what demands the Vulcans made on him. And to believe the return was shitty you also have to believe there were better deals out there. Maybe there were but I sure haven't seen a shred of evidence that's true

    I said in this thread I actually would have preferred somebody besides Joe because it's a fairly critical draft and off-season.
     
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  3. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Reasonable doesn't work here. It's all or nothing!

    Ignoring that the Pelicans pick could only be 5-14, and that no one expected the Lakers pick to be lotto and if the Pelicans gave it up, they weren't going to let a top 8 pick go if they could avoid it (since it's their only pick this year).

    Extenuating circumstances matter, and god forbid people remember that just because some jabroni on YouTube or Twitter said it could happen, doesn't mean it was an option.

    CJ was barely worth a lotto pick. Especially given the team needed out of his contract and there wasn't a plethora of teams offering trades that made sense both team wise and $ wise
     
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  4. MickZagger

    MickZagger Well-Known Member

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    Me thinks Chauncey is actually the GM and Cronin is the cap guru with the GM title.
     
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  5. MickZagger

    MickZagger Well-Known Member

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    He answered my emails promptly though

    :cheers:
     
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  6. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    The Pelicans wanted CJ and CJ wanted them (a rarity for New Orleans).

    The Pelicans wanted to make the playoffs (or at least were going for the play-in).

    The Pelicans liked CJ enough to give up a potential lottery pick if they DIDN'T accomplish their goal of the trade.

    Name another trade where if the team receiving the player doesn't reach their goal the trade turns out better for them then if they do achieve it?

    Cronin got absolutely obliterated by Griffin in negotiations. It doesn't matter what any other offers were, he couldn't even negotiate better terms with a team that was willing to give up something valuable if the trade didn't go well. It's an absolute failure and should immediately discredit him from ever touching a GM position again. There is literally no excuse for this blunder.
     
  7. RR7

    RR7 Well-Known Member

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    How does it turn out better for new Orleans? They didn't keep their pick, their pick was already gone unless it was top 4. By making the playoffs, they lost an additional asset in the 2025 pick.
     
  8. bigbailes

    bigbailes Well-Known Member

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    There were three parties involved in that trade, the Blazers, Pelicans and CJ with 2 out of the 3 getting what they wanted. I don't want the GM that comes out as the only loser of the bunch. If the Pels and CJ really wanted the deal to happen that badly, than you make sure you get a 2nd pick in this draft, not some hope that Giannis blows out his knee in 2025. I'll give Cronin the benefit of the doubt and assume he was doing the bidding of the Vulcans, but it seems like his specialty is in cap management and not negotiating trades, which is a trait I really don't like in a GM.
     
  9. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    Because if they made the playoffs, they were going to do it at the expense of the Lakers, whose pick they also had. They lost a future Milwaukee pick but gained a top 10 pick because they kept the Lakers pick (it went to the Grizzlies if it was 11-30). This was a likely scenario that I talked about right after the trade, two months before it played out.

    If they were willing to give up that same range of lottery pick for CJ if they sucked after the trade, Cronin had to negotiate this scenario into the deal.

    Now, it could've had the same protections (1-4 NO keeps it) and the Blazers could've still gotten unlucky, but that had to be the backup protections.
     
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  10. Paine Tablet

    Paine Tablet Well-Known Member

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    That 2019 Olshey-built team was roundly applauded for its team atmosphere and leadership. Character doesn't matter for shit to you in reality. You think Olshey is a bad character because you are an NPC.
     
  11. Phatguysrule

    Phatguysrule Well-Known Member

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    Agreed.
     
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  12. RR7

    RR7 Well-Known Member

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    The Lakers were a half game behind the Clippers at the time of the trade. The pelicans making the playoffs didn't hinge on the Lakers not making it.
     
  13. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    If a GM doesn't have the foresight to plan for all scenarios to occur, they suck at their job.

    Neither the Clippers or Lakers made the playoffs, what's your point?
     
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  14. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    If this scenario was as unlikely as you suggested, it's even worse that Cronin couldn't get it thrown in on the off chance it did.
     
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  15. RR7

    RR7 Well-Known Member

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    As was mentioned previously, it takes 2 teams to negotiate.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2022
  16. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    Again, if the team that you're negotiating with gets to give up less to you if they accomplish their goal of the trade, you failed at those negotiations.

    Jake L Fischer reported that the Blazers were assuming the Pelicans weren't going to make the playoffs. That's not a case of "taking 2 teams to negotiate." It appears Cronin thought the Lakers would get things together. To just assume that is bad GM'ing no matter how anyone tries to spin it.
     
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  17. Phatguysrule

    Phatguysrule Well-Known Member

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    Cronin can't just force the other team to include stuff. They all had access to the probabilities for each pick.

    It's very possible that the Pels were willing to include that pick with protections because they were confident they were going to make the playoffs, and that's the only reason.

    We don't know. So holding that against Cronin makes little sense to me. It's just splitting hairs.

    To me it looks like Cronin got about the best value out of CJ as was available, and took a swing at getting much better value.
     
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  18. hoopsjock

    hoopsjock Well-Known Member

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    So give me an example of another trade where the team that accomplished their goal had to give up less when they did so? Should be easy to do, no?

    According to reports, Cronin was operating under the assumption they were going to have two lottery picks. That seems to imply the opposite of what you're trying to excuse.
     
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  19. DDolla

    DDolla Well-Known Member

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    When do we create a new thread of Fire Cronin? Before or after the draft?
     
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  20. RR7

    RR7 Well-Known Member

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    If pelicans reach their goal, they lose their pick to Memphis, and 2025 pick to us. If they miss out on their goal, they lose their pick. The Lakers pick requires something separate to happen, and should not be included in the calculation of what they gave up or didn't. They lost 2 picks versus 1. achieving their goal instead of w.
     

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