Alright, the majority of non Magic fans are telling us to draft JJ Redick. Yes we need a shooter and yes JJ is the best one, but here are the reasons not to draft him with our lottery pick. 1. All he does is shoot. He's not a good passer, I doubt he will be able to get into the lane and create shots for anyone else. He doesn't have the speed or quickness to do what he was doing in college against NBA players. 2. Defense. The Magic have Jameer Nelson running the point. Already that is a defensive liability in the backcourt because of his size. Why have 2 defensive liabilities in the backcourt in your starting lineup. I don't think anyone in their right mind would start Jameer/JJ in the backcourt. Of course Jameer gets the nod in starting, so that means JJ would be a bench player, now why would we use our lottery pick to get a career bench player(Jameer will be a Magic for a long time)? The Magic need a SG that can play defense, which is why Deshawn Stevenson is so valuable to our team. Could you imagine Jameer, JJ, and Hedo starting? Do you realize how many layups the other team would get? 3. No team is going to set up a lot of plays like Duke did where JJ runs off of screens. He is a volume shooter, he needs as many shots as possible to be effective. I doubt any team will give him more than 10 shots a game as a rookie. The Magic basically need to do a couple of things on offense this year, pound it to Dwight and Darko and then kick it out to Jameer/Hedo that's basically going to be our game plan, so I don't see where JJ will get his shots with Jameer/Hedo getting the majority of the outside shots. I'm not hating on him, I wouldn't mind if we either traded down to get him or do what we did to get Jameer at around 23(if he's still available), but I don't want to spend my lottery pick on a guy that will be a backup.
I agree, although I do think you underrate JJ. There are some guys who will just succeed despite apparent flaws, I beliebve JJ and Adam Morrison will both accomplish this andf be very successful, although JJ is not the best player for this team.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheGreatK-Bob:</div><div class="quote_post">I agree, although I do think you underrate JJ. There are some guys who will just succeed despite apparent flaws, I beliebve JJ and Adam Morrison will both accomplish this andf be very successful, although JJ is not the best player for this team.</div> I think he'll be a serviceable player, but not worth a lottery pick. I would much rather take someone like Ronnie Brewer or Mardy Collins who will play defense and do other stuff.
I totally agree even though I am a Duke fan I do not want him in Orlando. The reasons you stated are why I dont want him here, we could draft the 3-point shooter we need in the second round i.e. Ray, Gansey, Pittsnogle etc. Redick is a good player do not get me wrong but the Magic can succeed with sombody better than him.
first of all wouldn't you rather be kickin it out to jj than hedo or jameer? and you wouldn't like possibly the next reggie miller or even jeff hornacek on your team?
I would love Pittsnogle in the second round! I love the kid, if he's available i wouldn't pass him uop over anyone but someone who dropped very far. Jeff Hornacek . . . or John Havlicek. <font color=""Red""> Please don't double post - V.C.</font>
Agreed that JJ is a defensive liability but hes got something that we lack which is shooting. With our bench Darko and Arroyo took the shots since Ariza and Dooling were slashers and Outlaw as we know has prob the best looking shot in the NBA . We need someone if Deshawn opts out then I say go for a SG but if not draft a big guy. We need a good banger to back up Dwight and Darko.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheFreshPrince:</div><div class="quote_post">first of all wouldn't you rather be kickin it out to jj than hedo or jameer? and you wouldn't like possibly the next reggie miller or even jeff hornacek on your team?</div> If we draft Redick and start him, I guarantee you despite all of our talent, we wouldn't win more than 25 games. Other teams guards would tear us up. We wouldn't have a chance. It'd be layup after layup and wide open shot after wide open shot. Sure we'd score more, but we'd give up a lot more. I doubt Redick is the next Reggie Miller because he's not really that clutch(well at least the games I watched from him). Like I said, I wouldn't mind him on the Magic, as long as we don't use a lottery pick on him. He would be a backup on the Magic, so if I was a Redick fan then I would definetely not want him in Orlando. I do not want to draft a backup in the lottery. That would be 1 foreign guy that will likely never come and a backup in the last 2 years in the lottery. That would cement us on being the worst drafting team in NBA history.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GatorsowntheNCAA:</div><div class="quote_post">I do not want to draft a backup in the lottery. That would be 1 foreign guy that will likely never come and a backup in the last 2 years in the lottery. That would cement us on being the worst drafting team in NBA history.</div> Whoa, don't forget 2004, we had just about the best draft in the league, definitely two of the top 10 players from that class!
He knows how to shoot, thats all we need him to do right now. Plenty of players in this league have made careers feeding off double teams and draining open 3's. Dennis Scott and Steve Kerr shot 3's well and helped their teams every night. If we can make some room for Dwight and Darko to work it will open up everyones game. I think getting JJ would only help this team and could solve one of our greatest weaknesses.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheGreatK-Bob:</div><div class="quote_post">Whoa, don't forget 2004, we had just about the best draft in the league, definitely two of the top 10 players from that class!</div> We've had 6 good picks in our franchise history, that is it.... Shaq/Dwight/Penny(when we were #1) and Jameer/Nick Anderson/Dennis Scott
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting GatorsowntheNCAA:</div><div class="quote_post">If we draft Redick and start him, I guarantee you despite all of our talent, we wouldn't win more than 25 games. Other teams guards would tear us up. We wouldn't have a chance. It'd be layup after layup and wide open shot after wide open shot. Sure we'd score more, but we'd give up a lot more. I doubt Redick is the next Reggie Miller because he's not really that clutch(well at least the games I watched from him). Like I said, I wouldn't mind him on the Magic, as long as we don't use a lottery pick on him. He would be a backup on the Magic, so if I was a Redick fan then I would definetely not want him in Orlando. I do not want to draft a backup in the lottery. That would be 1 foreign guy that will likely never come and a backup in the last 2 years in the lottery. That would cement us on being the worst drafting team in NBA history.</div> You're exaggerating Redick's defensive struggles. Almost all of his problems defensively lie within his lack of size and strength, an attribute that's really overrated on the next level, where for every Kobe Bryant you have playing the two guard you have a Bobby Jackson. Even with the size issue aside, he's held some of college basketball's best players of all shapes and sizes to off nights, like Julius Hodge, Rashad McCants, Maurice Ager, Luther Head, and Kirk Hinrich, just to name a few. It really bothers me how everyone acts like the NBA is an extreme step up in terms of size than in college basketball. Yes, it's true to an extent that the average NBA player is generally bigger than the average college player, but like I just said, Redick's faced opponents of all shapes and sizes with all sorts of ability and been successful against them all. He was a four year starter on one of the best teams in college basketball history; he was a two-time Player of the Year; he's the all-time leading scorer in both Duke and ACC history; he's got picture-perfect form and possibly the greatest looking jumper in ACC history as well. Point is, there's not as much of a risk with Redick as most lead you to believe; he's proven as hell. As for Reggie Miller, the comparison doesn't come in terms of clutch performances but in the way Redick uses screens better than anyone else on his level of play and his ability to knock down almost any clean look he gets, as well as the fact that his form doesn't change whether he's shooting a six footer or a sixteen footer. I'll just defer to the man himself on this one: “To be honest with you, I think everybody wants to talk about what I can’t do. I can do one thing really well, and I can do a lot of things pretty good. As long as I show I’m adequate in those areas, somebody’s going to give me a chance because I can really shoot the ball. I don’t think a guy would be consensus national player of the year two times in a row, first team all-American, all-time leading scorer—I could go on—I don’t think a guy would do those things if he couldn’t just flat out play. I look at the coming month and the coming years as a huge challenge, and if I work hard, I think I can accomplish some good things in this league.” - J.J. Redick
^^ I totally agree JJ was a decent defender in college, not horrible. And how many players are good enough to guard kobe and whatnot at the 2 in the league? Not very many. Plus he began driving and finishing at the rim this year. I mean its not like he will be amazingly slow and weak in the nba. Almost all of the nba's players were college players (some even high school) which means that jj will have to get stronger and quicker like everyone else did when they transitioned into the nba. JJ has a rare talent to shoot the ball and i think that a lot of teams are going to regret not taking him.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Voodoo Child:</div><div class="quote_post">You're exaggerating Redick's defensive struggles. Almost all of his problems defensively lie within his lack of size and strength, an attribute that's really overrated on the next level, where for every Kobe Bryant you have playing the two guard you have a Bobby Jackson. Even with the size issue aside, he's held some of college basketball's best players of all shapes and sizes to off nights, like Julius Hodge, Rashad McCants, Maurice Ager, Luther Head, and Kirk Hinrich just to name a few. It really bothers me how everyone acts like the NBA is an extreme step up in terms of size than in college basketball. Yes, it's true to an extent that the average NBA player is generally bigger than the average college player, but like I just said, Redick's faced opponents of all shapes and sizes with all sorts of ability. He's was a four year starter on one of the best teams in college basketball history; he was a two-time Player of the Year; he's the all-time leading scorer in both Duke and ACC history; he's got picture-perfect form and possibly the greatest looking jumper in ACC history as well. Point is, there's not as much of a risk with Redick as most lead you to believe; he's proven as hell. As for Reggie Miller, the comparison doesn't come in terms of clutch performances but in the way Redick uses screens better than anyone else on his level of play and his ability to knock down almost any clean look he gets, as well as the fact that his form doesn't change whether he's shooting a six footer or a sixteen footer. I'll just defer to the man himself on this one: ?To be honest with you, I think everybody wants to talk about what I can?t do. I can do one thing really well, and I can do a lot of things pretty good. As long as I show I?m adequate in those areas, somebody?s going to give me a chance because I can really shoot the ball. I don?t think a guy would be consensus national player of the year two times in a row, first team all-American, all-time leading scorer?I could go on?I don?t think a guy would do those things if he couldn?t just flat out play. I look at the coming month and the coming years as a huge challenge, and if I work hard, I think I can accomplish some good things in this league.? - J.J. Redick</div> Damnit VC now I am liking J.J. more. You made some great points and it is good seeing you in the Magic forum.
I don't expect Reddick to be starting anyway. It's not like there's anybody who will be at #11 that can fill our needs better than he can.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Voodoo Child:</div><div class="quote_post">You're exaggerating Redick's defensive struggles. Almost all of his problems defensively lie within his lack of size and strength, an attribute that's really overrated on the next level, where for every Kobe Bryant you have playing the two guard you have a Bobby Jackson. Even with the size issue aside, he's held some of college basketball's best players of all shapes and sizes to off nights, like Julius Hodge, Rashad McCants, Maurice Ager, Luther Head, and Kirk Hinrich, just to name a few. It really bothers me how everyone acts like the NBA is an extreme step up in terms of size than in college basketball. Yes, it's true to an extent that the average NBA player is generally bigger than the average college player, but like I just said, Redick's faced opponents of all shapes and sizes with all sorts of ability and been successful against them all. He was a four year starter on one of the best teams in college basketball history; he was a two-time Player of the Year; he's the all-time leading scorer in both Duke and ACC history; he's got picture-perfect form and possibly the greatest looking jumper in ACC history as well. Point is, there's not as much of a risk with Redick as most lead you to believe; he's proven as hell. As for Reggie Miller, the comparison doesn't come in terms of clutch performances but in the way Redick uses screens better than anyone else on his level of play and his ability to knock down almost any clean look he gets, as well as the fact that his form doesn't change whether he's shooting a six footer or a sixteen footer. I'll just defer to the man himself on this one: ?To be honest with you, I think everybody wants to talk about what I can?t do. I can do one thing really well, and I can do a lot of things pretty good. As long as I show I?m adequate in those areas, somebody?s going to give me a chance because I can really shoot the ball. I don?t think a guy would be consensus national player of the year two times in a row, first team all-American, all-time leading scorer?I could go on?I don?t think a guy would do those things if he couldn?t just flat out play. I look at the coming month and the coming years as a huge challenge, and if I work hard, I think I can accomplish some good things in this league.? - J.J. Redick</div> So do you disagree with my claim that Jameer and JJ would let layup after layup? I'm not complaining about his defense in general, just we need good defense from our 2 spot with Jameer at PG and JJ just doesn't have the good defense that we need from our SG.
Defensive players come and go, players with Redicks shooting ability come around every 10-20 years or so. And hell, if I can improve my defense by reading some tips on this forum, whats stopping J.J from improving his with a professional defensive coordinator at his fingertips?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting NTC187:</div><div class="quote_post">Defensive players come and go, players with Redicks shooting ability come around every 10-20 years or so. And hell, if I can improve my defense by reading some tips on this forum, whats stopping J.J from improving his with a professional defensive coordinator at his fingertips?</div> Basically what I'm saying is we need someone like a Deshawn Stevenson that is able to defend their best offensive player. I know Redick's defense problems are vastly overrated, can you seriously say that Redick will be able to shutdown or contain the opposing teams best player? That's one role that I don't see Redick being able to handle effectively at all. I'm not saying that other teams shouldn't draft Redick, he is an amazing shooter and could be useful for other teams, I'm just saying I feel that he just doesn't make a good fit for the Magic, UNLESS we bring him off of the bench, but like I said before, why would a non playoff team spend a lottery pick on a bench player?
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">So do you disagree with my claim that Jameer and JJ would let layup after layup? I'm not complaining about his defense in general, just we need good defense from our 2 spot with Jameer at PG and JJ just doesn't have the good defense that we need from our SG.</div> Well, yes, I think that starting Redick and Nelson will be somewhat of a problem defensively for the Magic, but not to the extent to where you only win 25 games because of it. Just look at the Grizzlies. One of their most common backcourt rotations was Chucky Atkins running the point with Bobby Jackson playing two guard. That's got to be one of the smallest and worst defensive backcourts in the history of the league, but the Grizzlies finished the season with a 60% winning percentage, largely in part because of the offense they were able to generate. Also, I think that you'd be stretching to find a defensive-minded two guard in this year's draft at #11. You'd be better off just taking a player like Bobby Jones in the second, because none of the lottery prospects who play wing are anything special defensively. Yes, Mardy Collins has the versatility to play two guard, but he's still more of a point, and he'd be better at defending the point on the next level as well, so you probably couldn't play both him and Nelson at the same time without giving up just as much defensively as you would by playing Redick.
