I think he came close last season, he's only 22. If I had to pick a player to build a team around, LeBron. #2 would be Howard.
I agree with the general sentiment: Amare is the best offensive big, with Duncan being the best defender. Overall: Duncan. It's hard for me to even entertain the thought of Dwight being the best big man in the league after he got outplayed by Chris Bosh in the olympics. That's still pretty fresh in my mind.
Well the FIBA rules aren't exactly tailor made for his game, but you're right I wouldn't be overzealous enough to claim he's better than Duncan or anything.
Amare most certainly is not the best offensive big man. He might be the best scoring big in the game, but he's not the best offensive. He is not so good at passing, evidenced by his 1.3 assists per game. I think the best big men offensively in the league would be someone like Duncan who can get it done in a variety of ways, whether it be the straight away mid-range jumper, back to the basket, kissing it off the glass. What makes him the best, is his ability to pass also. One of the staples of that Spurs offense for years, has been him getting the ball in good position, drawing the double team and then hitting the pass out of the double team that gets the ball in motion. When teams have tried not to double him because of that, he has shown that he can put up monster games. Duncan is still better offensively than Amare, and just a better basketball player period than Amare. He is most certainly still the best big man in the game.
Scoring = Offense, hence Amare is he best offensive scoring big man in the game. Who cares if Amare is scoring on his own, or setting up others to score. Either way puts points up on the board for your/their team. Amare is dominate in being able to put the ball through the hoop, that he's the best offensive big man in the game. -Petey
Every time the Suns match up with the Spurs, Amare Stoudemire scores alot of points, but his team still looses. Just because your scoring, does not mean that the offense is doing good. It's just the same as the season before last when Nash went down for a few games, and the Suns lost a majority of games that Nash was out for. Sure Amare was getting his points, but without being able to set up his teamates, the offense had major problems. That doesn't happen for the Spurs offense, where they can still score if Parker goes down, because they have Duncan who can get everyone involved. Scoring points yourself does not make you the best offensive player, it just makes you the better scorer. Along with that, the two most dominant big men since Hakeem, have been Shaq and Duncan. Both have had one thing in common, they both were great passers out of double teams, something that Amare most certainly is not good at. Their ability to pass out of double teams has been what has made them so valuable. Being able to draw a double team, and pass out of it, is the most important thing for big men. It's why until guys like Amare and Howard learn how to do it, they will never win a title as the main options.
I don't think it's fair to compare the final results of the team in deciding. While it's almost been agreed up and down that Duncan is the best defensive big man, as you noted Amare lights him up. I'm curious to see if his game grows this season. I think he has it so easy scoring, even while being doubled that he doesn't think to kick it out. -Petey
I'm gonna have to agree with Valo on this one, there is no way that Amare is a better offensive big man that Duncan. He can score, but his game is still raw (at least compared to Duncan's). Yes, passing and all that do go into offense, it isn't just about scoring. Why do you think the Kings were so great offensively all those years? They had the best two passing big men in Webber and Vlade. For example compare Tony Parker to Steve Nash. Parker is just as good a scorer, and probably better at getting into the paint, but Nash's passing makes him a much better overall offensive player than Parker.
To be honost, I don't find that Duncan is the best defensive big man in the league anymore though. Duncan was never the most mobile, but having seriously declined in mobility the past few years, it is hard to call him the best defensive big man. He can no longer guard, or even seriously contain the quicker bigs in the league that can shoot or attack off the dribble somewhat. That is why guys like David West, Amare Stoudemire, Brandon Bass and these kind of guys have had their days on him as of recent. He just isn't fast enough to get out there and keep up the defense on guys like that. I think someone like Emeka Okafor is really the best defensive big man. Great shotblocker, strong enough to play the big guys, but quick enough to somewhat stay in front of the quicker guys like Amare and limit them more than Duncan can. I like him for best defensive big man these days. All around though, I don't think anyone gets it done is as many fashions as Duncan anymore though. He is so versatile offensively, able to score in a variety of ways, but still a top defender in the post. He is the least flawed of the big men I think.
Calling Amare's game raw is a reach. He can get past defenders then create a dunk better, he's a MUCH better jumpshooter, he draws FTs better and he has a much more consistent FT percentage which gives him the edge offensively (both of them are good finishers though). Stat doesn't simply take more shots, he destroys everyone else in efficiency.
There's two sides of the ball. The Suns didn't struggle to score because of their offense. It was because of the Spurs defense.
You're right about that, and I thought someone might bring it up. That's why I was careful to say "(at least compared to Duncan's)". Just because someone can shoot from 15 feet doesn't mean that their game isn't raw. Does he have any consistent go-to moves from the post like a Duncan or Garnett? No, he relies on his natural talent, which won't work for a whole career. Amare still benefits a lot from Steve Nash, also from his own quickness. Amare's game isn't nearly as polished as it should be, remember the Olympics a few years ago? If a guy like Bosh can be criticized for his Olympic performance so can Amare, it reflects on his overall game. Since then he has been injured a lot and hasn't really made any leaps in the improvement department. In fact I really believe that Amare will suffer greatly when he's playing with an average pg in a few years, much like Kmart cooled off without Kidd.
Well, I agree with Valo on that one. The Sun's did struggle offensively on their own, they had to either slow it down or play 4 or 5 since Shaq is so slow. I was watching a recording of one of their games the other day, Shaq was a huge detriment to their offensive scheme. Now I will give credit to Duncan on a couple of plays, but Shaq is aging and there was one game where Nash had something like 4 points and two assists in the first half. Not all because of the Spurs' defense.
Duncan's jumper looks incredibly inferior compared to Amare's then... Amare shoots 49% on his long 2's (he took 31 3 pointers) compared to 38% for TD (and TD takes a few more jumpers pace-adjusted). Also remember this is a 32 year old Duncan, and the gap in TS% between both is enormous, not just significant. With Tony Parker I doubt Amare's offensive potency could be overcome.
This is a misconception. Just look at Amare's numbers last year when Nash wasn't on the court. The guy is a beast, regardless. And Kenyon Martin was never even close to Amare. Remember, Amare was putting up impressive numbers even when coming off of an injury when his athleticism wasn't all there. He has superb touch around the basket, and a silky smooth jump shot that he can us to set up his drive. Duncan might be a better post up option when he gets good position around the basket. But from the mid-post, I'd rather get the ball to Amare and let him face up and make his move. He's almost unstoppable at that position.
I'm not saying that Amare isn't great or that he won't be good on his own, but he will fall off. Even without Nash, look at how many other great and underrated players he had on his team. They have a guy like Boris Diaw who is versatile enough to play any position 1 through 5, they have jump shooters, and a creative coach. There's no way that he'll fall to a Kmart level, but he wont be as good. Do you guys really believe that Amare is as good defensively as Duncan? At any given point there are a max of three Spurs who are a consistent offensive threat. Everyone else is a questionable open shot maker (Bowen, Finley, etc). Jermaine O'neal is a great example. Look at how he fell off once he was playing by himself. Before losing Reggie, Ron, and SJax he was a 20-10 guy and on the path to being a perennial allstar.
Oops, when I said "defensively" I meant offensively. I would still stand by Duncan being better. Gets twice as many assists and we all know that his basketball IQ is higher. If I had to choose who's hands to put the ball in I would easily pick Duncan over Amare. I hate Duncan and love Amare, but if I want to win Duncan is the better weapon.
