I just looked at his game log and realized that Crawford has been very consistent... at being an inconsistent shooter... Let's say that the bar is 42% FG, which is about his average. Not exactly earth shattering %, but the way we are playing, many of us will probably take 42% from a strictly jump shooter. And, this is Crawford's shooting % after he is traded to Warriors. H = Higher than 42% L = Lower than 42% L 40% L 29.4% H 42.9% L 30% H 50% H 42.9% L 40% H 53.8% L 25% L 14.3% H 57.9% L 35.3% H 42.3% L 20.0% H 53.8% L 33.3% H 53.8% L 18.2% H 50.0% L 25.0% H 50.0% L 38.5% L 37.5% H 52.6% L 41.9% H 54.5% H 48.5% L 33.3% (Missed couple games) L 16.7% L 30.8% H 50.0% L 20.0% H 62.5% He played 31 games with Warriors, and except one time (injury was involved), he didn't shoot higher or lower than 42% 3 straight games. Just 6 times, he shot higher or lower than 42% 2 straight games. And, he is very capable at shooting 50% in one game and 25% in very next game. At this point, I am starting to think that Crawford should be the first one to be moved over Maggette. He isn't exactly playing PG, and he is not a big PG to play with Monta, because he can't guard anybody. Also, his contract is much friendlier to trade than either Jackson or Maggette. Speaking of Maggette... I think he is doing a good job as a 6th man. Granted that he still charges toward the basket once he gets a pass, can't guard anybody and 10 mils for a 6th man is a hefty price to pay. But, what he is doing right now is an ideal job for 6th man, who can come in and becomes an instant offense. In January, which he played as a 6th man, he averaged 20.3 pts / 6.2 rebs / 52.5% FG in 31.3 minutes. While I would like to see him playing bit less and get paid around around 7 mils, I can definitely settle for Maggette's production for now.
crawford has always been a player that interested me. year to year he's been one of the most consistent guys in the league as far as what to expect from him production wise while at the same time, game to game he's one of the most inconsistent players in the league.
I totally agree. I made a post a while back detailing Crawford's shameful history from the three point line. Basically, over the past 6 years, he has taken an enormous amount of threes -- ranking 3rd, 6th, 40th, 28th, 6th, and 10th in total attempts each season. Basically, over that 6 year span, on average, he's in the top ten in total three point attempts (9.5 average for the set). The problem is that the dude is a poor shooter, at .347% for his career. To give you an example, in 2003-2004, he shot 521 (!) threes, good for third most shots in the league. That's 6.5 every game, for 80 straight games! The sad part? He only shot .317% for that year. As far as Mags, I've been riding him for a while, but he has looked good as a 6th man, basically because I can somewhat tolerate his ballhogging when he does it off the bench. He's the same old Mags, though. He still does very little to make his teammates better. But his instant offense is at least exciting to watch at times.
Nice, Kwan. I can't imagine Crawford as being thought of as consistently consistent. He takes some pretty bad shots, but at least he's more accurate than Baron Davis. BTW, what about Crawford as sixth man? If Belinelli or Morrow starts, it'd be nice to have a talented backup guard that can drive.
It's great, we have a whole team composed of brilliant sixth men. Now if we could just fill in one through five...
LOL, we'll need all the sixth men we can until our rooks can actually develop into good pros. The problem is our coach doesn't like rookies and prefers semi-polished nbdl guys over any lotto picks we got. Another problem is our head coach prefers guards over big guys. Without a great big guy, we're doomed to be mediocre for a long time. Biedrins is good, but he's not the kind that gets deep position in the paint compared to Turiaf. And Turiaf isn't that quick, isn't as finesse close to the hoop, and he's got lower upside than Biedrins.
I'm with you Kwan in regards to trading Crawford, but don't think it's entirely his fault. My take is that with Nelson's horrendous lineup changes and playing guys out of position, with no stud PG to speak of, that the Warriors back court does no do as well as they should. The key for the Warriors is to move the ball and put pressure on the defense, so that our perimeter shooters get open, and we can draw the defense out and run and gun on them. If the ball is not moving and our shots are not falling, then it's pretty much jack your own shot up time which happens a lot. Second, I get the feeling that Nelson will trade Monta before he trades Crawford first. This doesn't make much sense when Monta has just returned, and I reall don't know why, but it sounds like something the new brain trust of the Warriors will do.
Crawford would be an excellent addition off the bench for a very good team. He's not the type of player who can come in and lead a team night in and night out. He'll be a great 3rd-4th option.
Ok CR... it's starting to get a little absurd. Do you think that the lotto pick guys are ready to play? Honestly? I mean the healthy ones at least. Who hasn't been given a chance to prove themselves? Morrow, Randoph, and Wright were given the chance to start. Belinelli was on opening day of his rookie year, and he finally got another shot this year. Kobe didn't even get that shot. I think you need to re-evaluate your hatred for Nelly and just look at this objectively. The problem is that the team is full of players who are not NBA stars. The talent are playing out of position NOT because of Nelly, but because it's what the front office was pushing. Do you think Ellis would be Nelly's choice of a Point Guard? Honeslty? Put your emotions aside. Do you think Nelly REALLY wanted Crawford over Baron? Do you? Turiaf was a good signing for exactly what he did last night. Random games and matchups, he'll fill in when Beidrins is having an off night, or mismatched. The roster flat out stinks. The rookies and NBDLers are not every day players. It has nothing to do with the preference of Nelly. It has to do with the makeup of the team. Name one available coach that you think would be doing better with these guys. What do you think would happen to the vets if Nelly benched them all for the youth? How about free agents? How many do you htink would even entertain coming here? How many Agents would push for their guys to come here? Nelly's doing the right thing. He's playing players that earn the right to play and that understand the game. He's giving young guys the opportunity to play 10 to 15 minutes a game. When they show that they earn more (see Belinelli) they earn more miniutes. Honeslty take a look at what these guys bring. I think you need to re-evaluate the talent on the team. Put aside contracts. Put aside your hatret for Nelly, and really watch these guys play. Put aside how much you like or dislike the guys. I think you'll find that the only guys that really know the game are Jax, Belli and Beans. Jax overvalues his own ability but he has to because there's no point guard on the team. CJ is a valuable bench player, Morrow is a solid bench guy too, Turiaf has heart and hustle and plays his role well. Ellis is undersized and will never be able to play defense, but fills the role of a scorer if he has a solid 1 next to him. The rest of the guys on the team are all either garbage or LONG term projects. Buike will never actually play within his means. Because he thinks he's much better than he is. If he only was a catch and shoot guy or a guy who slashes and finishes, he'd be a good role player too. But he loves to dribble. Yes I said garbage. I wouldn't want them on my team if I were building a franchise. Of the afformentioned players. I MIGHT want 2 of them starting on a quality team. Beans at the 4 and Jax as my 4th option. I like watching Ellis play, but I think he's easily replaceable. Belinelli will be a solid starter in a couple of years. I wouldn't mind him as a starter on a team that's rebuilding until he grew into the role. He's earned that. Horrible, Horrible, Horrible.
Morrow is leading the NBA in 3-point percentage and is an excellent rebounder for his position. To me it's just absurd that he gets a DNP last night, when Jackson plays all 53 minutes and makes bad mistakes at the end of the game when he's clearly fatigued (and Crawford contributed nothing in his 47 minutes). With Randolph, Wright, Morrow, and others, it's not necessarily the amount of minutes, but consistency of minutes that's needed. They could have used Randolph a bit in that Spurs game (Randolph is among the NBA's best in rebounds per 48, and in a game in which we were badly outrebounded) and he also got a DNP. These guys shouldn't be starters yet, but Nelson was forced into it because of injuries. Don't start a guy one night, pull him after 6 minutes, and give him a DNP the next, that f*cks with his head. I know to Nelson is about "the strong will survive" his rookie torture test, but it's all crap, I think Nelson has lost his mind and is stubbornly clinging to his crap veteran loyalties and his small-ball gimmick to the very end when it's not working. Meanwhile he is ruining our young players. If there's a year to let them play and make their mistakes, this is it. It's not like sitting them is working.
CH -- I'm not sure if you're just upset with the roster situation in general, or if you're also defending Nellie's rotations and the way he gives out minutes. But as to the quote above, when you say the roster stinks and the rookies/NBDLers are not "everyday players," I have to wonder: If that's the case, why do the Golden state Warriors even participate in the NBA draft? What's the point? I guess Cohan should just sell his draft picks every year for pocket cash. I mean, what's the point? In fact, I'd like to know, why is Anthony Randolph even on this team? If Nellie and Cohan hate the draft so much, maybe they should just boycott it. Personally, I think it's a pretty good thing. You get a chance to try out something new, for mere pennies. It's a low risk, high reward opportunity, something every business man dreams of. It's especially great when it comes along at a time when you could use a change, or use something new, or you're just down on your luck. I heard Rod Brooks say on KNBR yesterday that "Nellie's job is to win games on a daily basis." He's wrong. That's not his job. Nellie's job is to "Do what's best for the franchise on a daily basis." In a good franchise, everybody is on the same page and works together. There is a synergy between owner, GM, front office, and coach. Think of it like a starting 5: Is the point guard's job just to pass? No. The point guard's job is to do what's best for the team. If I were an owner or GM, why the HELL would I want a coach who cared nothing about my vision, or who cared nothing about the well-being of the franchise? Why the HELL would I want a coach who just locked himself in his office until game time, and who left after practice before I could even speak to him? Why the HELL would I want a coach who cared about NOTHING other than X's and O's? I wouldn't. It wouldn't make any sense. It would be odd, actually. What's the point? When I hear people say "the coach's job is just to win games," it makes me laugh. If I had a coach who didn't care about the future of the franchise, who didn't care about our vision for the team, I'd fire him. If Nellie really wanted to "win games," he would be thinking about the future. If he really wanted to have a 50-win season, he sure as hell wouldn't be thinking about Wednesday's game against Phoenix. He would be thinking about next season. In other words, he would not merely be thinking "How can I win tomorrow night's game?" Instead he would be thinking "How can I set up my team so we can be a winner?" You have to have a plan. You have to have a vision. Brooks says Nellie plays Jax over Randolph (regardless of position) because Jax gives him the best chance to win "right now." Well, that's tunnel vision. It would seem Nellie's so stuck on the problem in front of him that he can't step back and see the bigger picture. In other words, is this team perfect the way it is? Is this team the ideal championship team? Why do you participate in the draft? Did you draft Randolph because you hoped he might help you get closer to becoming a winner? Do you want to find out? Jax/Crawford/Maggette will ALWAYS give Nellie a better chance to win over the rookies, as long as the rookies get shadow minutes and DNPs. Randolph will NEVER give you a better chance to win than Jackson as long as his only shot to prove it is during practice. There's no way. In three years from now, with Jax starting every night, and Randolph getting his only work in practice every day, is Nellie going to walk in the locker room and say, "you know, I think Randolph gives us a better chance to win than Jax. I know he has never scored an NBA basket, and I know Jax scores 20ppg, but tonight I have decided Randolph is the better player." How will he ever know? Through practice and shadow minutes? You tell me. With that philosophy, Nellie will play every player with at least 1 NBA game experience until everyone is gone and the roster is composed of 12 rookies who have never seen 1 minute of live action. Then he'll have to figure out a different philosophy. Do you want to see Craw/Mags/Jax start for the next 5 seasons because they are more NBA ready than all the talent you are drafting? If so, then give back the talent! Boycott the NBA draft. Let other teams have your picks or something. If you hate it so much, then don't use it. Alas, in the end, this team SUCKS DONKEY ASS, and their "veteran" leaders are hot garbage. They probably have the most horrendous "big three" in the history of basketball. It's a fukin disgrace. They totally imploded over the summer and self-destroyed their own financial situation. They have a bi-polar veteran leader who, by example, shows the young guys that it's okay to take plays off, to jack up any shot you want at any time, and to throw little whiny temper-tantrums at the ref instead of go back and help your teammates guard your man. However, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. The NBA has extended you an olive branch. A life-vest. A get-out-of-jail card. They have given you the NBA draft. Here is a brand new, talent-oozing young college star. Here, take him, for free. Try him out for three years. If you like him, then you buy. The Warriors are in a shit hole right now. Instead of just playing with the shit, they need to climb out of the hole. If Nellie wants to be a part of a winner, he better start asking himself: "Do I want to win tomorrow night's game, or do I want to start winning games?"
Where do you see hatred for Nelly in that last post? For examle "we'll need all the sixth men we can until our rooks can actually develop into good pros." Here, I'm not blaming Nelly for what he has in his roster. He'll need reliable guys until we get confident and consistent play from our rookies. This part is true or Nelson wouldn't play any rookies consistently because he feels they aren't ready. I also think it's true, he has a strong bias towards rookies and all year he has pointed towards playing guys like DeMarcus Nelson, CJ Watson, Kelenna Azubuike at PF, Anthony Morrow over the guys we just invested picks on. And he might be responsible for waiving Richard Hendrix which was puzzling when defense, inside scoring, and rebounding have been our worst skills. The point is why not give these guys more chances when they are actually accomplishing something by starting and playing 10 minutes in the first half? Nelly doesn't follow up in that same game! That's not something a coach looking to develop his young guys does. He puts them on a short leash and you know it. But whatever, I'm not saying we have the superstars waiting on the wings (not yet at least). I said Turiaf and Biedrins were talented, but they lack the things that a great big man has at this moment. I think this is true. They aid us defensively, but not offensively and towards the style that Nelson prefers and has made popular among Dallas and past warriors fans. I don't understand why you're coming at me. My opinion is justified. Nelly sucks for big men and he treats the rookies a lot harder than most coaches because he prefers 4 guard lineups when in past games, Turiaf and Biedrins worked better defensively and on the glass. Without strong defensive play we cannot run at all because we're not quick enough to do it at the inbounds even with 4 guards. The only rookie headcase I'm worried about is Anthony Randolph, but the other rooks should be solid and mature basketball players. I never said this nba team had stars, just try looking at games where bigger matchups might have worked for defensive purposes or a substitution of a bench guy over a cold shooting Crawford or Mags would have come in handy for offensive purposes. Nelly prefers to go offensive, no defense, and we never gain anything unless the other team can't shoot the open perimeter shot. I really think you're the one over defending Nelson, I barely scratched him in that last post and you're calling me out for things I've already acknowledged such as Ellis being a combo guard (which are more plentiful than swingmen like Azubuike), Azubuike being a mini- Maggette who just isn't as good, CJ just being a solid, consistent combo, and so on. The key to the warriors winning and making the post season is our backcourt's ability to do what guards are supposed to do (pass, drive, defend, shoot) and the quality of our big men (rebound, get inside positioning, defend weakside, defend other post players, draw extra players inside the paint, etc)
See the thing is, I'm not defending Nelson. I just don't think anyone could handle this situation. And to your point of why do we even participate in the draft? I tihnk to get guys that will eventually grow into players. The issue is that the team was building properly. The front office thought it was time to replace vets with other less valuable vets. Again, I don't have issues with Randolph, Wright or the others. I just don't see why they should be playing. They have done nothing to deserve PT. The roster, as-is, stinks. I won't change my stance there. How many draftees per year actually deserve real playing time? Just because we pull for this team, and they're not very good, doesn't mean that the young talent is ready to play. People need to be more cynical. Remove emotion from the situation. What's funny is that you say Nelson prefers to go offense, no defense. Well.. Who on this team plays defense. Even the shot blockers don't really play defense. They can play in spurts. And the rookies are the worst. If I were coach, I'd do exactly what Nelly is doing. I'd play the kids when people are banged up, maybe get them in if a matchup is there. But I play my guns. This month is an ideal time for the kids to wake up. There's a MONTH of home games, no travel, actual practice time. Here's where the vets get "injuries" like Crawford had. That's how you get mentally tough. This is the NBA, not your local high school. Do you think Craw was actually injured badly enough to not play? He was tired and Nelly wanted to ease Ellis into the PG position without having to yank him. So they gave him a couple of days off. That's how the NBA works. The young guys need to recognize when those situations come about, and play the coach's style. Gain his trust, and the minutes will come. Morrow and Belly figured it out. Wright finally started to as well. I blame Nelly for feeding fuel to the Mullin situation. But I think he saw that these guys are just Morons and were angling Mullin out. So might as well get a friend in there. Since Cohan has bought the team, there has only been 1 playoff team. And it was Mullin and Nelly who made it happen. They know basketball. Better than Randolph's uncle, better than any of us on this board. Nelly's track record proves it. He's only really struggled 1 time when he and the front office didn't see eye to eye in New York. And that team ended up making the playoffs anyway. So do I give Nelly the benefit of the doubt, Hell yes. He Earned it. Through years of putting a decent product on the court. If we could get Sloan over here to coach, I'd say do it, move him. But I think you'd see the same guys complaining of PT if Sloan were coaching. CJ earned his minutes, so did Kalenna. He makes good shots and has a nose for the ball. Don't you think Morrow earned his minutes? He rebounds, works to box out, can handle the ball ok, and shoots the lights out. What did Randolph and Wright do when they got PT. They had an ok game followed by a stinker. And didn't do the little things to earn PT. Fundamentally flawed basketball doesn't deserve more minutes. Although they were given opportunities to play. At times they looked ok, and they got other chances to play in spurts. Even started them from time to time. Also, those guys are physically ready to play on long stretches. Remember that this team was playing a ton of back to backs on the road. Their frames aren't made to play big minutes. Not yet. "Nelson sucks for big men and rookies." About the Big Men, I pointed out in the past a ton of Big men that have don well with Nelly. Starting from his days with the Bucks until now. I'll dig that up and repost if you want to take a look at it. Traditional Centers don't always do well with him (there have been a couple throughout the years that have done ok), but who on this roster is that type of player? On this roster Beans has grown nicely in the system. If this team had a decent PG to feed the post and run a true pick and roll, he'd get even better. Turiaf is playing better than I thought he would. Although he still needs to learn how to play actual defense. But he's a nice role player. Then there's the Richard Hendrix thing. Who the hell is Richard Hendrix? What has he done to earn any kind of run? I just don't get it. I'm just over everyone who overvalues the players on this team. Especially the front office.I'll stick to my statement. As of today, 2 guys on this team have the basketball skills to be starters in the NBA. I don't think there's 1 that would start on an elite team (well, one of Beans and Jax or Ellis possibly could). 4 or 5 years down the road, some of these kids will grow to be really good players. 1 or 2 might turn out to be special. But they need to earn it. Work for it. I apologize for directing this at you. I took this tirade to you because you're one of the more vocal guys who consistently blame Nelly for everything. People need to start demanding a real front office. Stop blaming the little guys and blame the front office. We deserve it. 1 playoff team in 14 years. Enough is enough!
If Jax threw one of his little referee temper-tantrums and then walked back on defense, he'd get benched for a week if Sloan were coach. Also, would Sloan start Azibuike at PF? Or Maggette? No. If anything, he would start Turiaf at PF until Wright/Randolph/Kurz could do it. I have liked Nellie as coach. And I think it's ridiculous that we even know who Randolph's uncle is. But if Nellie wants to be a winner before he leaves here, he needs to get his head out of the sand with Craxette and start thinking about the bigger picture.
Agreed about Jax. Which is why I wish Sloan would be coach here. That just ain't gonna happen. I doubt Turiaf would get starting minutes under any coach. As for Buike or Magette, it depends on front office pressure. I think if others play poorly, there's no saying that he wouldn't. I can guarantee that he wouldn't play people who don't know how to box out, play defense , or move to the proper position on the court. The Crawford Magette thing... I think he'd love to trade them, but who's gonna take them if they don't play. He has to showcase them. Magette off the bench is doing just that. Showing him off as a 6th man for contenders. Crawford needs to score to be valuable. I'm pretty sure if you asked Nelly if he likes those 2 as players, he'd have a huge "No Comment" for you. When Belly comes back, it'll probably cut into Crawford's minutes.
Well that eliminates Maggette and Crawford from his rotation. I totally agree. I think he does need to showcase them to keep their trade value alive. BUt I don't think that affects the conversation here; he doesn't have to completely bench Craxette to giv the young guys a chance. I mean, Crawford last night, 47 minutes on 2-10 shooting? That's not showcasing. That's torture. Put the guy out of his misery. Sit his a$$ on the bench and give Morrow a try. Nelly can give the young guys a chance while still leaving plenty of minutes for showcasing, IMO.
I'm not sure that Crawford and Mags are being showcased seeing that Nelson/Riley and to some extent Rowell are calling the shots now in regards to player personnel decisions. This is where someone who had a difference of opinion like Chris Mullin as their boss would be able to influence them. What's tough to figure is Nelson/Riley's thought processes like do we need a PG? Or do we need to get a PF besides Brandan Wright? Personally, I would answer yes and no to that, but I have no idea what the Warriors brain trust of basketball decisions are thinking. After getting Crawford, they said that they probably would not be active in trade talks, but they could change their minds after seeing Monta at PG. Also, I'm hoping another guy becomes a factor in trade talks -- Marcus Williams. Dallas, New Orleans, and now Orlando all need a PG or backup PG. For example, I read all three teams are interested in Beno Udrih. Williams is not as good as Udrih, but he is a big PG. At this point, I'd settle for a high second round pick for Marcus. He'd be a cheap pickup for one of those teams.
Disagree, it's not 1 issue. 1) These guys are physically developed 2) They are veterans 3) They have large contracts. 4) The vets understand their roles (we might not like them, but they get it) 5) The other guys that you want to play are still learning 6) The kids are still not physically ready to play consistent, big minutes. 7) They are not mentally ready to play either (look at Wright's lack of focus and Randolph...I don't even know where to start with him) 8) They've been given the opportunities to earn minutes, the one's that have earned more got hurt. (Belly and Wright) Morrow has gotten some too, he'll get more as time goes by. Agreed. I think when Belly comes back, he'll get those minutes when Crawford is struggling. Magette was actually playing fairly well. Had he been struggling, I think Morrow gets minutes. On a night by night basis, yes. I think you'll see that more in this month. Talk to me next month, we'll see.
This is Nelly we're talking about, right? You answered both of those questions. (well one was a statement, but I think there was a question in there) Yes we need another PF, or a center and move Beans to the 4. And Neither Crawford nor Monta are the answer at the 1. As far as all around hoops is conserned, IMO, Belly is the future at the 2, not Ellis...Hmm. Where does that leave us this off-season? Maybe showcasing Crawford and Ellis? I'll pray 5 times a day that this happens
Good points. It's easy to forget how elite an NBA body is -- even guys who are ripped and lean and look like supermen, if they take a month off, they can barely run for 5 minutes before they're gassed. So I guess I'm not really factoring in the physical side when looking at the young players. Hopefully you're right that we'll see some changes as the months move by. I guess patience is a virtue.
