Evolution? That's crazy talk!!!

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by hasoos, Feb 3, 2009.

  1. hasoos

    hasoos Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    9,418
    Likes Received:
    97
    Trophy Points:
    48
  2. JE

    JE Suspended

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    6,547
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    in between jobs right now
    Nice.


    Religion = fail. In my book.
     
  3. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,073
    Likes Received:
    9,027
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I saw a bunch of "perhaps", "similarity that adds to the argument", etc. I didn't see anyone want to go on a limb and say "Ha, you dumb non-evolutionary-believing freaks! This PROVES EVOLUTION!" But I won't go there.

    I'll talk about the bellows lung one in number 6. One of the things that I (as a non-believer in the Darwinian evolution theory) am stuck on is that generally systems don't "evolve" from worse to better, but that mutations generally are destructive (think cancer). I mean, if what I'm reading is accurate, part 6 says that there was a dinosaur that "evolved" a bellows set of lungs. How did that happen? Its mom and daddy dinosaur had "regular" dino lungs, but there was a mutation in it's DNA that caused it to have a bellows set of lungs rather than the normal dino ones? And it was able to procreate with another dinosaur (also with normal lungs) and have its DNA be passed down to a bunch of baby dinosaurs who had this bellows set of lungs?

    How many children do you know are born with a form of cancer that allows them to have gills? And then to pass it on? I'm not trying to be flip, but that's what you're asking me to buy into here, isn't it?
     
  4. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,073
    Likes Received:
    9,027
    Trophy Points:
    113
    JE, are you saying that the only people who don't believe in evolution are religious advocates? Or was that a new topic?
     
    JE likes this.
  5. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    5,465
    Likes Received:
    423
    Trophy Points:
    83
    The article had nothing to do with religion. Many religious people also believe in evolution.

    You = Fail.
     
    JE likes this.
  6. JE

    JE Suspended

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2007
    Messages:
    6,547
    Likes Received:
    39
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Occupation:
    in between jobs right now
    Meh. Didn't even glance at the article. Just getting my two cents out. :)
     
  7. hasoos

    hasoos Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    9,418
    Likes Received:
    97
    Trophy Points:
    48
    That is true. The arguements are not mutually exclusive. For instance, what if something made life, and then it evolved. Then you have a situation where they are not mutually exclusive. What is indicative though, is most folks who do believe in creationism, believe in something like the Bibles version of it, which does make it mutually exclusive. It all just matters how you see the world.
     
  8. hasoos

    hasoos Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    9,418
    Likes Received:
    97
    Trophy Points:
    48
    If both parents have a dominant recessive trait it can manifest itself in later generations when the breeding is right, they have shown it in biology experiements. Secondly, your statment about not evolving from worst to better is also wrong. Medical journalist have documented that many people now are being born without wisdom teeth, which is a genetic improvement for humans, as wisdom teeth can cause a large variety of medical problems. It is a big enough trend that it has been noticed by the medical community.
     
  9. TradeNurkicNow

    TradeNurkicNow piss

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    5,196
    Likes Received:
    676
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    hell
    Location:
    shit
    this is gonna be a pretty tough sell for someone who doesn't believe in dinosaurs.
     
  10. crowTrobot

    crowTrobot die comcast

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2008
    Messages:
    4,597
    Likes Received:
    208
    Trophy Points:
    63


    in a broad sense that's pretty much true. absolutely true of scientists working in related fields.
     
  11. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    May 24, 2007
    Messages:
    72,976
    Likes Received:
    10,655
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Never lost a case
    Location:
    Boston Legal
  12. Blazerfan22

    Blazerfan22 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2008
    Messages:
    83
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Well thanks for ANOTHER theory based on well THEORY....You can go all over the web and find Theory's about God, Revolution, Evolution an so on but guess what they have one thing in common they are all THEORY'S which is not fact on all counts.
     
  13. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,073
    Likes Received:
    9,027
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Were any evolutionists going to help me out with this one? Someone brought up the "dominant recessive" theory...which I can only guess meant they thought having a bellows set of lungs might have been a recessive gene passed on.

    I hadn't seen the "wisdom tooth evolution" topic before...I have to read up more on that. It seems very odd that things like the appendix haven't been "evolved" in however many millions of years we've been around, but that teeth we don't use did. How would that happen? Would the parent gene mutate into one that, instead of saying you're going to have 32 teeth, drop that down to 28? And that gets passed on?

    And I said "generally worse to better". I can give you thousands of cancers that are destructive mutations of cell genes. You've brought up a relatively new topic about not having wisdom teeth, which you assume is better than having wisdom teeth. If I said to you that instead of the new being having 28 teeth instead of 32, it had 2...would that be "better"?
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2009
  14. Stevenson

    Stevenson Old School

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2008
    Messages:
    4,132
    Likes Received:
    5,313
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Writer
    Location:
    PDX
    Want PROOF of evolution? Look in the mirror. Do you look the same as you did 20 years ago? Of course not. You evolved.

    Nature evolves. Case closed.
     
  15. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,073
    Likes Received:
    9,027
    Trophy Points:
    113
    You're right, Stevenson. The scar on my ear wasn't from a dog that bit me, it's from gene mutation. And my eyes haven't gotten bluer or grown in size, so they must not evolve with the rest of my body, which is curious...how does each body part know when to start and stop mutating?! Then there's my hair...it's shorter than it was in 1989, so by the "Stevenson Mirror Theory" I must have evolved shorter hair. Probably because of global warming. But how, then, did I grow more body hair? This is perplexing. Good think the case is closed. Too many questions.

    I'll enjoy other, potentially more logical, cases better than yours, Stevenson. No offense.
     
  16. SodaPopinski

    SodaPopinski Tigers love pepper

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    1,856
    Likes Received:
    50
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Ummm ... evolution is not a theory ... unless you consider "science" a theory.

    -Pop
     
  17. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2008
    Messages:
    26,073
    Likes Received:
    9,027
    Trophy Points:
    113
    yeah, actually it is.
     
  18. maxiep

    maxiep RIP Dr. Jack

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2008
    Messages:
    28,291
    Likes Received:
    5,854
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Merchant Banker
    Location:
    Denver, CO & Lake Oswego, OR
    Hey, I believe in evolution, but it is a theory.
     
  19. PapaG

    PapaG Banned User BANNED

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    Messages:
    32,870
    Likes Received:
    291
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Tualatin, OR
    Brian, your line of thinking looks similar to mine regarding the thought of a "progressive" or "linear" evolution. I am not a creationist, first and foremost (to get that out of the way), but I also have a hard time seeing a linear chain of evolution as a realistic theory. How does that happen? If it is based on mutated genes or altered DNA, shouldn't there be unknown numbers of mutations (or evolution) in the fossil record that didn't survive? That's the fundamental flaw in the Darwinist argument IMO. Well, that and the actual creation of life, which also has never been duplicated in a controlled setting, but that's for another thread.

    As you pointed out, many genetic mutations are destructive, as you pointed out with cancer cells. Shouldn't that also apply to evolution? If the case is that species inherently adapt to the positive in order to survive changing ecosystems, then why do some species become extinct? In my view, the thought of a linear evolutionary chain is almost as faith-based as a creationist's belief on some levels.
     
  20. SodaPopinski

    SodaPopinski Tigers love pepper

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2008
    Messages:
    1,856
    Likes Received:
    50
    Trophy Points:
    48
    From the National Academy of Science:

    -Pop
     

Share This Page