The only reason it was worse was because he made contact. If Howard had hit Dalembert in the jaw or temple with his elbow (From a guy who is 270 pounds and like 5% bodyfat) it would have damn near killed Dalambert. I am not saying that what Rondo did was right, it was wrong as well.
I'm pretty sure the Bulls don't get to pick who shoots the free throws, but the Celtics. It's not like a technical. If Miller couldn't shoot them, then the Celtics can choose anybody to shoot them, even a guy on the bench.
Its pretty evident Rondo was going for the ball. Just because he was going for the ball and failed to make contact with the ball, and instead found Miller's face, doesn't mean that he was going after Miller.
If it was a flagrant, Bulls would have got to choose. The one stipulation, is that Brad Miller couldn't come back in the game after that point, as he would have been deemed "too injured to play". Since it was called a personal foul in the game, Doc Rivers would have gotten to choose if Brad Miller was "too injured to play".
I've already supplied a video in this thread that illustrates the whole play. This is just a still of the end result that you hope will sway people.
He didn't come close to that ball. I would hope that he was trying to commit a hard foul (no layups in playoffs) and reacted late, but no way was he going to even touch the ball (or the hand holding the ball . . . or the arm attached to the hand that had the ball). This is kind of like the Garnett position you take . . . if you only see that as an obvious attempt at going for the ball . . . well I won't say you don't have a brain . . . it is just dyed green and you only see things one way. Just because Howard throws an elbow and hits someone , doesn't mean he was trying to hit that person . . . he was just trying to clear some space for himself . . .
Rondo makes a motion right after the foul is called, almost like the motion refs make to signal a ball was tipped going out of bounds. Was he actualyl trying to say he got a piece of the ball, or arguing against it being a flagrant by saying he hit his arm. I'd give him a technical just for being a jackass, and actually trying to say he got ball.
So... because Rondo didn't make contact with the ball, means he was going for Miller. Maybe he was actually trying to get a piece of the ball and ended up finding Miller's face instead. The video depicts that pretty well, I think. He thought he could get a piece of the ball, it was misjudgement on his part, he didn't get the ball, he got Miller. Your reasoning is so bad. The hardcore Blazer fan/Celtic hater (or one of them) is accusing me of bias. Too fucking perfect. I don't understand why you keep connecting two unrelated points every time you reply to me. Howard has very little if anything to do with this.
Your posts and excuses for Rondo probably sound to me like some Magic fan making excuses for Howard's conduct. Would you buy the arguement that Howard didn't mean to elbow anyone, he was just clearing space and accidently hit another player? Rondo either has very, very, very, very bad timing issues . . . or he was trying to take a hard foul.
I'm pretty sure you can call a flagrant regardless of intent. Maybe not a flagrant 2, but definitely a flagrant 1.
JE come on now, of course everyone's "going for the ball" doesn't mean that's what his intent was. Rondo knew he was beat and had to disrupt the play by all means necessary. Giving a guy a free-layup vs fouling someone going hard to the rim thus making them take some pretty clutch free-throws are like day and night. So my position is Rondo knew he had to foul and that's why he did it. I'm sure he didn't mean to rake his face, but when you've gotta foul to stop an easy bucket, i'm sure you don't always get to choose how you do it, thus flagrant in my book
Why is this even relevant? FTR I'd give Howard a 50-50 on rather it was intentional or not, granted both videos I've tried have pretty horrible angles. His timing wasn't that off, considering the speed of the NBA game. He made an error in judgement.
1) I wonder which is more likely, Rondo trying to get a piece of the ball or him fouling an 85% free throw shooter. No kidding Rondo knew he was beat, getting a hold of the ball was his way of trying to disrupt the play. 2) Hard fouls usually show intent. Rondo's intent was going for the ball. 3) Why would Rondo give a hard/flagrant foul in that situation, knowing that the softie league office would suspend him for game 6 and take away any chance his team had of winning that game? ...... Rondo's hit itself wasn't exactly overpowering and didn't look the least bit intentional, so show me exactly where he wound up and followed through.
I think raking someone's face, whether intentional or not ,is a flagrant foul, because its "unneccessary and/or excessive contact" But whatev's who cares. I'm just sayin' its all opinions at this point.
