Massachusetts going from Blue to Brown?

Discussion in 'Blazers OT Forum' started by maxiep, Jan 11, 2010.

  1. 44Thrilla

    44Thrilla cuatro cuatro

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    She could have won if she took it seriously. She thought she could coast into office.
     
  2. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    She was good enough to maintain a 20+ point lead for weeks. It wasn't until the past couple weeks that the race tightened.

    Two weeks ago, Rassmussen said Coakley led in the polls by 9:

    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/pub...2010_massachusetts_senate_coakley_50_brown_41

    A new Rasmussen Reports telephone survey of likely voters in the state finds Coakley ahead of Brown 50% to 41%. One percent (1%) prefer some other candidate, and seven percent (7%) are undecided.

    Boston.com said it was Coakley up 15 points:

    http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2010/01/10/senate_poll_coakley_up_15_points/

    January 10, 2010

    Democrat Martha Coakley, buoyed by her durable statewide popularity, enjoys a solid, 15-percentage-point lead over Republican rival Scott Brown as the race for US Senate enters the homestretch, according to a new Boston Globe poll of likely voters.
     
  3. 44Thrilla

    44Thrilla cuatro cuatro

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    Coakley also had a series of gaffs and started her negative campaign in that time period that really turned people off.
     
  4. deception

    deception JBB Banned Member

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    give him a break- everyone knows that crane has no dog in the race and he's just a neutral observer who voted for bob barr in the last national election :wink:
     
  5. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    He basically ran on one thing: the 41st vote, to torpedo the health care bill.

    If the people wanted the bill to pass, they'd have voted for her anyway.
     
  6. 44Thrilla

    44Thrilla cuatro cuatro

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    Maybe in San Diego he ran on that one thing, but here in the Mass/RI TV market, the 75 commercials I had to watch everyday indicated his stance on a much wider variety of issues.
     
  7. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    None of those being positions that a blue state like Mass. would favor.
     
  8. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    About half the voters in Mass. are independents. Here's an article from October interviewing RealClearPolitics.com executive editor. Things have not gotten better nationally, and certainly the results in Mass. show it.

    Irate and Independent


    A poll of opinion polls shows Americans' attitudes are changing rapidly.

    They are less and less thrilled about the country's direction and Congress, according to Tom Bevan, executive editor of national polling aggregator RealClearPolitics. He says independent voters are shifting away from the polices of the Obama administration and Democrats.

    "Independents have flipped negative," warns Bevan. "That's not a good thing for any party."

    The first gubernatorial races since Democrats took control of Washington, in New Jersey and Virginia, show voter angst and ire. Those races appear to be heading in different directions but are two sides of the same coin.

    In Virginia -- which swung Democrat first in 2006 to Jim Webb in his Senate race, then further to Obama in 2008 -- Republican Bob McDonnell leads Democrat Creigh Deeds by widening margins.

    In New Jersey -- which last went for a GOP presidential candidate in 1988 -- Democrat Gov. Jon Corzine averages about 40 percent. GOP challenger Chris Christie has fallen more than six points in two weeks. The beneficiary is independent Chris Daggett, winning double-digit support.

    "What do these phenomena have in common? In two words: disillusionment and disgust," says Lara Brown, Villanova University political science professor.

    Registered and likely voters, in particular, are disillusioned and disgusted with both parties and their candidates, who seem to over-promise, under-deliver, ask for too much and take advantage of their positions, explains Brown.

    Americans are worn out by inflated rhetoric and Washington insiders who just months ago said they were outsiders.

    Voters wonder what happened to candidates they elected to clean up Washington, stop partisan bickering and remove Wall Street titans who retained fat bonuses only because taxpayers bailed out their companies.

    Americans are simply fed up:

    • A CNN poll last week suggests most no longer agree with Obama "on the issues that matter most to them."

    • A Rasmussen poll shows 31 percent "think Congress has a poor understanding of the health care proposal," down four points from August (not a high point for Congress, if you recall town hall meetings). Worse, only 18 percent "think the (health care) plan will be a bipartisan effort."

    • Another Rasmussen poll shows only 49 percent "think that the economy will be stronger in five years than it is today." • A new Gallup poll shows most are "very concerned" about the economy and 60 percent "think the economic conditions are getting worse."

    Adding to these fears is Iran, which "9 in 10 Americans" think is developing nuclear arms, according to CNN.

    And few seem to understand the president's unwillingness to make a decision about Afghanistan. It is as if they ask: "Does he ever actually sit at the Oval Office desk to work -- like the rest of us?"

    Then there are tax problems for Rep. Charlie Rangel, D-N.Y.; questionable loans for Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn.; and adulterous liaisons for Sen. John Ensign, R-Nev., and Gov. Mark Sanford, R-S.C.

    Further, only 39 percent of Republicans have a favorable impression of Michael Steele, GOP chairman. Other polls suggest Americans feel Republicans are merely "obstructionists."

    The White House added insult to injury with its fight with Fox News. Most wonder how the White House even bothers with this "issue" with so many other important matters at hand.

    "When you look at all of these things, it is no great surprise that the thousands of tea party activists haven't embraced any one political party and that Glenn Beck's anti-administration, small-government, pro-individual-freedom tirade continues to draw some of the highest ratings of all three cable news networks," observes Brown.

    What does all this portend? Very possibly a Ross Perot moment -- the emergence of someone with serious charts and serious language that angry Americans will see as more authentic than "hope and change."
     
  9. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    So your quotes were completely irrelevant to the point you were trying to make. Thrilla lives in that part of the country I'll take his first hand account of the situation.
     
  10. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    I didn't vote for Barr. I wrote in Ron Paul.
     
  11. yakbladder

    yakbladder Grunt Third Class

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    Denny- they COULD have. But Dems aren't lock-step goose-trodding GOP members.

    That was my point. They actually have debate in-party. I think I read somewhere we call that Democracy? Not sure though. Perhaps you are right and we are more like Mussolini's Italy..
     
  12. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    You missed my point about the gang of 14? That was 7 republicans not in lock step with the party.
     
  13. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

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    Thrilla is trying to say Coakley lost a 30pt lead because of a weak campaign, and a weak candidate.

    The quotes show that Coakley's own party is saying it was about the issues, policies, and voter anger. NOT about a bad campaign or a crappy candidate.

    The quotes are completely relevant, and show that Thrilla is talking out of his ass.

    You're going to take an opinion from some nobody, with an obvious bias, talking out of his ass, over a bunch of direct quotes from the party in question, saying they need to change the focus of their policies?

    Suit yourself.
     
  14. Shapecity

    Shapecity S2/JBB Teamster Staff Member Administrator

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    http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/20/a-view-from-inside-coakleys-camp/
     
  15. Denny Crane

    Denny Crane It's not even loaded! Staff Member Administrator

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    Mr. Newman also said that the campaign was hurt when Mr. Brown made the race into a referendum on health care, which allowed him to attract campaign donations from across the country and which put Ms. Coakley in the tricky position of defending a health care bill to voters in a state that already has near-universal coverage. “It’s not easy in a sound bite, not easy in a 30-second rebuttal in the debate,’’ he said.

    Anyhow, love him or hate him, Karl Rove was really good at managing local campaigns from a national position, and as an advisor to the president. Republicans did defy history in 2002 and 2004 by gaining seats in both houses.

    It's pretty obvious that the Dems have nobody like that involved at this point. Howard Dean isn't involved anymore.
     
  16. 44Thrilla

    44Thrilla cuatro cuatro

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    check post # 6 of this thread, from last week..
     
  17. Ed O

    Ed O Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    I think your definition of "Democracy" is wrong.

    Ed O.
     
  18. Sug

    Sug Well-Known Member

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    BTW the reason Mass folks don't care about socialized healthcare at the national level is because they have it at the State level. So I would not read too much into this election as a turning point in the nations politics. If the Dems solve the economy than they will be loved.
     
  19. blazerboy30

    blazerboy30 Well-Known Member

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    Owned.

    link
     
  20. 44Thrilla

    44Thrilla cuatro cuatro

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    Ha, 2/3 of his voters were with him the entire time. I'm talking about the swing voters. People who were undecided until the last couple weeks, or people who initially supported the Democrats, but switched. Telling me that Scott Brown's base hates what is going on is Washington is not owning me, it's owning yourself.
     

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