I'm not sure I see your point. If we choose to pay them every year, does it matter if we have an obligation to pay them? Only if we are considering not paying them. Which we aren't, as far as I can see. It's like whether I have a contractual obligation to buy electricity from PGE (Portland General Electric). I don't think I do, but I'm absolutely going to buy electricity, and they are the only provider, so what does it matter if I'm obligated to buy from them or not? barfo
I was under the impression that much of our foreign policy with Israel involves keeping them on a leash, rather than them "asking us to bomb Iran for them". Others may know better (Israel is not my area of expertise), but for all their faults, being afraid to take care of business when they feel threatened doesn't seem to be one of them.
The united states signed a slew of actual treaty documents with Israel and Egypt that were voted on and entered into the congressional record. So in your analogy, it would be as if you signed a contract to buy your electricity from PGE.
Yes. My point is, my actual electricity purchases from PGE don't depend on whether I signed a contract with PGE. Sometimes the contract doesn't matter. barfo
Giving them huge amounts of arms seems like an odd way of keeping them on a leash. Unless we think they'd get even more arms for free from someone else? barfo
I guess you think the constitution doesn't matter? All the presidents and congresses since Carter have lived up to the obligation for some reason. Feel free to say what that "some reason" is if you differ.
The arms we've allowed them to buy are required by law to be used for defensive purposes only. I remember US stopped selling certain types of weapons to Israel because they were used by Israel during an invasion of Lebanon.
The same "some reason" that all the presidents from Truman to Ford "lived up to the obligation". The reason is that the US believes it has a strategic interest in funding Israel. barfo
Anyhow, I would rather see us not send them foreign aid, because they don't need it. They have a sufficiently large GDP for their population and the money we're giving them is a tiny fraction of that.
Perhaps we only loaned money in times of hardship, but we also provided aid that was not loans. See the very recent document www.fas.org/sgp/crs/mideast/RL33222.pdf barfo
Israel's total control and manipulation of US. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7877765982288566190#
Look at page 25. See the columns labeled "loan" and "grant"? Notice the economic grants starting in 1951, and the military grants starting in 1974, and the FFP grants starting in 1952? The Amer. Schools and Hosp. Grants starting in 1967? The Jewish Refug. Resettlement grants starting in 1973? barfo
lol. So the only reason all these US presidents continue support paying Israel is because Carter stepped in a gooey mess 30 years ago and all presidents since are powerless to extricate ourselves from the obligation incurred by Carter's mistake. That's awesome. Every president can just make any agreement he chooses with any country he picks, and for the next 10,000 years all future presidents are obligated to fulfill that promise. I didn't know that was written into the consitution, but it's a freakin' sweet power. If I were president, I'd arrange a deal with Sweden that they have to supply me and all my heirs forever with hot Swedish concubines, and in exchange they get all the free US manufactured clam chowder they can eat. It's a bargain for the Swedes, even if they only just sort of like clam chowder, and I'd ensure an endless awesome orgy for myself and all my heirs. No way the great great grandkids forget my birthday.
Yeah, the great great grandkids will remember you, because those concubines will be 100+ in their day. You forgot to specify in the agreement than the concubines would be refreshed every now and then. barfo
If the presidents weren't bound by these things, one might sign, say, the Kyoto Accord and the next could ignore it. Or the Geneva Conventions.
http://wrmea.org/component/content/...rect-us-aid-to-israel-almost-114-billion.html Components of Israel Aid Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of U.S. aid since World War II (not counting the huge sums being spent in Iraq). The $3 billion or so per year that Israel receives from the U.S. amounts to about $500 per Israeli. Most of this money is earmarked in the annual Foreign Operations (foreign aid) appropriations bills, with the three major items being military grants (Foreign Military Financing, or FMF), economic grants (Economic Support Funds, or ESF), and “migration and refugee assistance.” (Refugee assistance originally was intended to help Israel absorb Jewish refugees from the Soviet Union, but this was expanded in 1985 to include all refugees resettling in Israel. In fact, Israel doesn’t differentiate between refugees and other immigrants, so this money is used for all immigrants to Israel.) Not earmarked but also included in congresssional appropriations bills is Israel’s portion of grants for American Schools and Hospitals Abroad (ASHA) and monies buried in the appropriations for other departments or agencies. These are mostly for so-called “U.S.-Israeli cooperative programs” in defense, agriculture, science, and hi-tech industries. Before 1998, Israel received annually $1.8 billion in military grants and $1.2 billion in economic grants. Then, beginning in FY ‘99, the two countries agreed to reduce economic grants to Israel by $120 million and increase military grants by $60 million annually over 10 years. FY ’08 is the last year of that agreement, with military grants reaching $2.4 billion (reduced by an across-the-board rescission), and zero economic grants. Then, in August 2007, U.S. and Israeli officials signed a memorandum of understanding for a new 10-year, $30 billion aid package whereby FMF will gradually increase, beginning with $2.55 billion in FY ’09, and average $3 billion per year over the 10-year period. Actually, Carter gave Israel only loans, which were repaid in full. Reagan was the President who restarted our gifting to Israel. http://www.palestinefacts.org/pf_1991to_now_israel_us_support.php There has been economic aid to Israel every year since 1949, with the amounts fluctuating, generally increasing as the cooperation with Israel became closer or in years when Israel was forced to fight defensive wars or terrorism. From 1960 until 1985, there were no grants; aid consisted largely of loans, which Israel repaid, and surplus commodities, which Israel bought. The reference "U.S. Assistance to Israel" gives a table of annual amounts. The aid to other countries in the region has also increased and is similar in total amount. Much of the aid to Israel is for defense and the money is actually spent with U.S. suppliers so it recycles back to the United States.
