I think the biggest question on my mind today is WHAT THE FUCK IS MCQUEARY STILL DOING THERE? He saw the act happening, and simply walked away and let it happen. This piece of shit should have been gone long before JoPa
Re: And the name of his book is "Touched" "The sickest part is the coverup by the grad assistant, Joe Paterno and the administration." That was from earlier in this thread and part of what I have been reacting to by posting here. Ed O.
I agree. I don't know about his legal responsibility at the time, but if he saw something like that... he had a moral obligation (IMO) to ensure the police were notified. Ed O.
I don't agree with this as a basic way of living life. We should be concerned about protecting victims. Absolutely. But there are other aspects of life that I value more than that, and I think that society is better (even if terrible things occasionally happen) by not treating everyone, everywhere, like a victimizer and/or a victim. Ed O.
The latest. http://www.nesn.com/2011/11/jerry-s...ung-boys-to-rich-donors-says-mark-madden.html http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...ky-Has-Been-Missing-Since-2005-133615093.html
If someone witnesses the rape of child and does nothing that's an entirely different animal than having a mere suspicion or hearing rumors of somebody victimizing a child. McQuery testified that he witnessed a crime and did not intervene, he walked away and told his father and then his boss. In my mind that makes him a coward at the least and an accessory to a crime at the worst. So when Paterno heard McQuery's account and at least the words "Sandusky," "shower and "boy" were uttered to him by a trusted associate and he didn't immediately notify the police that may not make him legally responsible, but I find it incredible that he didn't think he had a moral obligation to protect a child that was very likely assaulted in his office by a former colleague. Maybe I'm interpreting your words wrong, but I get the impression that you are saying you'd protect a friend from charges of sexual assault if given the choice between that and turning them to protect a child that you don't know. I'm probably weird for feeling so strongly, having grown up in a household where my father was a rampant abuser (physically and verbally, but not sexually) and knowing the damage it caused (in particular to my sister) because people covered for him, but I find your point of view sickening, frankly.
I don't know how someone doesn't, after seeing that shower scene, yell something like "WTF?!?! Stop that, you sick *&(> !" and call 9-1-1 immediately.
Page 7 in the PDF is why Paterno was fired. He was told what happened and passed it off to someone else instead contacting of the police. Immediate grounds for firing, imo, especially after it was made public in the indictment. What a POS. I don't give a shit if he's an old frail man. Fuck him. http://www.freep.com/assets/freep/pdf/C4181508116.PDF
Re: Oops! Ashton! He was reacting as if it was a coaching decision, according to him, responding before he knew what was going on with the indictment/allegations.
Absolutely. JoePa is not, as I understand it, in the former camp. I wouldn't use the word "coward", but I agree with the general sentiment. I don't make this leap. He didn't have first-hand knowledge, and he was using processes that were in place... without knowing with any certainty what he heard, I'm not willing to say he had any moral obligations to do more than he did. As JoePa said, in HINDSIGHT he should have. If he had known more, his obligations (IMO) increase. He knows more now than he knew then, and for the purposes of this discussion I am erring on the side of ignorance on JoePa's part since I do not know the facts. You are interpreting my words wrong, yes. It's pretty pathetic that you find my point of view "sickening" to me. But whatever. I have not been put in that situation (either of abused or of knowing an accused abuser), but I do not immediately believe the worst in people, and if I had known someone for decades and thought them a good person, I would err on the side of giving them the benefit of the doubt. That doesn't give them carte blanche, of course, but it means that it's fact-specific and that the most important thing is not "be most concerned about protecting victims"... that is like someone saying "as long as it saves one life, it's worth it". Which is bullshit. We should not shut down freeways or end alcohol consumption in order to save one life. We cannot and should not live in a state of paranoia and perpetual distrust in order to protect potential victims. Absent this absolute commitment to prevention and cracking down, there are going to be crimes and victims. It's just part of being in a complex society, and I believe that we should punish the criminals and support the victims, but not cut a wide swath around both in the names of protecting everyone. Ed O.
I also agree with this. They're treating McQueary as if he was just a kid himself, and how he was intimidated by the hierarchy of power at Penn State and it is understandable he didn't do more but tell Joe Paterno. The Mikes at least were infuriated at him this morning, but on First Take they were trying to make excuses for him not doing -more-. That's the biggest bullshit I have heard out of all the excuses the adults that aren't Sandusky. He was a 28 year old grown ass man and he just walked the fuck away. WALKED AWAY FROM WATCHING A KID GET RAPED. What the hell. and Nik you aren't weird for feeling so strongly, people who protect their friends because "they just can't imagine it to be true and they don't have 'all the facts' do it because they don't want to think they made poor decisions themselves. If people want to slander someone they don't generally do the "well, I heard he's a pedophile/rapist/murderer" rumors. When stuff like that is said, it is probably the best to go to the police even if it is an anonymous tip. They'll do their job. I'd much rather have a friend of mine have the police come and question me than for them to sit back and do nothing. I cannot stress how pedophiles do not stop at one victim. I'm really sorry if it makes someone uncomfortable that they might find out some horrible truths about their friends, but you hide it in the back of your mind and you are helping keep a predator on the streets.
If you were told that a long time friend of yours had abused a child and this was the 2nd time you had heard such a rumor, would you still recommend that children attend his football camps? That's what lots of people have issues with Ed. We get your point, the guy is a long time friend and you haven't seen any proof yourself that is enough to convict him. But to still enable him? To make it easier for him to get access to children?
What I want to know is how many Graduate Assistants have gone on to get full time employment on Penn State's coaching staff during Paterno's era? If it's not many or he's the only one then you know he was rewarded with a job for keeping his mouth shut.
I think the bigger bombshell, sick as that sounds, that is going to be coming out over the next few days may answer what seems like an obvious question to 99% of us looking inside from the outside. The word 'systemic' keeps running through my mind, and I can only hope that these new rumors aren't true. Then again, I won't be shocked, because there are a lot of similarities, structurally, between this and known pedo rings that have been uncovered over the past few decades. McQueary grew up in State College, his dad and Sandusky are friends ... my God ... this could get to another level of horrific.
Pimping out the boys to rich donors?! http://www.nesn.com/2011/11/jerry-s...ung-boys-to-rich-donors-says-mark-madden.html Say it ain't so, jobless Joe!!
Casey and Toomey rescind support for Medal of Freedom nomination for Joe Paterno U.S. Senators Bob Casey (D-Pa.) and Pat Toomey (R-Pa.) announced today that they are rescinding their support for the nomination of former Penn State football coach Joe Paterno for the Presidential Medal of Freedom. They issued the following statement: “In light of the recent events in State College, we are rescinding our support for the nomination of Joe Paterno for the Presidential Medal of Freedom. We hope the proper authorities will move forward with their investigation without delay. Penn State is an important institution in our commonwealth. We should turn our attention to the victims of these atrocious crimes and ensure they get the help they need. Our hearts and prayers go out to them and their families.” http://www.whptv.com/content/Sandus...port-for-Medal-of/lnN48owJOEC7iqRo5VD9iA.cspx
