The super Melo to Portland thread + The Big Blockbuster

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by BoomChakaLaka, Feb 17, 2011.

?

Should the Blazers puruse Carmelo Anthony?

  1. Yes

  2. No

  3. Not No but Hell No

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  1. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    I imagine we all would. Incredibly unrealistic, but I wanted to follow @UKRAINEFAN's blueprint as closely as possible.
     
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  2. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Here's the thing about Markkanen; if Olshey loved Porzingis, is there any reason he wouldn't feel the same about Markkanen? Defensively Porzingis is much better but their offensive games are pretty close. I don't think Olshey was smitten with KP because of defense...lol. I'm not saying I'm turning the corner on Markkanen, but I do kind of appreciate his potential value to a team.
     
  3. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    A simple rule for evaluating your trade proposal for another team's star for fairness: Reverse it and ask yourself, assuming Portland wanted to trade Lillard, would you find the players you're sending out an acceptable/exciting return for Lillard?

    If the answer is yes, you'd be pretty happy with players the caliber of (for example) Crabbe, Leonard and Harkless for Lillard then, at least as you value all the players involved, it's a relatively fair trade (others may value all the players involved very differently, though).

    Remember, it's just meant to be a simple sanity check, not a sophisticated analytical tool. Obviously, different teams are in different situations and have different needs. But value still has to add up in a vacuum for the deal to be worth discussing. If it does, need and situation are good further issues to discuss.
     
  4. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    I mean, I'd hope defense was part of being "smitten." What makes Porzingis such an exciting young player is that he's a sweet-shooting big who doesn't compromise your defense. If all you wanted was a shooter at center, you could play Crabbe or Korver at center. Obviously, no one would do that because you'd be punting defense. Having a shooter at center who also provides rim protection is incredibly rare and valuable.
     
  5. UKRAINEFAN

    UKRAINEFAN Well-Known Member

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    Of course he is garbage, but that's part of the price for getting rid of Leonard!
     
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  6. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    There aren't many big men who've created waves yet in the early 2017 NBA draft discussion. Arizona's Lauri Markkanen is one of the exceptions, though his skill set doesn't reflect a traditional big man's game.

    "This kid is a stud," an NBA executive told Bleacher Report. "I've watched him over seven times—his skill level and soft touch from outside are things one can't teach. Get guys to have him lower so we can steal him."


    "Making shots in our league is an art," the executive said. "It's a skill no coach, you or me can teach. One hundred percent, kid is special."

    ------------------

    That quote is a "look," away from being Neil Olshey.
     
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  7. UKRAINEFAN

    UKRAINEFAN Well-Known Member

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    I fixed it on my post. I guess I was so excited that it actually worked that i grabbed the wrong link. And, sure Cleveland would want George but i don't think Indiana is interested in Love, they would rather have picks. KP loves picks!
     
  8. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Sure, but so is having your center shoot threes. We talk all this shit about Leonard, and rightfully so, but when he's actually playing well, it's hard not to see the value. Markkanen also does more than just spot up, so his offensive ceiling is pretty intriguing, can't lie.
     
  9. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    Yes, but it's both together. Again, you can have your "center shoot threes" by placing Korver at center.

    The magic is having your center shoot threes while not killing your defense on the other end. Even when Meyers is shooting well, there's a pretty good case to be made that he costs a lot of the offensive value he's generating on the defensive end.

    I don't disagree that Markkanen is intriguing offensively and I'm not among the people who hate the idea of drafting him, but he'll need to be at least competent on defense to be worth a mid-first round pick or higher, IMO.
     
  10. UKRAINEFAN

    UKRAINEFAN Well-Known Member

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    I think I propose trades with both teams in mind. I'm sure you know that Lillard, who has four years left and loves Portland is not comparable to George who has two and doesn't love Indiana. Sometime we get so down on our own players and their contracts that we don't see the possibilities. OK, now I see you are maybe comparing Lillard to Love. Lillard, two years younger, one more year on contract, PER 3 points higher, shines in the playoffs while Love doesn't.
     
  11. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    We'll always find reasons why our star is worth a lot and their star is worth all the roster garbage we either don't want or don't really care about losing. If you spoke to a fan of another team, they'd have similar reasons why Lillard isn't worth as much as their star. That's why I actually wouldn't get too caught in the weeds of exactly how good one star is compared to another when applying a basic sanity check.

    If it passes that basic check, yes, all the little details matter.
     
  12. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Haha! He is better than Butters! LOL!
     
  13. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    I guess the question is whether or not Markkanens shortcomings defensively/rebounding wise are fixable. I'm coming around on the idea that they are. I think he's a fairly smart player that just needs to get stronger. I don't think he'll ever be a true rim protector or some great rebounder, but I like his potential as a one on one defender. I also think he shows enough agility to handle switches on the perimeter. I think he profiles well next to Nurkic.
     
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  14. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    I wouldn't mind Markkanen at 15. I don't think he's awful defensively and with even a little improvement, he could at least hold his own sufficiently not to be constantly targeted in pick-and-rolls. As you said, he has the agility for it. Leonard does, too, so you just have to hope that Markkanen will process the flow of the game faster than Leonard which (IMO) has been the fatal flaw for Leonard. I completely agree that he fits really well next to Nurkic.
     
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  15. UKRAINEFAN

    UKRAINEFAN Well-Known Member

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    I'm having trouble applying your rule for basic sanity check because I don't consider Love a star. I consider him a really good rotation player. And i don't know who to use on Portland to try your rule with. We have two stars and one really young guy who seems to have a lot of potential. We don't have any really good rotation players. So I added two fairly good rotation players together. I think Cleveland's problem is not star power but depth. So, when I apply your rule, I still think this trade is doable. Now, what are your ideas for some good trades? :) And I promise not to suggest you apply a basic sanity check to your ideas.
     
  16. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    We'll have to agree to disagree then. :) I think his performance in Minnesota clearly illustrated that he's a star talent--his production has been curtailed by the "there's only one ball" issue that actually matters when you play with other ball-dominant stars like James and irving.
     
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  17. Pinwheel1

    Pinwheel1 Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately he will be long gone by 15. But not only would he fit well next to Nurk, but would allow us to have a SF on the floor who is not a good 3pt shooter. (i.e Harkless, Aminu or ET) Of course Terry would actually have to stop encouraging those 3 to shoot from out there.
     
  18. Scalma

    Scalma Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, i think Markkanen will go somewhere in the top 8, but would it really shock anyone if Olshey traded up for him? I'd almost laugh at the predictability of that move.

    Would you give 15 and 20 for him? I personally wouldn't, but I also wouldn't be mad if Olshey did.
     
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  19. Minstrel

    Minstrel Top Of The Pops Global Moderator

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    Hello darkness, my old friend
    I'd actually hope Harkless continues to work on his three-point shot this off-season. Having four guys who can shoot threes and Nurkic inside would be a load for any defense to deal with. You're right, though, that with Markkanen, the small forward not being a shooter wouldn't be a disaster.
     
  20. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    What picks do you have going to IND in your scenario? All of them? I'm thinking they might want Hark...
     

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