Zach Collins Post-ASG

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Wizard Mentor, Mar 9, 2018.

  1. SportsAndWhine

    SportsAndWhine Dumbass For Hire

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    Honestly, I'd hand Ed a blank check and tell him to not spend it all in one place.
     
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  2. H.C.

    H.C. Well-Known Member

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    I think Ed is retained, but it's always scary to throw big money at players like him.
    Faried, TT are the most recent I can think off the top of my head of players who have similar games to Davis. Yet never lived up to their contract.
     
  3. Strenuus

    Strenuus Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    Davis has always been consistent, though. Only injuries stop him.
     
  4. Labinot41

    Labinot41 Well-Known Member

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    Ed is 100 times better than trash faried and Thompson
     
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  5. LayneStaley

    LayneStaley Well-Known Member

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    Second best
     
  6. LayneStaley

    LayneStaley Well-Known Member

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    Now that our first round pick looks like it will be in the high 20s I wonder if we should of sent it somewhere for a SF?
     
  7. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

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    1) Zach has almost become a "solid NBA player," and I'm hopeful he can get there by the time the playoffs start.
    Right now, he's still inconsistent.

    2) His comfort level has clearly increased, and that's been huge.

    3) He meshes well with Ed Davis.

    4) I've been saying all along that he's a 2-way player, and I think we're starting to see that. In particular, I
    think he's become a solid 3 and D player.... which is exactly what you want when you have stars like Dame and
    CJ on the team already.

    5) He still has weaknesses, and the refs still hate him, but it's fun watching him improve.

    6) Depending on what happens in the offseason, it's reasonable he becomes a starter midseason next year.

    7) His PER is still only at about 8, but I honestly don't know if that's a low usage thing or not.

    edit: 8) Dude doesn't become old enough to have a drink until NOVEMBER.
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2018
  8. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    In the grand scheme of things? 6.25M, depending... :shrug:
     
  9. DameLill379

    DameLill379 #DameTime

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    I want to resign Bazz too. Those 3 Guard line ups are effective.
     
  10. PtldPlatypus

    PtldPlatypus Let's go Baby Blazers! Staff Member Global Moderator Moderator

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    Earlier in the year, Nurk's poor start seemed to lower his value in the upcoming free agent market. Now with Davis and Collins becoming more prominently featured late in games, will that further suppress his value? Nurk's been great defensively, and increasingly more efficient and consistent on offense, but I wouldn't be surprised if his teammates' performances are costing him money.
     
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  11. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    Here's a good rollup of the math-with-letters part of PER.
    In general, Zach has a few things going against him having a high PER:
    1) He's not a volume shooter.
    2) He's on the Blazers (no kidding, A/FGM ratio is decent part of the makeup of PER. Someone on the Warriors will have a higher PER than the Blazers, if every single stat stayed the exact same.)
    3) He's usually on the floor with an exceptional rebounder, especially an exceptional offensive rebounder.
    4) He dug himself a hole early in the year and it's going to take an extended run of good "stats" play to bring him back to him mean. Even now he's at 34% from 3 for the year, which while not stellar, makes it a worthy shot (and trending upward quickly).
    (he does, however, shoot from the perimeter a bunch and doesn't get a lot of fouls called. So that removes one particular downward-forcing function. But not nearly enough to overcome the others)

    If I were a GM or talent evaluator, I'd note those particular aspects of Zach's game and how PER wouldn't be the best wrap-up stat for him. Now, I'd also look at that to find diamonds-in-the-rough on other teams ("what do you mean, a first for Royce O'Neal? His PER is only 11--hee hee") and use it against more Front Offices that talk a good analytics game but don't really understand it. (There are more than a few of these)
     
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  12. Hoopguru

    Hoopguru Well-Known Member

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    Davis reminds me somewhat of Ben Wallace and what he did for the Pistons. And he was a player that got better with age, I see that with Davis too.
    That wrap around pass last night in the middle of a scrum was amazing too. He's a Warrior and seems to be a great person!
     
  13. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

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    great post, thanks. I think his December numbers are really hurting his efficiency numbers. I'll look into this.
     
  14. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    You really think we should pay Butters more than Ed?

    Ed AT LEAST deserves a Meyers type deal. :dunno:
     
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  15. dviss1

    dviss1 Emcee Referee

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    Great call. I think big Eddie is better offensively though. He's a low-key GREAT/Intelligent passer.
     
  16. BrianFromWA

    BrianFromWA Editor in Chief Staff Member Editor in Chief

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    I don't think you can use Summer of '16 numbers (anywhere in the NBA, really) to justify contracts going forward. Or else where does it stop?
    Ed: "I'd like to get a 4/65M contract, please."
    NO: "Ed, we love you, we'd love you to stay, but we can't possibly pay you that"
    Ed: "Timofey Mosgov---dude can't even spell his first name right, much less play anything close to me--got 4/64M. I'm better than him. I'll give you a hometown discount and only go 1M higher over 4 years."
    NO: "Um, Ed..."
    Ed: "What, you don't think I'm better than MOZGOV?!"
     
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  17. Wizard Mentor

    Wizard Mentor Wizard Mentor

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    Zach Collins 2018 (Jan 1 - present)

    21 Games, 531 min (25.3 mpg)
    FG: 58-136 = 42.6%
    3FG: 20-57 = 35.1%
    FT: 13-17 = 76.4%

    Contrast this with, for example, Kyle Kuzma (whole year)
    FG: .448
    3FG: .365
    FT: .694
     
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  18. Hoopguru

    Hoopguru Well-Known Member

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    No: Ed we will give a five year contract at 68M. You can stay put in a city that loves you and even have a shot a championship.
    Ed: sounds good to me I'll have my agent are to it.
     
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  19. Mediocre Man

    Mediocre Man Mr. SportsTwo

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    One would hope the 10th pick in a loaded draft would perform better than the 27th pick.
     
  20. rotary111

    rotary111 Well-Known Member

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    Is there a stat for being a gamer?

    Zach just trots back up the floor whether he hits a 3 or gets a block etc. His facial expressions don't change much, like he's been here before. It doesn't seem to matter if it's the start of a game against a bad team or the end of the 4th against the reigning champs. He's just not afraid of the moment. That kind of poise and composure at his age is what impresses me the most. Add in his work ethic and that he seems to fit in with the culture the front office is building and we have a home run at the 10th pick for this team. I could care less about his stats at this point. I'm looking at his body language and how he is adjusting to playing in a mans league as a 20 year old who hasn't grown into his body quite yet.

    Side note.
    I thought that Draymond guarding him out at the 3 point line really opened up the key for us last night. Zach held his own against a defensive machine last night. Ed is the perfect big brother for Zach right now.
     
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