Enes Kanter's game is garbage

Discussion in 'Portland Trail Blazers' started by Blazer4ever, Feb 23, 2019.

  1. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    At this point. Zach’s promise is a figment of our rose colored glasses imagination. Yesterday against the Suns he had a beautiful up and under move. In my minds eye I saw Kevin McHale gracefully banking it in. But then I awoke from my little day dream to Zach getting stripped before he could even get a shot up. This kind of thing seems to be the norm with Zach.
     
  2. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I know the idea. I don’t have the stats to back it up. But I’d bet on it. I’ve been paying attention to this for years. Corner 3s are a bit dangerous. Other 3s I don’t think so. Missed layups are the worst. I used to have the raw game event history I could have used to check it, but I don’t have it any more. Costs $300 to get full history. If you know of any data sources to raw event history I’d love to get my hands on it to confirm.
     
  3. TorturedBlazerFan

    TorturedBlazerFan Well-Known Member

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    I dont know of any off the top of my head. I think the type of paint shot that is the worst are running layups that miss, post ups usually slow the game down dont they?
     
  4. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    One thing Kanter can do on defense (differently) is actually raise his hands to contest shots. I don't know how many times I saw his man just shoot over him, without any sort of contention from Enes.
     
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  5. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    Yes missed running layups are clearly the worst. Post ups much less so and depends on how the player finishes. To my eye it’s not much about the slowness if the game or length of rebound. It’s about do all five guys have time to transition quickly to between the ball and our bucket. That mostly depends on can the shooter himself get back on defense. That’s why a missed layup is so bad. The shooter can’t get back. Kanter post up finishes are aggressive toward the bucket, compared to say an Aldridge baby hook or turn around jumper. So IMO Kanters post up misses are worse in this respect.
     
  6. JDC

    JDC Well-Known Member

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    Old, but relevant and Seth does good work.

    Works for the Bucks now as Director of Basketball Research.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ad-to-nba-fast-breaks/?utm_term=.b8a0b8c519d4
     
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2019
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  7. jlprk

    jlprk The ESPN mod is insane.

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    Whenever he touched (or tried to touch) the ball, he lost it. He has weak hands. Shoulda kept Ed Davis.
     
  8. CupWizier

    CupWizier Well-Known Member

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    Just think if Blazers had that mindset with Layman and got rid of him this past off season. Plenty of time for him to develop as he is very young.
     
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  9. Hoopguru

    Hoopguru Well-Known Member

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    yep..it does take bigs a bit longer to develop and the sophomore slump can be humbling to a youngster. It was on Jake.
     
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  10. julius

    julius Global Moderator Staff Member Global Moderator

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    They should give up on Zach and while they're at it Simons. If they're not producing from the get-go, they're worthless bums.

    GREEN FONT.
     
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  11. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    I'm not suggesting getting rid of Zach. I want Zach to play and play a lot. Hopefully everything we imagine with our rose colored glasses comes true. What I don't like doing is ditching ACTUAL good players based on fantasies about how someone MIGHT pan out.
     
  12. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    Ok, well here you go. I literally spent all day on this! While I was kind of right, that missed outside shots & 3-pointers hurt less than inside shots, and that layups are the worst, it's not to the degree I expected. I especially expected a worse result than this for missed layups. My guess explanation is that perhaps teams commit extra turnovers rushing to exploit the 5 on 4 after a missed layup, which partially offsets the advantage.

    Points After Missed Short.PNG
     
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  13. TorturedBlazerFan

    TorturedBlazerFan Well-Known Member

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    Whelp I feel bad. Interesting stats though. Thanks for spending your time on it.
     
  14. handiman

    handiman Well-Known Member

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    With missed layups, are you eliminating fast breaks? That might be polluting the data, with it being easy to run back a transition miss because there's no set defense.
     
  15. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure what you mean. The whole point was to see which missed shots are most detrimental to your defense. So having bad set defense due to a missed layup (shooter under the basket) should be included. Are you saying, eliminate fast-break missed layups but include half-court missed layups? I'm not sure I can detect as fast-break layup vs a half-court layup. Maybe I can by time of rebound vs time of layup.
     
  16. bobf

    bobf Well-Known Member

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    Nah, I love doing this stuff. Plus now I have raw play by play data again. It's kind of a nightmare though. The NBA stats API sucks and it likes to punish you every now and then by disabling you for 10 minutes if you throttle their API too much.
     
  17. TorturedBlazerFan

    TorturedBlazerFan Well-Known Member

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    Oh were you using the nba-api on PyPi.org?
    I like basketball reference for how easy it is to scrape and parse all the info. I havent really used the NBA’s api before.
     
  18. BonesJones

    BonesJones https://www.youtube.com/c/blazersuprise

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    Fans are more negative on him than they should be. Look at his stats this year. Hes been solid on both ends.
     
  19. TorturedBlazerFan

    TorturedBlazerFan Well-Known Member

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    Im not sure if he’ll ever be a foundational piece like he was sold as. Im kind of dissapointed in that the Kanter trade seems to mean we wont see him much. I dont know what that does for his developement or his confidence.
    Its kind of weird altogether how this season has gone for him.
     
  20. handiman

    handiman Well-Known Member

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    Correct. I assume the same as you, that they're tough to separate out, which is why I asked. :) I figure they're grouped together in the data and may be producing misleading averages. I would think a missed fast-break layup has a much higher likelihood of being run back on you for a score than does any other attempt.
     

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