Before going all in on a Simmons trade, I’d rather try to get Myles Turner. Getting Simmons right away still makes things iffy because Nurkic won’t get in done as a floor spacer, and there’s no way Ben can start at C and guard the biggest guy on the court at all times. Turner solves an immediate need defensively and will cost less than Simmons. A trade I want to see happen: IND gets: Covington, Brown III, Langford, 2022 BOS 1st, 2022 POR 2nd, 2022 BOS 2nd POR gets: Turner, Holiday BOS gets: Nurkic Dame/CJ/Norman/Nance/Turner at least on paper is a better defensive team. If this makes us better, I would be much more comfortable pulling off a Simmons trade. I hope to see Dame/Norm/Little/Nance/Turner play a lot of minutes and have success together if we could pull off a Turner trade—that would make Ben a seamless fit where Ben can step in for Little or Nance.
so they give up 3 players + a pick for, in essence, Myles Turner? Not sure that's such a smart trade. Turner is good, but 3 players + a pick good?
That does make us better if it's the first of two moves, the second being CJ for a PF. In fact if we got Turner and Holiday for RoCo, Nurk and a second rounder. I would call up the Sixers and try to negotiate and probably get him for less but be willing to give them CJ the three picks and three swaps for Simmons. Simmons would need to get vaccinated but yeah I'd do it. Dame, Norm, Simmons, Larry, Turner, Ant, Nas, Holiday and hopefully Zeller at some point. That could win a chip, maybe not this year but definitely make us a contender now and going forward.
I get what you’re saying, but the 3 players + a pick is really 2 starters and a long term project + a 2nd for someone who is essentially the perfect archetype center for this era. Giving Nance an opportunity to start also gives us a lineup where all 5 guys are a threat from deep. I know Nance isn’t shooting well from 3, but I’m generally confident when he shoots them. CJ, Anferee, and all of our firsts after 2022 would still be available for a guy like Ben later. But Ben doesn’t make sense for us until we can solve that fit problem at C that comes with Simmons first.
The number of players is all that matters? Like, Elleby, Blevins and McLemore would be a no-go since it's three players and Turner isn't "three players" good? I actually think the trade is slanted too much in Portland's favor. I don't think the Portland players being offered here are particularly valuable except Nurkic or ones Indiana would have any interest in (including Nurkic).
I watch Indy all of the time. The dude can move enough to play in Chauncey's system and he stretches the floor. What is it that you don't like? He protects the rim, he can defend on the perimeter and recover to get back in the paint, he is a monster finishing at the rim on offense and he shoots the three. He's not a monster on the boards playing with Sabonis but if Sabonis isn't gobbling those things up, Turner would be getting those.
You think Turner is worth more than that? Of the teams that might be interested in Turner, the only offer off the top of my head that is definitively better would be the Warriors’ young trio + guys like Poole. But I don’t know if GSW wants to mess up a good thing. Charlotte has a lot of pieces that would make for a better offer as well. Outside of that The Lakers don’t have an offer better than the Blazers’ offer. Raptors would have to part with Siakam most likely. Heat don’t have anything to offer outside of picks—they’re not trading Herro, and Robinson isn’t playing well after the extension. Hardaway Jr’s salary + picks isn’t better than Covington’s salary + young guys + picks. Celtics would rather have Turner than Nurkic, but I don’t think they’re wanting to part with multiple young guys or multiple picks or any pieces of their core for Turner. If the Kings wanted to trade one of their 3 guards + picks that might be interesting. If anything, I think that current offer is at least a competitive offer among the league for Turner.
Well CJ has to go, we need a forward for him but it doesn't have to be Simmons or even anyone on that level. I would take a serviceable starting forward and expiring contracts. That being said, don't be so certain that a CJ package won't get Simmons. Philly can float that as much as they want but CJ makes sense for them and for some reason he's still on the minds of the people covering the Sixers. I guess we'll see. Obviously when I'm saying that a specific thing will happen and your saying that every other possibility out there put together have a better chance of happening, you are right. Of course Simmons coming here isn't as likely as him ending up on one of the other 28 teams in the league but by no means do I think you can be certain, especially with our team being talked about as a destination so often and our current GM looking to make big changes to this roster.
Well, I don't think Covington or Brown add value. It's Nurkic and a pick for Turner, which isn't too bad in a vacuum. But you have to consider what the other side is looking for--reports are that they might start fielding offers for Turner (and Sabonis and LeVert) as part of a tear-down and rebuild. If they're headed for a rebuild, Nurkic doesn't really make sense for them. He isn't old, but he's not going to fit the timeline of players coming in from future picks. They'd much rather get Turner's value in future assets, not a prime player. And even if they're not rebuilding, just trading away Turner, Nurkic seems like a terrible fit next to Sabonis. They both derive their offensive value by being planted in the paint and are unswitchable defensively. In fact, Turner is a much better fit next to Sabonis than Nurkic if you were going to play two bigs, but Indiana seems to have decided that a two-bigs system isn't going to work.
I think Covington might be really good next to Sabonis. I do think that if you wanted to turn RoCo and Nurk into Turner, then you'd have to get value that Indy wants for Nurk from a third team.
The RoCo of past years would be, but he'd be really good anywhere--the perfect 3&D complementary wing. But the RoCo of this year looks...washed. He's way too young for that, but his game has collapsed. If you, as a team, believe you know how to fix his game then yeah, I could see being interested in getting him.
But on the other hand, a trade like this would shave off more than the $3M we need to get under the luxury tax, while at the same time balancing the lineup a little. Pretty meh, and on the face of it favors the Sixers, which is why it might actually be possible (given Morey's usually unreasonable stance). Starting lineup afterwards: Dame, Norm, Tobi, Nurk and either Nance or Nas depending on the other team. (Of course, I'd rather get Thybulle than Milton, but that ain't gonna happen.) It does seem that Harris's defense has slipped this year, but last year (and previous) it was a lot better than CJ's, so maybe he can bounce back.
There are horrible trades, and there are horrible trades of biblical proportions. And then there's this crap.
Well if Philadelphia will take on Russell Westbrook. Let the smoke die down a little and Morray come out of his fantasy. The Lakers need a player like CJ. He’d be great for them. There could be a possibility of a three team trade between Philadelphia, Blazers and Lakers.
I don't think Harris's defense is or ever has been quite as bad as a PF as CJ's is and always will be as a SG but what Harris looks like this season on defense is indicative of what he would look like on our team because the difference in this year as apposed to previous years is that he doesn't have one of the best and most versatile defenders in the league covering his ass.
