I don't have Chet as the #1 guy on my board. Wouldn't be upset if we took Banchero or Jabari over him. But the narratives are bullshit. Everything I've said is what you'll find on his scouting report and what scouts would tell you. Meanwhile, you have people out here who don't want to draft him based on the combination of his skin pigmentation and birthplace. You have people who don't want to draft him because he played in the WCC when our best player is from Weber State. You have people that can't get past the fact that he's skinny when we're the team that passed on Kevin Durant. You have people saying he fouled out all year when he fouled it in less then 10% of his games. You have people holding his tournament shooting addict him while ignoring that Jabari Smith went 3-for-16 in the 2nd round against a questionable Miami defense. You have people arguing that he can't stay in front of anyone when I watched him stay in front of guys all year long. I've never seen this much unreasonable criticism for a Top 5 in my life, and many people (not here) have come out and admitted or implied that it's because he's white.
And Dame played in the Big Sky. Ant played in high school. The dude was the #1 player in high school, and people can't get over what conference he played in?
What??? If people were saying that Giannis would get posted up successfully by Robert Convington, would you not disagree?
You say you don't have him number 1, then draw parallels to Durant and attack anyone everyone who brings up talking points against him.
1. I think you're conflating some criticism with false narratives. If anything, I think Chet's gotten a pass on some of his question marks. But you still find those concerns mentioned in a lot of his counting reports. 2. The questions aren't BS is you can't rebut them with anything other than "You're wrong." 3. No one is absolutely writing him off. I've called him a boom-or-bust prospect -- high ceiling but with high bust potential because of his frame, his offense, his reaction time, and his performance against the caliber of competition he'll face in the NBA. 4. Lillard was the sixth pick and faced a lot of the same questions and we both know that more often than not Dame and Ja are the exception, not the rule. It's fair to have a healthy dose of skepticism when a guy hasn't performed much or well against top competition. 5. Kevin Durant played an entire season at Texas AND he was 25 pounds heavier while 2 inches shorter than Chet coming into the NBA. Also, he was an exceptional offensive player and still NO ONE, not the Blazers, not anyone else was taking him over Oden at that time. And there still were concerns about his frame at the time. 6. The fouled out thing is a weird fixation for you. First, my post was about his issues getting into foul trouble against teams with quicker, bigger, stronger athletes. It was specific. It wasn't one game. It wasn't at one point in the year. It was 10 games spaced throughout the year and the trend was remarkably uniform. 7. See point 6 regarding and replace fouling with shooting. I'll add to that that the fact that he isn't getting a lot of shots is a concern for me, too. You can yell from the mountains that they didn't need to run plays for him, but I have trouble believing a Hall of Fame level coach has what I am told is such a mismatch weapon and he never takes advantage of it? That's fantastical. 8. You said I was cherry-picking but you've twice now mentioned Smith going 3-for-16 in an NCAA tourney game ... conveniently ignoring a superior body of work against a slew of teams filled with pro prospects. You write off Chet's last 3 weeks as a slump but try to equate Smith's poor shooting game with it. 9. This is where I think you go off the wagon. If I have stats and reason for criticism, it's not unreasonable. If you haven't seen a more scrutinized top 5 prospect in your life, you must have just been born. And he's a victim of reverse racism??? OMG. That's just ridiculous. If anything, he's gotten people overlooking his shortcomings than vice versa. I don't know. You just posted a bunch of wild opinion and apples and orange comparisons, Bones, and it just makes it seem to me you're personally invested in Chet more than the Blazers. Maybe that's the wrong read on it, but that's how it looks to me reading this in the context of other posts I've seen you make on the topic.
I would if that was the whole focus of the conversation. It wasn't, though. It seemed like pulling a couple of outliers and trying to use that to make a point that couldn't have been made otherwise. Seemed like kind of a weak focus.
And, let's be fair, there at least was the poor man's Larry Bird comparison that could be made with Morrison at the time. Again, though, outliers. For every Bird and Lillard and Ja that make it from mid-major schools there are dozens of players who get scouted or drafted who can't make that jump in talent level.
The NBA's not high school. Dame is an outlier, not the rule. And Ant took four years to play to the level worthy of a first-round pick. Like I said above, weird for a guy to say other people are cherry-picking criticisms with Chet based on CHET'S OWN PERFORMANCES by fixating on the two or three guys out of a couple of hundred that do make it. Those guys all faced those questions and a lot more didn't make it than did, but none of them are Chet Holmgren. It just doesn't seem like your objectivity is strong on this one, Bones.
TBH, I only brought up the WCC thing tongue in cheek (guess he ignored the smiley face while lecturing me about the PAC 12). But my point about Chet's high variance in projection remains. We have people comparing him to Durant and KG in this thread. If that's the case, he should be a consensus number 1 pick. But he isn't because I think people making mocks are just as afraid as I am that he turns out like a bust.
I don't know really what's so controversial about wondering if a guy who is 7-0, 195 pounds with narrow shoulders and hips is going to be able to physically compete with players who sometimes are 7 inches shorter that outweigh him by 25-30 pounds. For people to get triggered over that just makes me wonder where their belief in him is coming from. Same with the not playing a high-quality of competition on a regular basis like most of the others competing with him for the top draft spot.
Trevor Ariza seems like a pretty good outcome for Tari Eason. Like most here, he'd be a good target if the Pels pick conveys. Screams impact 4th-5th starter if the shooting hits to a reasonable degree (his indicators are pretty good despite some funky mechanics).
2014 Jokic was drafted 41 during a taco bell commercial. He was still in the green room where mostly top picks are hosted. He was able to go across stage but it wasnt caught on the tube.
Just to let you know, I don't give a shit that he's white. Giannis was drafted fifteenth because people were worried that he could be successfully posted up by small ball posts but no one had concerns about his level of athleticism, I know you don't have concerns about that with Chet, I do and it's not because of the color of his skin it's because he is very obviously not an elite athlete at the NBA level, when you combine that with his lack of strength it's a pretty bad sum. It means he has nothing but his guile and length to help him on the defensive end... I have his defensive bbiq at a really high level and his length isn't subjective. I just don't know if those two things will get him where he needs to be in order to be an all around solid defender at the NBA level. I think he might be a liability that needs a lot of help in a lot of defensive positions on the floor but I know he'll block a bunch of shots and pull down a bunch of boards. He might just be a shot blocking and rebounding specialist who is a liability elsewhere. Offensively, I really like what he brings. I just couldn't take a guy that I have those kinds of suspicions about with the first pick but like I just said in one of the threads building the site's big board, he's still third on my big board for this team, given his strengths and how they fit our needs. I mean, I'd rather find someone like you who is high on him and trade him if we find ourselves with him highest on our board but if we have to keep the guy we draft he's my number three. So I'm obviously not too low on him. Maybe we're a lot closer on our evaluation of Chet but I'm going overboard based on a lot of people having him as the number one prospect in this draft and you might be going a little further than your actual evaluation because you feel you have to defend him against criticism you see as unfair.
I hope if there's a player like Eason that some people think could be a defensive player of the year candidate that we take a gamble on him instead of Grant.
I'm being fully objective. Guys make it from small schools or smaller conferences all the time. The dude was the #1 player in the country and played consistently top notch competition at U19 and on the Nike circuit. Gonzaga played some tough teams during non-conference play and the WCC had 3 tournament teams (same as rhe Pac-12). Dudes played against competition.
Nobody's triggered. You're coming with some real weird energy by saying I'm triggered and claiming I have some personal connection or whatever you're on about. I've never seen Robert Covington successfully postup anyone. Arguing that he wouldn't successfully post up a 7'1 shotblocker with elite length isn't crazy. Stop gaslighting me.
The only parallel to Durant is how skinny he is. People didn't want to draft KD because of how skinny he was too. Dudes been just fine. But if I argue a narrative, that counts as attacking someone? Seriously? If thats the case, then its time to get off this forum again.
