OT Mass shooting at Highland Park, IL 4th of July parade

@riverman

https://www.statista.com/statistics/319861/taiwan-crime-rate/


“…However, it should be kept in mind that the definition of crime, the willingness to report crimes, and accounting measures may vary in different countries.

Most common crimes in Taiwan
Considering different types of crimes committed in Taiwan, excluding offenses against public safety, the most common crimes were drug and theft related. In contrast, the number of cases of murder and manslaughter were relatively low and comparable to other Asia Pacific countriessuch as Australia, New Zealand, and Hong Kong.”

https://files.eric.ed.gov/fulltext/EJ1084885.pdf

The link above shows how many hours a week a parent will spend with their child. Far exceeds Americans.

These are some of the foundational differences
Between American culture and Taiwanese culture. This difference is what i believe to be the largest contributor to the mental state of our youth. Our children are by and large neglected by parents, compared to most other countries’ cultures.

I dont see this as debatable. It continually blows my mind that these things are simply dismissed over and over and the only issue most see are the amount of guns around. This, to me, is just throwing the blinders on and pointing the finger at what is perceived as a “simple solution’ to ban guns when it will not solve the core, fundamental issues we have.

There are larger problems in much more need of fixing that will, in the end, also help decrease mass shootings. However if we do not address these core cultural behavioral patterns, it will not help stabilize the minds of our youth.

 

I hold dual citizenship and have lived in the States for more than 30 years.

It's the fucking guns. Yes, everybody is fucked up, and perhaps the US more than most, but if we got rid of the guns but kept the screens I fucking guarantee you the rate of homicide would plummet. If we did the reverse I doubt it would change at all. Do you even think that the US has the "worst" "screen time" in the world? Check South Korea. Check Japan. Then look at their homicide rates.

What is the fucking problem with getting rid of fucking guns? You think they work for self-defense? They don't. You think they're going to protect you from the government? Unless you have a small tactical nuclear weapon, the government can take you out however many guns you have. Did you not follow Waco?

Jesus.

 

Taiwanese spend 6 days a week in school and have tutors in the evenings after school so school is more important there but they are every bit as involved in screen use even in school. In Taiwan you need to pass a college entrance exam in high school to get higher education and there's a quota so parents put kids in cram schools to prepare to pass that test...that's a big pressure that kids here don't have. Education is way more part of their lives than here..but that education involves computers more than our education here as well. Taipei Times is run by mostly expat americans , just so you know, it's the local paper printed in english there....if you read the Chinese papers, it's a bit different.

 

actually the time spent with kids is not with parents...it's with grandparents...parents work long hard hours and grandparents mostly raise the kids and pick them up from school or take them to school, etc...you can ask me anything about Taiwan...I watch taiwan news daily...I don't need you to cut and paste articles about it for me...I'm sure you find it interesting but I lived and worked there and raised a child there....have nieces and nephews there, etc...so I know Taiwan. What they don't have there are guns.

 

Again its how it is used and the parental supervision/involvement other cultures have with their kids compared to us.

We shall have to agree to disagree. I fully believe if we got back to community level communication and removed the pads, etc the mental stability of our youth would increase significantly.
If we held parents as accountable for their children's common sense education as we do guns, we would all be much better off.

 

Semantics. Its family.

 

So I guess you don't give a shit about all the gun fatalities that can't even remotely be blamed on child-rearing?

 

show me how many mass shootings of innocents compare especially children in schools in those countries.....homicide is often linked to organized crime ...that's not a fair comparison to mass shootings in movie theatres hospitals, churches and schools....the IRA was at war with England so they had an armed resistance that also contributed to homicides just like our organized crime here. that's always been around. You're not selling me on guns lowering murderrates though...they don't.

 

it's not semantics...it's culture...you asked about understanding culture....I explained part of it...you don't have to understand it if you don't wish to. I understand it from decades of living there

 

So I guess you don't give a shit about the lack of quality parental supervision of children and the fragile mental state of our youth?

If you would like to have a constructive debate about this great, but lets not go down the “ you are a bad person for not agreeing with me” bull rap please. It wont do any good other than spiral into a cesspool of fingerpointing. This is not positive or constructive to finding a solution.

Your solution does nothing to address the issues with the mental state of the youth.
Mine does and I am of the opinion it will also help with the shootings.

 

It is semantics. The child isn't with a stranger baby sitter who has not personal vested interest in the child growing up healthy. A parent or grandparent does.

 

The child may very well be ...you are lumping together diverse populations into one mind set here and really...I don't care to argue about something I'm very in touch with. I have Taiwanese family and Taiwanese friends.....my wife ran a day care in Taiwan with 11 children basically raised in our home during the day...grandparents of the kids came to drop them off and pick them up...in most cases you never saw the parents. They are as complex as we are in different approaches to life choices but the value systems are very different from here in the States. If you have a question about Taiwan I'm happy to hear it but please don't try and enlighten me on a country I know and love from speculations you may have about the place. My wife was at a party once in Eugene and when we got home she said..."what is it with all these Americans who as soon as they ask where I'm from they start telling me about my culture?" It's like they don't respect my own knowledge of my homeland..

 

So you're on board with both? Because we can't fix everybody and we want to stop any shootings, right? After all, it's kind of bad for people's mental health when you can't go outside without risking your life.

 

There are a few problems with getting rid of guns.

1- We can't count on police to help us.

2- There is no evidence that gun control works, as I posted in another thread. Brazil tried, gun crime increased, they got relaxed gun control and it appears crime fell by 34%... I've posted ample evidence of other failed attempts in the From My Cold Dead Hands thread... There is just no evidence that guns are the problem. Systems which create violent people are the problem.

3- Getting rid of guns is not going to happen in the US. It's a protected right in the constitution and it doesn't impact enough people to get 38 states to agree to change that. Getting rid of guns in the American is a pipe dream. When hundreds of millions of people want something they get it. Booze, Drugs, Guns... Prohibition on these kinds of things doesn't work if the people want them.

 

This is exactly my point. So you agree with me. Got it.

 

I am. However I see one path addressing multiple issues and another path addressing a singular issue. Im for the path that solves the most issues.

 

With what? Anything? Self-defense? We sure spend a fuck ton on the police for no return. So I guess your message is: DEFUND THE POLICE! Right on, brother!

Explain Australia after the Port Arthur Massacre.

 

No, you're for BOTH paths - you just said it. Also a massive expansion of the welfare state and huge environmental regulations, because there's ample evidence that pollution, poor nutrition, poor public schools and crime-ridden neighborhoods are literally damaging kids' brains. I support you, fellow traveler!

 

apparently not because you don't think their choices to not allow guns to be privately owned is not keeping them safer than here where they can have all they want.....you think computers are the boogey man more than access to guns and ammo....this is not us agreeing and goes back to my original post....in Taiwan your child is safer at a public parade or school than in the states. Even if they have an ipad and a cell phone. For the record I'm not an advocate of video killing games for entertainment anywhere. That I have a problem with....