<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">umm maybe because i'm inside a new jersey forum? Ranked in order of average home attendance: 1 Detroit 22,076 2 Dallas 20,032 3 Chicago 19,977 4 Miami 19,856 5 New York 19,505 6 Cleveland 18,981 7 Utah 18,841 8 LA Lakers 18,812 9 San Antonio 18,278 10 Philadelphia 17,710 11 Phoenix 17,609 12 Denver 17,500 13 Sacramento 17,317 14 Minnesota 17,177 15 Toronto 17,081 16 Washington 17,063 17 LA Clippers 16,807 18 Indiana 16,806 19 Memphis 16,753 20 Seattle 16,426 21 Portland 16,415 22 Golden State 16,083 23 Houston 15,977 24 Boston 15,756 25 Milwaukee 15,597 26 New Jersey 14,841 27 Orlando 14,533 28 Charlotte 14,475 29 Atlanta 14,234 30 New Orleans 14,092 BTW, do people in the STATE of New Jersey pay attention to their own franchice?</div> no we dont thats why there moving to brooklyn
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">umm maybe because i'm inside a new jersey forum? Ranked in order of average home attendance: 1 Detroit 22,076 2 Dallas 20,032 3 Chicago 19,977 4 Miami 19,856 5 New York 19,505 6 Cleveland 18,981 7 Utah 18,841 8 LA Lakers 18,812 9 San Antonio 18,278 10 Philadelphia 17,710 11 Phoenix 17,609 12 Denver 17,500 13 Sacramento 17,317 14 Minnesota 17,177 15 Toronto 17,081 16 Washington 17,063 17 LA Clippers 16,807 18 Indiana 16,806 19 Memphis 16,753 20 Seattle 16,426 21 Portland 16,415 22 Golden State 16,083 23 Houston 15,977 24 Boston 15,756 25 Milwaukee 15,597 26 New Jersey 14,841 27 Orlando 14,533 28 Charlotte 14,475 29 Atlanta 14,234 30 New Orleans 14,092 BTW, do people in the STATE of New Jersey pay attention to their own franchice?</div> Wat does that attendence have to do with Kidd as a player
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">Btw, i wasn't wrong. Kidd is not the #2 best PG in the NBA.</div> Can you explain why you think this?
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">Btw, i wasn't wrong. Kidd is not the #2 best PG in the NBA.</div> yea ur rite hes #1 no way u look @ it hes either 1 or 2 ur just retarted(btw i dont care ban me i have to say it)
Everyone Keep the Name calling out of your post, you can discuss and debate without name calling- Henacy JBB Mod Makeoutcity, you say New Jersey is overatted, I can live with that opinion due to the fact our frontcourt is weak. And no matter how good your perimeter is you cant be a legit contender without a legit frontcourt, so I can respect. You say Richard Jeferson is overatted, hmmm..is he on a Tracy Mcgrady type leve?l no your right. But name 10 better small forwards in the league right now then RJ? He is a jumpshot away from being a consistent all-star in this league. He is one of the best rebounding wing players in this league. He is solid defensively. And is becoming a playmaker from the 3 spot, which he has shown more and more in the last season & a half. So in what aspect is he overatted? As far as the Atlantic division goes every team has their share of problems & questions going into the season. You have PP playing with a bunch of kids down there in Boston. And no legitimate veteran help...Paul maybe screaming by all-star break just to get out of there. New York is trying to gel two big egos & personalities together with Marbury & Coach Brown. Plus they have two other ball hungry players in Crawford & Richard playing alongside Marbury. Then you follow that up with the fact that they have a bench which still includes some very high proced washups in Penny,Thomas, Houston and they have a problems for days.... Philly has to get AI to actualy involve Chris Webber this season....Toronto has some nice role pieces but no real go to guy in their lineup. So like I said every team in this Atlantic has questions to answer
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting thedude9990:</div><div class="quote_post">yea ur rite hes #1 no way u look @ it hes either 1 or 2 ur just retarted(btw i dont care ban me i have to say it)</div> no, i'm not going to ban you...you know why? because ur wrong...#1 - Nash, #2 - Billups...both led their teams to the finals (except for Phoenix). Kidd is not #2, you wish he were in the top 5. you're just going to have to accept that.
haha, i dont know whats funnier you thinkin you know better or the fact that you think you can ban him
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">no, i'm not going to ban you...you know why? because ur wrong...#1 - Nash, #2 - Billups...both led their teams to the finals (except for Phoenix). Kidd is not #2, you wish he were in the top 5. you're just going to have to accept that.</div> Explain why you don't think Kidd is a top 5 point guard.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Henacy:</div><div class="quote_post">Everyone Keep the Name calling out of your post, you can discuss and debate without name calling- Henacy JBB Mod Makeoutcity, you say New Jersey is overatted, I can live with that opinion due to the fact our frontcourt is weak. And no matter how good your perimeter is you cant be a legit contender without a legit frontcourt, so I can respect. You say Richard Jeferson is overatted, hmmm..is he on a Tracy Mcgrady type level no your right. But name 10 better small forwards in the league right now then RJ? He is a jumpshot away from being a consistent all-star in this league. He is one of the best rebounding wing players in this league. He is solid defensively. And is becoming a playmaker from the 3 spot, which he has shown more and more in the last season & a half. So in what aspect is he overatted? As far as the Atlantic division goes every team has their share of problems & questions going into the season. You have PP playing with a bunch of kids down there in Boston. And no legitimate veteran help...Paul maybe screaming by all-star break just to get out of there. New York is trying to gel two big egos & personalities together with Marbury & Coach Brown. Plus they have two other ball hungry players in Crawford & Richard playing alongside Marbury. Then you follow that up with the fact that they have a bench which still includes some very high proced washups in Penny,Thomas, Houston and they have a problems for days.... Philly has to get AI to actualy involve Chris Webber this season....Toronto has some nice role pieces but no real go to guy in their lineup. So like I said every team in this Atlantic has questions to answer</div> yes, you're right. RJ is a decent player...but how about giving players like Jalen Rose some recognition...or how about? it's almost as if RJ is being compared to players like Artest, J. Rose, Bruce Bowen (who are actually consistent)...I'll admit it...Toronto has never been on track ever since they were beaten by the Sixers in the semi-finals in 2002..and since, has been on a rebuilding process every year, which seems very unttractive for nba players...but so has New Jersey.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MiamiBalla12:</div><div class="quote_post">Explain why you don't think Kidd is a top 5 point guard.</div> dude, I feel he didn't play as well as any of these other PG's did...he had a dissapointing year, while these other PG's actually took their teams to the deepend of the playoffs. i'm not bad mouthing Kidd, I'm just saying he's been off...and definitely does not deserve recognition as top 5 PG of last season.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">dude, I feel he didn't play as well as any of these other PG's did...he had a dissapointing year, while these other PG's actually took their teams to the deepend of the playoffs. i'm not bad mouthing Kidd, I'm just saying he's been off...and definitely does not deserve recognition as top 5 PG of last season.</div> He played better than most healthy PG. None of the Players you mentiioned took their teams fartherinto the playoffs besides Billups and Nash.
Just to answer some of the stuff that has been said in this thread. One New Jerseys attendance is so low, because relatively they have one of the oldest stadiums in the league it offers very few features/comforts to the fans who go to the games, and is in a horrible location. The attendance numbers are really far from the truth when it comes to the number of fans that follow that team. I know this, because I lived in NJ for a couple years. Also someone said ? no one follows them that's why were moving to Brooklyn? it?s hard to tell if that was a sarcastic post from a computer screen, but in case it wasn?t that is not the case once so ever. The case is that Jay Z and the ownership group who bought the Nets are business people, and realize the location of Brooklyn will bring more money into their pockets then ?The Swamp?. Also Jay is from Brooklyn (as everyone knows) so he wants to contribute something back to the community by bringing them a NBA organization. MakeOutCity as you stated Billups and Nash are two elite point guards in the league, but personally I would rank Billups behind Kidd still not by much but by a little. I am not a Nets fan either so you know this is non-bias. The reason behind my thinking is that if you watch Jason Kidd play he is the ideal point guard he not only runs the offense well, but he puts his teammates in the best situation to succeed. Ask people such as Kenyon Martin, a great player, but he never new how hard it was to score on his own until this season in Denver. Jason would always find him open down low or on the break getting him a lot of points, but now in Denver Andre Miller does not do that as much. Edit: By the way you are correct if you say he was not one of the top five best point guards in the league ?last season?, but if you look at what he has done when he has been healthy he is.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MAKEOUTCITY:</div><div class="quote_post">dude, I feel he didn't play as well as any of these other PG's did...he had a dissapointing year, while these other PG's actually took their teams to the deepend of the playoffs. i'm not bad mouthing Kidd, I'm just saying he's been off...and definitely does not deserve recognition as top 5 PG of last season.</div> Being off last season becuase he wasn't 100% doesn't mean hes going to be off this coming season. All the point guards you named did not take their teams deep into the playoffs. AI-lost 1st round Marbury- didn't make it Francis- didn't make it Hinrich- Duhon was starting point guard Palacio- The players I named did not get their teams farther than Kidd took the Nets in the playoffs.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MiamiBalla12:</div><div class="quote_post">Being off last season becuase he wasn't 100% doesn't mean hes going to be off this coming season. All the point guards you named did not take their teams deep into the playoffs. AI-lost 1st round Marbury- didn't make it Francis- didn't make it Hinrich- Duhon was starting point guard Palacio- The players I named did not get their teams farther than Kidd took the Nets in the playoffs.</div> Thats exactly what i mean. He only mentioned Nash and Billups that went farther in the playoffs.
Makeoutcity, Jalen Rose is a cat I got love for but you and I both know he is not consistent. And he is a me first player, who has a tendancy to put himself beforw team goals...that is why his stay in alot of spot like Indy etc always end badly. He isnt better than RJ. Brue Bowen defensively of course he is better...but in what other aspect is he better...I'll give you spot up shooter as well. But Bowen isnt even a true shooter, he can realistically only shoot from one spot on the court. Ron Artest when focused is the only person you mentioned that is a better all-around player than RJ.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting playmaker14:</div><div class="quote_post">Yes, and somehting like that won't help you either.</div> I was pointing out the fact that Ignignot did forget to mention Vince Carter in the lineup, and he himself admitted that will void half his argument. But you? You were stating that the Nets are flat out the best team in the Atlantic without giving any supporting arguments.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">no, i'm not going to ban you...you know why? because ur wrong...#1 - Nash, #2 - Billups...both led their teams to the finals (except for Phoenix). Kidd is not #2, you wish he were in the top 5. you're just going to have to accept that.</div> WHat did Kidd do for two or three years straight? Lead the Nets to the finals correct? Just wanted to clear that up 4 ya. By the way, you can't ban anyone. Since when was Nash in the finals? Apparently I was watching the wrong playoffs right?
Also, you have to take into account that the Nets play in the middle of nowhere, so its hard for the working people to be able to get out to the Airlines Arena for a 7:00-7:30 start every night. So the Nets cant bring back the consistent type of attendance & fan base that a team like the Knicks who are located in the middle of downtown New York on 34th street. And there is like a thousand different methods of getting to the game. If you dont drive to the Airlines Arena, it is vitrually no other way to get there, that is quick & convient.
I didn't even bother reading MAKEOUTCITY's post because he obviously doesn't understand basketball outside of flashy scoring and dunks... Marbury, Francis in the top 5? That's pathetic. utterly pathetic. The List should look like this more or less Kidd Nash Baron Bibby Arenas/Cassell (when healthy) Chauncey Billups Hinrich Marbury Tony Parker Andre Miller Push everyone down one if you consider Iverson a point gaurd. He's not the #1 point gaurd per say, but he's the best player out of the bunch. Kidd has the best point gaurd skills but it's undeniable that Iverson is the better player at point gaurd.. However, I rather start a team with Jason than Iverson. Mike James doesn't even start on his own team and he's top 10? Francis doesn't even play point gaurd anymore and when he does he turns it over and doesnt get his teammates involved. I would take all those players even Deron Williams, Chris Paul, Jamaal Tinsley, Shaun Livingston, Telfair over him. He's a cancer and makes teams lose. That's the truth. Anyone who's watched basketball...even people who call Kidd a wifebeater say he's atleast top 2 pointgaurd in the NBA. I will go to each forum and ask for the top 5 point gaurds and I garuntee you 99%, if not 100% will say Kidd is atleast top 2. Now that is a horrible opinion.
