Wade can post up, he has a lot of upper body strength. He can't shoot three's, but he's working really hard on it. His midrange game is great, and he'll knock it down whenever left open. The statistic advantage over Kobe is overhwelming, I really proved my point fairly well, you can look it up yourself. All the Kobe supporters have no argument, all they can say is that "Kobe is waaaay better then Wade, just because!" You obviously have nothing remotely intelligible to say, I suggest you stop bashing opinions, without providing any statistic, or logical explanation to back it up.
^^ i'm not providing any stats cause this topic is so redundant and i have already posted a bunch. I'll give you statistically wade wins, he gets 2.5 more assists, gets one more rebound a game and shoots like 3.6% better(earlier you rounded to prove ur point and make it sound liek 5%) Those assists are big, one rebound i don't think makes a huge difference However wade's stats do not overwhelm kobe's, Wade's 3pt% is horrible, you're acting like that doesn't matter at all simply because he's working on his shot, he's averaging 6 less points a game which is another thing that is far from negligible. Kobe also is more reliable at the free throw line. There are a few ways you can go with this like argueing that wade has more ppl to pass the ball to or that he plays in a weaker division, but I think what people talked about before is more important. If you had to pick kobe or wade to d-up the best gaurd on the other team, every coach would pick kobe. Kobe has more experience and is clutch. Kobe doesn't have a big man to play around, i know shaq is gone but Zo is playing like one of the best centers in the league. You need to stop trying to call people out as well and try to use stats that you know nothing about. The stats are not overwhelming they're just in wade's favor, you got assists and fg%, you talked about wade being a better shot blocker why is that because your statistics told you he gets .33 more a game? You rely too much on stats and tell yourself u're right, you claim noone is presenting an arguement but it's because your not understanding or not paying attention.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting rafy:</div><div class="quote_post">This post is soooo stoooopid.... Wade can post up, he has a lot of upper body strength. He can't shoot three's, but he's working really hard on it. His midrange game is great, and he'll knock it down whenever left open. The statistic advantage over Kobe is overhwelming, I really proved my point fairly well, you can look it up yourself. All the Kobe supporters have no argument, all they can say is that "Kobe is waaaay better then Wade, just because!" You obviously have nothing remotely intelligible to say, I suggest you stop bashing opinions, without providing any statistic, or logical explanation to back it up.</div> Well I have been following the argument thus far and I have been reading you and shape go back and forth over this Kobe vs Wade thing. Honestly there is no Kobe vs Wade because any NBA analyst and fan of the game would know Kobe is better than Wade (at least for now). You use this seasons stats to make some sort of point and ignore all other factors... well shoot Kobe fans can easily do the same and tear you a new asshole you know that right? For instance... lets just look at stats (you did ask for statistical support right?): Ok go check Wade's CAREER stats. Go compare them to Kobe's. Kobe has him in points, rebounds, FT%, 3Pt%, and they are statistically close in pretty much everything else except turnovers (Wade averages more turnovers than Kobe). So statistically Wade is not superior to Kobe and in fact still lags behind Kobe in a number of categories despite being a go to guy in only his third season. Ok... but you can't just be a statisticall god can you? Just ask Malone or Ewing or Barkely. These guys wanted hardware. So lets take a look at that: Kobe has three rings. Kobe has a number of Western Conference championships. Kobe has multiple All-Star appearances. All-Defensive team Appearances. All-NBA Appearances. What does Wade have? Nada. The lesson to be learnt: One season does not a player make. No one is disputing whether or not Wade is having a better statistical season than Kobe so far. We are arguing whether Kobe is still the best guard in the NBA. So to use this seasons stats to argue your point is not only ignorant but disrespectful as well since you are basically making a point for Paul Peirce being better than Kobe or a number of other guards being better than he is when they aren't. So lets do what an intelligent basketball fan would do. Look at the other factors. Kobe's teammates. Kobe being in the Western conference. Wade being in the eastern conference. And what about just what we can tell by how they play and what we know of them besides stats? Kobe's desire to win. His ability to make the clutch play? His facilitating an offense that so many players are finding difficult to learn for several years, winning several championships, and just dominating the NBA for several years.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Well I have been following the argument thus far and I have been reading you and shape go back and forth over this Kobe vs Wade thing. Honestly there is no Kobe vs Wade because any NBA analyst and fan of the game would know Kobe is better than Wade (at least for now). You use this seasons stats to make some sort of point and ignore all other factors... well shoot Kobe fans can easily do the same and tear you a new asshole you know that right?</div> Just because someone says something, does not make them right. Not when you have asshats like SAS. Honestly I don't care what they think, it's impossible to prove Kobe is better then Wade. I use the season becuase 1stThis argument is regarding current day statistics, not what kobe did five years ago. 2nd Wade is still in his rookie contract, it's impossible to compare career statistics, because Wade was only getting 16 ppg in his rookie season, which was twice as much as Kobe got. I do not know they can tore me a new asshole, because it's as far from the truth as you can get. They couldn't, because they have no case. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Ok go check Wade's CAREER stats. Go compare them to Kobe's. Kobe has him in points, rebounds, FT%, 3Pt%, and they are statistically close in pretty much everything else except turnovers (Wade averages more turnovers than Kobe). So statistically Wade is not superior to Kobe and in fact still lags behind Kobe in a number of categories despite being a go to guy in only his third season.</div> This is complete BS, as I explained, this has nothing to do with career stats, and it is completely unfair to compare Wade's 3 year career, to Kobe's 10 or so. Even suggesting this proves how much you thought this out. Like I said before, Wade is currently leading Kobe in almost every statistical catagory. Let us not mention that he is on a bad team, and should be producing MASSIVE numbers. The only thing Wade is lagging is 3pt % FT% and PGG. Remind me if I forgot anything. (Note: I am talking about this season, for reasons that I explained, and his TO ratio, is because Wade is 1 assist away from getting twice as many as Kobe.) <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe has three rings. Kobe has a number of Western Conference championships. Kobe has multiple All-Star appearances. All-Defensive team Appearances. All-NBA Appearances. What does Wade have? Nada. </div> BS. Wade, in 3 seasons already made the all-star game, and has recieved numerous awards. Rings mean jack squat, does that make Malone inferior to Mark Madsen? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The lesson to be learnt: One season does not a player make. No one is disputing whether or not Wade is having a better statistical season than Kobe so far. We are arguing whether Kobe is still the best guard in the NBA. So to use this seasons stats to argue your point is not only ignorant but disrespectful as well since you are basically making a point for Paul Peirce being better than Kobe or a number of other guards being better than he is when they aren't.</div> BS. How am I supposed to compare Wade to Kobe? It's the only way because Wade is so young. Yes, we are arguing whether Kobe is better then Wade this season. If he is still the best guard in the NBA is dictated season by season, RIGHT NOW IS THIS SEASON! I'm cracking up right now. PP's stats are worse then Kobe, besides his fg %. I never said such a thing, or implied such a think, you're being silly, stop assuming things. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">So lets do what an intelligent basketball fan would do. Look at the other factors. Kobe's teammates. Kobe being in the Western conference. Wade being in the eastern conference. And what about just what we can tell by how they play and what we know of them besides stats? Kobe's desire to win. His ability to make the clutch play? His facilitating an offense that so many players are finding difficult to learn for several years, winning several championships, and just dominating the NBA for several years.</div> Let us. Kobe's teammates are bad, agreed. This means he should do what every other star on a bad team does, GET MASSIVE STATISTICS. He should be completely domininating everyone, the way you paint him out to be. Kobe has been in that offense for around 10 years, he should be fully accustomed to it, and should thrive in it. Wade has a desire to win, he practically wills his way to a win. Wade has been known to hit the clutch shot as well. Rings are besides the point. Jordan has been dominating the NBA for many years.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I'll give you statistically wade wins, he gets 2.5 more assists, gets one more rebound a game and shoots like 3.6% better(earlier you rounded to prove ur point and make it sound liek 5%) Those assists are big, one rebound i don't think makes a huge difference </div> Kobe Bryant: 32.1 PPG, 4.1 APG, 5.3 RPG, FG% .416, 1.19 SPG .50 BPG Dwyane Wade: 25.8 PPG, 6.7 APG, 6.5 RPG, FG% .452, 2.28 SPG, .83 BPG You accuse me of rounding, because it's much easier, and then you yourself do it. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">However wade's stats do not overwhelm kobe's, Wade's 3pt% is horrible, you're acting like that doesn't matter at all simply because he's working on his shot, he's averaging 6 less points a game which is another thing that is far from negligible. Kobe also is more reliable at the free throw line.</div> Kobe: 13-52 3PM-A, .250. Wade: 2-24 3PM-A, .083. At the very least, he knows not to force the weaknesses in his game. Right now, Kobe isn't shooting three balls good, but in general he is a lot, lot better then Wade. He is averaging 6 less points a game because he took a lot less shots. Kobe: 191-459 FGM-A, FG% .416. Wade: 165-365 FGM-A, .452. Agreed, he is a better free throw shooter. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">There are a few ways you can go with this like argueing that wade has more ppl to pass the ball to or that he plays in a weaker division, but I think what people talked about before is more important. If you had to pick kobe or wade to d-up the best gaurd on the other team, every coach would pick kobe. Kobe has more experience and is clutch. Kobe doesn't have a big man to play around, i know shaq is gone but Zo is playing like one of the best centers in the league.</div> All fine and well. But Kobe should be statistically dominating Wade, because of his rubbish team. Your hypocrisy on the matter amuses me. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You need to stop trying to call people out as well and try to use stats that you know nothing about. The stats are not overwhelming they're just in wade's favor, you got assists and fg%, you talked about wade being a better shot blocker why is that because your statistics told you he gets .33 more a game? You rely too much on stats and tell yourself u're right, you claim noone is presenting an arguement but it's because your not understanding or not paying attention.</div> I know a lot more then you. They are overwhelming. He is a better shot blocker, Wade has been praised throughout his career has one of the better shot blocking guards, even in college. I guess you don't watch enough basketball? I use stats as a tool to assist me in my opinions. They are not presenting an argument, because what they said is blind ignorance, and not thought out opinions.
^^ i keep trying to leave but u pull me back in, how does a bad team mean he should statistically dominate? if you don't have options around you you're not gonna get as many open looks(fg%) or as many oppurtunities for assists. You insult ppl for not backing up what they say but one of ur reasonings is "i know a lot more" and throw in words into sentences that don't make sense like your use of hypocrisy.
I heard someone mention we shouldn't include Lebron in this discussion, wasn't this discussion originally who's the best perimeter player? besides Lebron handles the ball as much as any guard and then some, how many times have we seen him run the point? Everybody mention Lebron's lack of defense, which granted is a fair point but how many people have knocked Magic for his less then stellar defence? At least right now lebron is averaging more steals and blocks then some of the other's mentiones.
<font color=""Red"">No need to get personal, let's keep this debate clean. </font> If you want to make an argument, Dwayne Wade is statistically better than Kobe this season, there's nothing to debate. However, if you get passed the statistic argument and break down each player's game, Kobe Bryant has a decisive edge. Kobe is a complete player, because he can do it all on the court. He can play three positions effectively on both ends of the court. Kobe Bryant's perimeter game is better than Wade. The difference is the amount of shots Kobe can convert from the mid range. He's has the pull up jumper, the kiss off the glass, catch and shoot, the spin fade, and his new move passing his arms under the defender to draw the and one.
If talking about individual talents then Kobe is probably ahead of DWade and maybe Lebron, but basketball is a team sport. Kobe does not make his team mates better he never has. People will argue his current teamates lack talent which is not true. A star player makes those around them better, look at what Lebron did for his teamates. Two years ago was anyone talking about zydrunas? no. now he's an allstar. Before Gooden joined up with Lebron most people didn't even know who he was, now he's been close to averaging a double double. Kobe has Lamar Odum who is a much better player then either Gooden or Z, but not only is Odum not playing to his potential he's actually playing worse then he did in Miami. Also look how Dwade has turned Haslem from an unknown undrafted player into a legit power forward. Who has Kobe helped among any of his teamates? For all we know he's probably hurting the devlopment of a few of them.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Johnnybrasco:</div><div class="quote_post">If talking about individual talents then Kobe is probably ahead of DWade and maybe Lebron, but basketball is a team sport. Kobe does not make his team mates better he never has. People will argue his current teamates lack talent which is not true. A star player makes those around them better, look at what Lebron did for his teamates. Two years ago was anyone talking about zydrunas? no. now he's an allstar. Before Gooden joined up with Lebron most people didn't even know who he was, now he's been close to averaging a double double. Kobe has Lamar Odum who is a much better player then either Gooden or Z, but not only is Odum not playing to his potential he's actually playing worse then he did in Miami. Also look how Dwade has turned Haslem from an unknown undrafted player into a legit power forward. Who has Kobe helped among any of his teamates? For all we know he's probably hurting the devlopment of a few of them.</div> Zydrunas Ilgauskas was a household name before LeBron James came along, and so was Drew Gooden. Once Ilgauskas recovered from his foot injuries, he was able to put up All-Star numbers. He put up 17/7 the year before LeBron James. Drew Gooden was the #4 overall draft pick and all world in college basketball. He was also a well known player before LeBron James. He has benefitted from LeBron James, but he's also playing a career high in minutes. Lamar Odom is a waste of a basketball player. It has nothing to do with Kobe Bryant, Odom is a stat padder, deficient in the fundamentals of the game, and is an overpaid 3rd option. Odom will never play up to his potential, because he's lazy and doesn't care about the outcome of games. Udonis Haslem benefits a lot more from Shaq than Wade. Let's also not take away his work ethic from being a major part of him being effective on the court. Also the fact he played increased minutes once Brian Grant was traded to the Lakers. The way the Lakers team has been constructed doesn't compliment Kobe at all. If you watch the games, you'll see how frustrating it is to play with the type of role players Kobe has. Why doesn't Kobe have more assists? For starters, neither Mihm or Kwame can catch a pass in traffic, and both are terrible finishers. Neither play above the rim for 7 footers and they are out of position 85% of the time. It's one thing to be open on the court when Kobe gets double teamed, but you also have to position yourself to create an angle so Kobe can get you the ball. Neither understand that. These 3 obstacles make it harder for Kobe... 1) Not creating passing angles for Kobe (being out of position in the Triangle) 2) Not catching the pass 3) Not going up strong and finishing the play Plus teams are not afraid to foul either Mihm or Kwame, because they shoot a lousy percentage at the free throw line. Now let's look at the perimeter players Kobe is dealing with. Originally Lamar Odom was put in a position to receive a lot of wide open looks from the perimeter. During those games he shot, (10 for 35) 28.6% from behind the arc. Phil Jackson was forced to make an adjustment with Odom in the Triangle and get him more in the post. This adjustment had to be made, because Odom doesn't know how to move without the ball. Instead of slashing to the basket when Kobe is double or triple teamed, he camped out on the perimeter and bricked wide open looks. Since the adjustment, allowing Odom to get a better rhythm in the offense, he's shooting 38.8% from behind the arc. The other starter on the perimeter is Smush Parker. He's a very inconsistent player and isn't your ideal option to take a perimeter shot. He's not really a catch and shoot player, which is why Sasha Vujacic has been playing more minutes in crunch time and delivering. Smush is at his best when he's on the break, because he's a great finisher.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting rafy:</div><div class="quote_post">Wade can post up, he has a lot of upper body strength. He can't shoot three's, but he's working really hard on it. His midrange game is great, and he'll knock it down whenever left open. The statistic advantage over Kobe is overhwelming, I really proved my point fairly well, you can look it up yourself. All the Kobe supporters have no argument, all they can say is that "Kobe is waaaay better then Wade, just because!" You obviously have nothing remotely intelligible to say, I suggest you stop bashing opinions, without providing any statistic, or logical explanation to back it up.</div> Here's a statistic advantage ... When Shaq missed games as a Laker, Kobe led the team to more wins than Wade has in Shaq's absence.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting rafy:</div><div class="quote_post">Just because someone says something, does not make them right. Not when you have asshats like SAS. Honestly I don't care what they think, it's impossible to prove Kobe is better then Wade. I use the season becuase 1stThis argument is regarding current day statistics, not what kobe did five years ago. 2nd Wade is still in his rookie contract, it's impossible to compare career statistics, because Wade was only getting 16 ppg in his rookie season, which was twice as much as Kobe got. <font color="Red">Hold on a minute now!!! Check the beginning of the thread and tell me who started this thread. Oh damn... it was me wasn't it? So how are YOU going to tell ME what this "argument is regarding"?! Its my argument to begin with and I asked whether or not Kobe Bryant was STILL the premier perimeter player in the league... not whether he is the best perimeter player in the league this season. </font> I do not know they can tore me a new asshole, because it's as far from the truth as you can get. They couldn't, because they have no case. This is complete BS, as I explained, this has nothing to do with career stats, and it is completely unfair to compare Wade's 3 year career, to Kobe's 10 or so. Even suggesting this proves how much you thought this out. <font color="Red">Again... why does it have nothing to do with career stats? So if Wade falls down and breaks his hip and is never the same again (God forbid) would he still be a better perimeter player than Kobe? No. He is having a better statistical season so far... Kobe has has had better stats for several years and is having to adjust to playing with this new team. </font> Like I said before, Wade is currently leading Kobe in almost every statistical catagory. Let us not mention that he is on a bad team, and should be producing MASSIVE numbers. The only thing Wade is lagging is 3pt % FT% and PGG. Remind me if I forgot anything. (Note: I am talking about this season, for reasons that I explained, and his TO ratio, is because Wade is 1 assist away from getting twice as many as Kobe.) <font color="Red">There is no reason for us to argue about whether or not Wade has better stats than Kobe does so far this season. I agreed with you several times on that issue. Go start your own thread and argue that if you must. This thread is not about one season. </font> BS. Wade, in 3 seasons already made the all-star game, and has recieved numerous awards. Rings mean jack squat, does that make Malone inferior to Mark Madsen? <font color="Red">No... but all other factors being equal... Rings can be the difference between one of the best and the greatest players in the game. Jordan without his rings is not regarded as the greatest Ever... I guarantee that. </font> BS. How am I supposed to compare Wade to Kobe? It's the only way because Wade is so young. Yes, we are arguing whether Kobe is better then Wade this season. If he is still the best guard in the NBA is dictated season by season, RIGHT NOW IS THIS SEASON! <font color="Red">*sigh*</font> I'm cracking up right now. PP's stats are worse then Kobe, besides his fg %. I never said such a thing, or implied such a think, you're being silly, stop assuming things. <font color="Red">I am not even sure what you are saying here... but Paul Pierce's stats are better than Kobe's this season. Thus using your argument that this seasons stats are proof of who is the better player that would mean that Paul Pierce is a better perimeter player than Kobe is. Am I missing something here?</font> Let us. Kobe's teammates are bad, agreed. This means he should do what every other star on a bad team does, GET MASSIVE STATISTICS. He should be completely domininating everyone, the way you paint him out to be. Kobe has been in that offense for around 10 years, he should be fully accustomed to it, and should thrive in it. Wade has a desire to win, he practically wills his way to a win. Wade has been known to hit the clutch shot as well. Rings are besides the point. Jordan has been dominating the NBA for many years.</div> <font color="Red">And like everyone else is saying... the fact that Kobe has a horrible team does not equate to monster stats. Just like T-Mac playing for Orlando it equates instead to a high scoring average but struggles in just about every other area because teams can forget about everyone else and focus on Kobe. If you can't see that then I am done with this arguement. </font>
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">Here's a statistic advantage ... When Shaq missed games as a Laker, Kobe led the team to more wins than Wade has in Shaq's absence.</div> That's a great point....except that Kobe was not playing with Antoine Walker going 0-10 (check the box score from earlier this week) or a scoring point guard. Kobe was playing with Fish/GP and Slava/Horry/Malone. Here's a statistical advantage. I don't have proof, but I would bet that Wade's shooting % without Shaq on the floor is better than Kobe's was without Shaq on the floor. After all Wade shot .465 in his rookie year, and .478 in his sophmore year once Shaq joined. I'm not necessarily saying that Wade is better, but simply that these meaningless situational stats can be used to argue either side.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Johnnybrasco:</div><div class="quote_post">If talking about individual talents then Kobe is probably ahead of DWade and maybe Lebron, but basketball is a team sport. Kobe does not make his team mates better he never has. People will argue his current teamates lack talent which is not true. A star player makes those around them better, look at what Lebron did for his teamates. Two years ago was anyone talking about zydrunas? no. now he's an allstar. Before Gooden joined up with Lebron most people didn't even know who he was, now he's been close to averaging a double double. Kobe has Lamar Odum who is a much better player then either Gooden or Z, but not only is Odum not playing to his potential he's actually playing worse then he did in Miami. Also look how Dwade has turned Haslem from an unknown undrafted player into a legit power forward. Who has Kobe helped among any of his teamates? For all we know he's probably hurting the devlopment of a few of them.</div> Actually Lamar Odom has been a walking triple double since playing with Kobe and the Lakers. His stats have all gone up since coming to LA from Miami. But more is expected of him... and thats not on Kobe. Now lets be fair here. Ilgauskus would be a top center in the league Lebron or no Lebron. Ilguaskus and Gooden would start on most teams... Mihm and Parker? Not a chance... those guys are second string on a lot of teams and third string on some. It is pretty obvious the Lakers lack talent. But talent is not necessarily a huge problem in the triangle offense. IQ is. And its starting to look like some of the Laker players lack even that...
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Jurassic:</div><div class="quote_post">That's a great point....except that Kobe was not playing with Antoine Walker going 0-10 (check the box score from earlier this week) or a scoring point guard. Kobe was playing with Fish/GP and Slava/Horry/Malone. Here's a statistical advantage. I don't have proof, but I would bet that Wade's shooting % without Shaq on the floor is better than Kobe's was without Shaq on the floor. After all Wade shot .465 in his rookie year, and .478 in his sophmore year once Shaq joined. <font color="Red"> I'm not necessarily saying that Wade is better, but simply that these meaningless situational stats can be used to argue either side.</font></div> Very much in agreement. At some point we have to get away from the stats and watch them both play and use judgement.
Kobe vs. The NBA world argument Is Kobe playing his best? No, he is capable are far better, as seen in the past. Is Kobe still the best Shooting Guard in the league: Yes Is Kobe the Best player in the League? No Does he have the talent and potential to becomet he best player in the League? Yes, but as long as Shaq, TD and KG are at or near their primes, Kobe will not be considered the best in the league, due to the enormous presence that each of them carry as bigger players. Kobe has been the league's best shooting guard for the last 6 years, has one numerous awards, along with 3 championship rings, Kobe is a great scorer and has arguably the best mid range game in the league(which in today's game is uncommon). He is unstoppable off the dribble, is exceptional in the post, and is one of the best perimeter defenders in the league. He is the best player in the clutch since Michael Jordan and Reggie Miller(I remember that Miller just retired, I am referring to him in his prime), who can hit game winning shots, either from the field or the line, with ruthless efficiency. His shot selection is inadequate to say the least and is the weakest part of his game. But there are reasons for that. The Lakers do not have a any other exceptional scorers to aid Bryant. Lamar Odom is more a versatile talent than pure scorer. The Lakers are still learning the Triangle offense with Kobe as the centerpiece. Until the Lakers get either the new offense down, or acquire better players to complement Kobe, things will stay the same, Kobe will still chuck up 30 plus shots a game, and the Lakers will continue to dwell in mediocrity. In terms of positional competition, here is my take on the three challengers. 1. Tracy McGrady: I do believe that T-Mac is a better natural talent than Kobe(But not by a lot), due the nature of his ability to do great feats with such visible ease. The advantage I give Kobe is that he works so hard to be the best both in and off season, while T-Mac seems to mostly play off of natural talent with no visible appearance of effort. Their ball handling, shooting, rebounding, and passing numbers for their careers are similar, but the area where Kobe has an advantage is in defense. Kobe has been a perennial member of the All-NBA defensive team from the 1999-2000 thru 2003-2004 seasons, where McGrady has shown the ability to be an exceptional defender, such as his performance against Glenn Robinson several years ago, but has not shown to be a consistent defender night in and night out, nor has he ever made never the All-Defensive team. 2. Dwyane Wade: This argument is still to soon to truly debate, given that Wade is only in his third year in the league. Given, DWade is an awesome talent, whose daring forays into the lane provide glimpses of that one guy who played for Chicago back in the 90's(Just playing). Wade is a versatile and still developing talent with a cut-throat, take no prisoners attitude that has taken the league by storm. He is versatile, and appears to be admirably humble off the court, making him marketable to corporate America. To truly test whether he is better than Bryant will take some more head to head matchups between the Heat and the Lakers over the next few seasons. Technically speaking, DWade had a statistically better rookie year than Kobe did, but people tend to forget several facts about Kobe's early career in comparison to DWade's. A. Kobe was drafted out of high school as the national player of the year and number 1 ranked prospect, whose skill level was impressive enough to even be considered to be draftable by pro teams out of high school at shooting guard, where all previous high school entries had been either centers of power forwards(Moses Malone, Bill Willowby, Shawn Kemp, Kevin Garnett, Darryl Dawkins) and good enough for then Laker General Manager Jerry West to consider trading reliable veteran Vlade Divac to Charlotte for Kobe on draft night. DWade was a good prospect out of high school but not on the level Kobe was on at the same age. In Chicago, one of the premier basketball cities in the world, Wade went under the radar under such high school stars as fellow Chicagoan Eddy Curry, LA superstar Tyson Chandler, and New Jersey wunder(deliberately spelled this way) kid Dajuan Wagner who were the top talents in the nation in the class of 2001. DWade developed his game over time into the dominant force that he is today, where Kobe has been considered a basketball prodigy since high school, whose charisma, smile and background had recruiters, scouts, and corporate executives waiting for his announcment to enter the NBA draft. B. In his first few seasons in the league leading up to the Laker's Dynasty years, Kobe played on a high tier playoff team that featured the game's most dominant inside presence in Shaq, and had a starting lineup that had then All-Star Eddie Jones, then emerging star Nick Van Exel(All Star in 1998), and exceptional role players in Rick Fox, Robert Horry, Derek Fisher and Elden Campbell. His shots attempts were limited, both by the Laker's system catering to the more seasoned veterans, and by spiteful coach Del Harris, who clearly did not trust in Bryant's ability, due to his age and overconfidence. Even despite that, Kobe still average 7.7 points per game in limited minutes and shot attempts, led all scorers in the Rookie All Star Game(31) as a rookie, won the Slam Dunk contest. In his second year, he was voted the youngest starter in NBA All-Star game history in 1998(his second year) scoring 18 points in his much anticipated matchup with Michael Jordan(MJ won the MVP of course) and was voted to the All-NBA team in only his third year out of high school in the strike reduced 1998-1999 season, all while playing on a championship calibur team where he was not initially the number one option offensively. 3. Lebron James: LBJ has the biggest upside of any player in the league, and has replaced Kobe as the league's Chosen One, due to the fact that his ascension to superstardom since high school is truly made of the stuff of legends, and that Kobe has in essence shot himself in the foot with his on court and off court behavior over the last several years that has tarnished his marketability with the media and with fans. LBJ is truly a phenomenal talent offensively with court vision and athletic ability in a strong body that only comes once in a generation. Kobe's advantage(at least for now) is his defensive abilities and clutch play ability, which is mainly due to his years in the league due to the fact that he is older than James. Lebron's bigger and stronger body along with already versatile ability is prepping him for his ascension to becoming the best player in the league for the next 2 decades, unless Kobe either greatly counters him, or some other up and coming superstar eclipses even James, such as high school junior O.J. Mayo or freshman superstars Renardo Sidney and/or Demetrius Walker upon there entries into the NBA years from now.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting The Show:</div><div class="quote_post">all previous high school entries had been either centers of power forwards(Moses Malone, Bill Willowby, Shawn Kemp, Kevin Garnett, Darryl Dawkins)</div> It has nothing to do with the debate, but I feel obligated to point out that Oscar Robertson was a point guard and came out of high school. He's not an easy player to forget, but you conveniently did so. Anyway, that whole section that you typed on Kobe read a lot more like a biography than an actual argument. You talked about where he came from and got his start, but you really proved nothing other than that it your opinion he is the best 2 in the league.
Oscar Robertson went to Crispus Attucks high school in Indianapolis, Indiana back in the day, and attended the University of Cincinnati after graduation, where he would become the NCAA's all-time leading scorer, until fellow Hall of Famer Pete Maravich broke his scoring record in the late 60's and early 70's. He did not come into the NBA out of high school. And I thank you for your unwitting comment that my argument sounded more like a biography than an actual argument. It just shows that I do not come off as a ranting fool as some on these forums would.
Haha, I'll admit when I'm wrong. Who was the original player to come out of high school? I'm obviously confusing him with someone. Even though I was wrong about O (frankly, I believe that all that information you just spat at me came from a quick Google, rather than your own head right?), you still proved nothing. Kobe's potential as a kid is irrelevant in whether he is the best sg today.
