Wake me up when the Vladimir Radmanovic experiment is over.

Discussion in 'Oklahoma City Thunder' started by odde23, Jan 7, 2006.

  1. odde23

    odde23 JBB Not A JustBBall Member

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    So we barely beat the worst current team and lost convincingly to the best current team. Somehow I remain unimpressed.

    Figure this one out though. Evans is playing the best ball of his life, Radmanovic, the worst. So what is Hill thinking?

    Start Fortson if you don't like Evans, but we need a rebounder in the first unit.

    I am near the point where I feel this team needs blowing up and starting over. I don't even enjoy watching very much anymore. I look at the games much like I look at a bar fight, just hoping something interesting happens.
     
  2. Casual

    Casual JBB First Team

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    We have to take risks to win with this talent. The Sonics playing with Radman fulfilling his potential would be a lot better than the Sonics playing with Evans who has pretty much peaked.

    The question is, as it has always been with Radman, will he ever live up to his potential? I think he could grab 8 boards a game if he really applied himself, but right now he's too intent on being a shooter. I think Bob Hill is taking a chance that he can mold Vladimir into a better player in order to make the Sonics a better team later. Sure, Reggie would grab more rebounds and play stiffer defense, but in the long run he's not the answer.
     
  3. Sir Desmond

    Sir Desmond JBB Stig!

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    At least with a bar fight you can make something happen personally.
     
  4. psheehy

    psheehy Beaten down by the "MAN"

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    I think Hill's issue is that Reggie in the post stops the flow of the offense. He does not draw a double team and the rest of the team just stands around and watches. He likes to have better spacing and more motion on offense with Ray coming off a lot of screens and Lewis working the post.
     
  5. Roland Hood

    Roland Hood JBB JustBBall Member

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    Yeah I think the ball movement is a lot better, we swung the ball nicely around the perimeter a few times because the defense had to run out on Rad.

    Also, Vlad can make plays, better than Rashard actually. I mean he can pump fake, suck the defense and dish it off, Euro style. Unfortunatley, he needs to finish better, he hardly every finishes at the rim even though he tries.

    So that's better for our offense, a lot better than watching us clear out for Ray and let him fling up a 3.

    It remains to be seen if we can rebound and stop people consistently with this lineup, but that's when we put Collison, Evans and Fortson in.
     
  6. psheehy

    psheehy Beaten down by the "MAN"

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    Rad used to finish better, but I think teams are better prepared for his drive this year since he did use it more last year than in previous years. Of course that means he needs to adjust and develop that midrange pull up we saw flashes of early in the season. If you have those three weapons the defenses struggle to find a solution. Right now they are telling his man to get close and stop the three and then they have the bigs ready to help on the drive. If he gets a pump fake, one/two dribble pull-up shot, the big has to decide if he simply closes out or actually steps out of the paint to guard the mid-range shot. That will open up potential layup/dunks for cutters and the center off a Vlade pass.
     
  7. Sir Desmond

    Sir Desmond JBB Stig!

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    After New York, Odde's gonna be sleeping for a looooooong time.
     
  8. Mr. J

    Mr. J Triple Up

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    Radmanovic performed well today, but it was mostly due to the Knicks perimeter defense allowing him to get many wide open looks. I, personally, think the Sonics would be better off starting Evans or Collison at power forwards. They do lose a bit of offense, but they more than make up for it with their defense.
     
  9. odde23

    odde23 JBB Not A JustBBall Member

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">Radmanovic performed well today, but it was mostly due to the Knicks perimeter defense allowing him to get many wide open looks. I, personally, think the Sonics would be better off starting Evans or Collison at power forwards. They do lose a bit of offense, but they more than make up for it with their defense.</div>

    amen.
     
  10. Roland Hood

    Roland Hood JBB JustBBall Member

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    Well, considering we were dead last in the league with Evans or Collison starting, Hill must figure it can't get any worse on that end.

    As far as Rad getting 30 yesterday, color me impressed when he gets them by not going 8-10 from 3. I mean it's great shooting and all, but not really the line I'm looking for - more like 7-13, 2-4 from 3, 6-7 boards, 3-4 a's.
     
  11. Iron Shiek

    Iron Shiek Maintain and Hold It Down

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    As impressive as Vlad's shooting was on Sunday it was equally unimpressive how he got manhandled in the paint by Channing Frye and Mo' Taylor.

    Here is the irony of Vlad's request. Vlad is a three that doesn't use his height advantage at the small forward spot and isn't good enough defensively to guard the better small forwards in this league. So he is force to play out of position at the four, where he is talented enough to score against post guys that are not accustomed to guarding perimeter players, but also not strong enough as an interior defender to stop those same post players from dominating him on the blocks.

    Coupled with the fact that he isn't a good rebounder on either end makes him a tough person to rely on in your rotation. Vlad is benefitting the most from the coaching change but I don't think that the contributions that he is making on the offensive end when he is making jump shots offset how poor he is as an interior defender. I'd love to see him play the small forward spot but considering how he never scores on the block--it makes his height advantage at that position insignificant.

    I just think that Nick Collison should get the majority of our power forward minutes. He is being dangled around and I can see his confidence fading. I don't doubt that most of the posters in the forum would admit that Collison is our most well rounded post threat--but it seems as if now he is relegated to rookie minutes.

    And by the way, how does a 95% foul shooter miss both free throws in a 2 point game with 9 seconds to go? I'd love to see any Ridnour fans justify that punk in his heart.
     
  12. psheehy

    psheehy Beaten down by the "MAN"

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">Radmanovic performed well today, but it was mostly due to the Knicks perimeter defense allowing him to get many wide open looks. I, personally, think the Sonics would be better off starting Evans or Collison at power forwards. They do lose a bit of offense, but they more than make up for it with their defense.</div>

    Actually they gave him the looks because they chose to follow Lewis on the play because he is considered a more established threat. Hill seems to be setting up an offense off his players strengths, trying to extend the pick your poison from just Lewis and Ray to include Radman. I may not love Vlade's game, but I like the way Hill is working the offense.

    They still need to get the defense to work for 48 minutes...it looked great at times and as bad as ever at other times. The perimeter actually is better and the post is suffering now...mostly due to Vlade's poor post defense (it was way better two years ago) and Johan's inexperience.
     
  13. Roland Hood

    Roland Hood JBB JustBBall Member

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    I didn't realize Luke gagged on 2 free throws until I read today's paper. Perhaps lingering effects of getting bopped in the chest by Stackhouse...

    As far as Vlad, you have to be a sorry defender if you let Mo Taylor post you up, seeing as how his favorite move is the between the legs dribble, spin and fadeway from 17 ft.
     
  14. Sir Desmond

    Sir Desmond JBB Stig!

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Iron Shiek:</div><div class="quote_post">
    And by the way, how does a 95% foul shooter miss both free throws in a 2 point game with 9 seconds to go? I'd love to see any Ridnour fans justify that punk in his heart.</div>

    Name me a great player that hasn't missed a crucial freethrow in his career? You think Kobe is the best player in the NBA, and I've seen him miss clutch foul shots before (in fact I'd rather him take a contested three than a foul shot with the game on the line).

    It won't be the last time he misses from the line in his career and he'll learn from it, but it's hardly grounds to chastise him.
     
  15. Iron Shiek

    Iron Shiek Maintain and Hold It Down

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Sir Desmond:</div><div class="quote_post">Name me a great player that hasn't missed a crucial freethrow in his career?</div>

    Well, I can't name too many 95% free throw shooters that miss 2 free throws in a less than hostile environment in the closing of regulation.

    Here is my beef. He isn't going to be perfect from the line but had he at least made one of them we would have been in a better position to force that game into overtime than we were. To be honest we were fortunate to get an opportunity to tie the game. Had Vlad (I believe, I went to the bathroom when they came out of TO and found that we were only down one w/ Nate on the line) not hit a quick three than we wouldn't have even gotten a look to force the game into overtime.

    Luke has struggled all season with his shooting, but his free throw shooting throughout his career has been stellar. I was very confident when he was bailed out driving to the hoop that he'd make both his free throws. When he missed the first I chalked it up to nerves/happenstance. When he missed the second I was convinced that he was scared.

    I guess that is the next part of coddling Luke's development. Allow for him to make crucial mistakes down the stretch of games in order for him to understand what not to do in crunch time situations. AD's presence did not enable him to be baptized by fire last season.
     
  16. Casual

    Casual JBB First Team

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    Please, Luke has been our primary free throw shooter at the end of games since he's been on the team. You're just reaching.
     
  17. Iron Shiek

    Iron Shiek Maintain and Hold It Down

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    <div class="quote_poster">Quoting Casual:</div><div class="quote_post">Please, Luke has been our primary free throw shooter at the end of games since he's been on the team. You're just reaching.</div>

    Funny, last year I don't remember him once being on the line in a crucial situation in which we were down and he had to make critical free throws to force the game into overtime. What I do rememeber him doing is making free throws when we were leading the game and other teams had to foul in order for them to get the ball back. That is not the same pressure.

    Do you think that Nate would have drawn up a play for Luke to get the ball last year when we needed a basket down the stretch of a game to force overtime? Luke wouldn't have even been in the game in that situation. AD played in the clutch last season. Luke is getting that opportunity this season and he is failing to assume the role of a clutch player.

    As is everyone else on this roster this season as well.
     
  18. Roland Hood

    Roland Hood JBB JustBBall Member

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    The experiment is over. I think his agent said given consistent starters mintues he'd average 25 and 12 or something ridiculous. All it's done is expose the weaknesses we all thought he had but weren't totally sure.

    I guess now we're sure.
     

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