Is it me or do stats this year (especially with scoring) seem very bloated? I mean, I give Kobe credit, but he's averaging 34 ppg out of nowhere. Lebron improved by 5ppg and AI by 3.. I think Ray is on the path to a new career high and Gilbert Arenas is averaging more than AI in 03-04, DWade and Melo are both up too. Is everyone really improving this much, or have the rule changes affected the game? With all this high scoring it really takes the value of dropping 30 points a game away, it just seems like ANYBODY can do it now.. Let me know what you think.
I don't think it has anything to do with any rules changed, it's probably just one of those seasons. Kobe had more to fight for with all the criticism surrounding him. He was always a hard worker, but he really put in more effort this season. Same thing goes with Anthony. After his awful season last year he was out to silence his critics. James doesn’t surprise me. He gets significantly better every year. Just look at the improvement from when he was a rookie to his sophomore year. Now that he has a jumper in his offensive arsenal, he’s virtually unguardable. Arenas was a stud last year and without Larry Hughes he’s had even more touches on the ball, so it doesn’t surprise me he averages three more points from last year. Iverson is Iverson. We all knew he was capable of big outbursts on any given night. If non-superstar players were putting up numbers like that, then I would be more surprised, but at least they’re good players putting up good numbers.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting MrJ:</div><div class="quote_post">If non-superstar players were putting up numbers like that, then I would be more surprised, but at least they?re good players putting up good numbers.</div> lately, people on the Bobcats have been getting 25+ points. I really do think anybody can or why else would they be in the NBA in the first place.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting SpursFan10:</div><div class="quote_post">lately, people on the Bobcats have been getting 25+ points. I really do think anybody can or why else would they be in the NBA in the first place.</div> No one on the Bobcats averages 25 points per game. Of course anyone can score 25 points, but to do it on a consistent basis is a different story. They're only a handful of players able to do that night in and night out.
I think it comes from a lack of quality across the league. If you've got a lower quality league with less genuine NBA level talents the best players are always going to get better numbers.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Jerry West:</div><div class="quote_post">I think it comes from a lack of quality across the league. If you've got a lower quality league with less genuine NBA level talents the best players are always going to get better numbers.</div> I don't think so, the NBA is extremely talented, but guys don't play that kind of rugged physical defense anymore.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> but guys don't play that kind of rugged physical defense anymore.</div> The reason for that is because of the rule changes. You can barely touch the player now, so how can you be physical? Pippen said it best when he said he wouldn't be half the defensive player he was in today's game due to the rule changes. Imagine the Bad boy Pistons, they'd be the worse team in the league in todays game because they wouldn't be allowed to bang and be physical/aggressive.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Mr.Wade:</div><div class="quote_post">The reason for that is because of the rule changes. You can barely touch the player now, so how can you be physical? Pippen said it best when he said he wouldn't be half the defensive player he was in today's game due to the rule changes. Imagine the Bad boy Pistons, they'd be the worse team in the league in todays game because they wouldn't be allowed to bang and be physical/aggressive.</div> I totally agree, you cant touch the offensive player out in the perimeter cause u gonna get called for a hand check foul. The players have adjusted better this season to the rules unlike last season which was a mess. The rule changes were to boost the offense, its worked at times but teams are still scoring 80 points so i dont like the whole hand check thing. Its good for the NBA though to see 3 players score 30 ppg like Kobe, Iverson, and Lebron. Wade is also getting up there and of course Arenas.
They are somewhat inflated, relative to maybe 5 years ago. It's kind of hard to believe that Iverson, who's over 30 and has suffered so many injuries, would be having a career year right now. Look at these numbers for the top perimeter scorers currently: <font face=""Courier New""><font color=""Green""><u>Kobe Bryant:</u> 02-03: 22.6 fga/40min, 8.4 fta/40min, 7.43 fta/20fga 03-04: 19.3 fga/40min, 8.7 fta/40min, 9.02 fta/20fga 04-05: 19.7 fga/40min, 9.9 fta/40min, 10.05 fta/20fga 05-06: 26.5 fga/40min, 10.7 fta/40min, 8.07 fta/20fga <u>Allen Iverson:</u> 02-03: 22.3 fga/40min, 8.4 fta/40min, 7.53 fta/20fga 03-04: 22.1 fga/40min, 8.9 fta/40min, 8.05 fta/20fga 04-05: 22.9 fga/40min, 9.9 fta/40min, 8.65 fta/20fga 05-06: 23.9 fga/40min, 10.4 fta/40min, 8.68 fta/20fga <u>Dwyane Wade:</u> 02-03: N/A 03-04: 15.0 fga/40min, 5.9 fta/40min, 7.87 fta/20fga 04-05: 17.7 fga/40min, 10.2 fta/40min, 11.53 fta/20fga 05-06: 19.4 fga/40min, 10.9 fta/40min, 11.2 fta/20fga <u>Gilbert Arenas:</u> 02-03: 16.5 fga/40min, 6.5 fta/40min, 7.88 fta/20fga 03-04: 17.7 fga/40min, 6.1 fta/40min, 6.89 fta/20fga 04-05: 18.6 fga/40min, 7.8 fta/40min, 8.39 fta/20fga 05-06: 19.8 fga/40min, 9.1 fta/40min, 9.21 fta/20fga <u>LeBron James:</u> 02-03: N/A 03-04: 19.1 fga/40min, 5.9 fta/40min, 6.18 fta/20fga 04-05: 19.9 fga/40min, 7.5 fta/40min, 7.54 fta/20fga 05-06: 21.4 fga/40min, 9.5 fta/40min, 8.84 fta/20fga</font></font> The key number is free throw attempts per field goal attempts (last one in each row). I multiplied by 20 to make it more understandable. As you can see, that number (in general) has increased over the past 3 years -- specifically 02-03 to 04-05. The exception to that particular trend was Arenas in 03-04, and that can probably be more explained by him playing for a new team (Washington) that year. It's well known that referees have been calling contact on the perimeter more closely in recent years, and these numbers support that claim. Smart teams have taken advantage of this and have become more aggressive with their guards. This is apparent in the substantial increase in field goal attempts per minute for each of these players this season. As a result, while only LeBron and Arenas are drawing significantly more fouls per field goal attempt this season compared to last, all the players are overall attempting more free throws. For more discussion on this topic, see: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writ...ring/index.html
The rules definately help. Why do you think Tony Parker is also leading the league in points in the paint, he finishes great inside, but if handcheking wasn't so strict, he would not get in the lane at will all day. The new rules cause teams to play softer perimeter defense, allow perimeter players to get to the line easier as they can get other teams in the bonus very easily because of touch fouls. The NBA said they wanted more scoring a few years ago, and the rules have chaged to allow more scoring.
Its the new hand check rules, you can't touch a player any more on defense. i mean it seems like every player is having their career high this season because of that rule.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting j0se:</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think so, the NBA is extremely talented, but guys don't play that kind of rugged physical defense anymore.</div> There is a lot of talent at the pointy end, but down the bottom the quality isn't anywhere near what it used to be IMO.
Personlly I'm not a big fan of theseguys getting all these high scoring. I;m more of a fan of the big men in the league and with these new rules it is really hard for a guy like Shaq to get a block without being called for some bs foul. I liked how today in the Pistons game they were letting him block the Pistons guys driving it in and sending them on their ass. It was priceless. Pansy basketball is something I am not a big fan of and a lot of that has beenhappening this season. If your a fan of the perimeter superstars though this has been a great season.
Great analysis Durvasa, it just supports what I think is leading to higher scoring, and it's free throw attempts. Players are getting to the line with a lot more frequency and the overall rhythm of the game has gone to trash because of it. Apparently, Stern feels the league is more attractive when teams score in the 100's, but I don't think he had increased free throw attempts to help players reach that magic number. I don't know who does the research for the NBA to draw the conclusion that more scoring is what fans want. I've been a fan for 20+ years, and the quality of the game has definitely decreased. Overall, the talent is higher than it's ever been, but most of the talented players in the league don't know how to play the game. They just rely on their speed and athleticism. You just don't see the passion in a lot of players like you did during the 80's and early 90's. Players who really care about winning a championship has become the minority in this league. Players who don't care about defense, don't care about winning, and the increased scores can be attributed to the dropoff in defense.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Diesel:</div><div class="quote_post">Pansy basketball is something I am not a big fan of and a lot of that has beenhappening this season. If your a fan of the perimeter superstars though this has been a great season.</div> Absolutely, and it makes me feel bad (sometimes) for Yao. Rule changes like that also make defensive stoppers a lot rarer nowadays. I mean, how many true, in-their-prime stoppers do we have playing right now? There's Artest, Kobe, Bowen, Shawn Marion, Iggy and a few others, but the big name stoppers are few and far between. I figure that every team should have at least one stopper, but the hand-checking rule is killing the physicality of the game.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting SpursFan10:</div><div class="quote_post">lately, people on the Bobcats have been getting 25+ points. I really do think anybody can or why else would they be in the NBA in the first place.</div> Thats because the one big stopper they used to have who was leading candidate for the Defensive Player of the Year leading averaging 3s in both blocks and steals is out till around about now. Gerald Wallace. After a Detroit VS San Antonio final and everyone complaining of low scores and lots of defence, i find it suprising that all of a sudden we have 3 players averaging 30 plus with another 5 just out of the 30s. I personally love a bit of defence so seeing a block and a is not only good for the game, but keeps the scores real. Kobes 81 was just surreal. My dad keeps saying why they didnt try and triple team him and i said they did. He then says why they didnt put him on his ass. Back in the 60s, you go for a layup, your gona get the bajebas wacked outta you. Now a days no one takes hard fouls, reminder fouls that if you want to come back in my paint, your going to get hit again and harder. I aint saying scoring is bad, as i love watching scoring. Id rather see a worked for scoring outburst, like Kobe did, not only just shooing lights out, but getting to the paint, avoiding defenders, stepping around them. Its the type of scoring that puts defence to shame but good defence keeps the game from getting out of control. Thats why Gerald Wallace is such a player who i love watching because whenever he suits up against a Kobe, he is going to make Kobe work for his money and the win and when players score alot in that situation, thats a good game!
It's most likely a combination of things.. The rules definitely play a big part in allowing Iverson's production to remain at such a high level.. Ditto for players like Parker and arguably Arenas. But also figure that it really isn't often that you have this many dynamic perimeter/slasher players all at once (and being given such free reign in terms of offense for their respective teams).. Kobe, Wade, Lebron, and Anthony.. Not to mention Arenas and the everpresent people like Pierce and Allen. Basically the league has changed from having big men be dominating the scoring race to SG/SF mold players.. Wasn't so long ago that it was Shaq/Robinson/Ewing/Olajuwon averaging 25 ppg..
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting tradebark:</div><div class="quote_post">It's most likely a combination of things.. The rules definitely play a big part in allowing Iverson's production to remain at such a high level.. Ditto for players like Parker and arguably Arenas. But also figure that it really isn't often that you have this many dynamic perimeter/slasher players all at once (and being given such free reign in terms of offense for their respective teams).. Kobe, Wade, Lebron, and Anthony.. Not to mention Arenas and the everpresent people like Pierce and Allen. Basically the league has changed from having big men be dominating the scoring race to SG/SF mold players.. Wasn't so long ago that it was Shaq/Robinson/Ewing/Olajuwon averaging 25 ppg..</div> True, and I think high-scoring centers would return with a big time center. Shaq is the last one and he's sacrificing his game for the good of the team and Wade. I say we need a good 7 to 8 big time, big name centers in the coming years.
