Kobe came into the NBA out of HS. As did LeBron. Wade went to college. So the fact that Wade doubles Kobe's first three years isn't really too surprising. Fact. Second, LeBron doesn't have as good of a supporting cast around him as Miami has around Wade. Fact.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Vintage:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe came into the NBA out of HS. As did LeBron. Wade went to college. So the fact that Wade doubles Kobe's first three years isn't really too surprising. Fact. Second, LeBron doesn't have as good of a supporting cast around him as Miami has around Wade. Fact.</div> Thats all true, but my point was that, still even though Bron doesn't have as good as a supporting cast, and even though Kobe came from high school you still have to respect Wade for what he has done so early in his career.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Opportunity? The guy won three rings!, and played great in the Lakers run. What else opportunity is there for him to take, he already proved he's one of the greatest. The Heat's role players played a bigger role in the playoffs, spreading the court for Wade and giving him wide open looks. If Wade played terrible, his team picked up the slack. There is no way he shoulder'd more of the load than Kobe. The Lakers were Kobe & Shaq. The Heat are Wade, Shaq, Posey, Walker, Mourning, Jwill & Haslem. Stop spinning the truth. Wade had a great season, but to say at this point he's better than Kobe is only doing a disservice to Wade. Kobe had a phenomonal season also, proving that he can be a leader on a underachieving team. But his track record speaks for itself, he doesn't need to prove anything. </div> The Heats supporting cast did not play a bigger role in their title run this year than Kobe's teammates during the 3peat (shaq included)...the Lakers were more than just "Kobe and Shaq", you act as if Horry, Fisher, Fox, Shaw, Harper, Glen Rice, Malone, Payton etc. didn't even exist during those title runs....and yes Kobe still has something to prove, he needs to prove that he can be the man on his team and win a title.....if Kobe never gets back to the promised land by the end of his career, I'll view him as a great scorer, but he'll be far from one of the greatest to ever play the game.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting THE DREAM:</div><div class="quote_post">The Heats supporting cast did not play a bigger role in their title run this year than Kobe's teammates during the 3peat (shaq included)...the Lakers were more than just "Kobe and Shaq", you act as if Horry, Fisher, Fox, Shaw, Harper, Glen Rice, Malone, Payton etc. didn't even exist during those title runs....and yes Kobe still has something to prove, he needs to prove that he can be the man on his team and win a title.....if Kobe never gets back to the promised land by the end of his career, I'll view him as a great scorer, but he'll be far from one of the greatest to ever play the game.</div> They didn't exist on the championship runs
^^^but the other players did......the fact that you respond with that post after everything I said, just makes your argument look really lame.
Jason Williams, Gary Payton vs Pargo, Fisher, Shaw, Lue James Posey vs Fox, George, Glen Rice Antione Walker vs Madsen, AC Green, Horace Grant, Horry Alonzo Mourning vs John Salley, Samaki Walker Glen Rice didn't play a significant role that year, which is ultimaltey why he was let go. So Robert Horry is the only player that MIGHT be ur best argument. But with players like Samaki Walker, John Salley, Mark "Maddog" Madson & Jannero Pargo you'd have to argue that Miami CLEARLY had better role players. This is laughable
YOU'RE FORGETTING SHAQ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.....Kobe had dominate Shaq, Wade has over the hill Shaq....and JWill and Payton were not that great in the backcourt, give me Fisher and Shaw anyday of the week....and even though I can't stand the guy Fox not only hit his 3's, but he was actually a pretty good defender.
I hate when people talk of role players and include guys who don't see the court. Why does it matter that Alonzo is better than Madsen if Madsen is playing 3 MPG? Why does it matter that he's better than Salley is Salley hardly sees the court. Compare the guys that actually do something for the team. Also Glen Rice was let go because he was old, and easily replaceable. Old guys like that don't get long term deals on teams.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheFreshPrince:</div><div class="quote_post">yes, but if people could tell so obviously who is better, than why did they make this trade. someone thought that tractor was better. i never said kobe was better than jordan! what is wrong with saying that kobe and wade are even in my mind? and seriously do you even read post? i asked you like 3 questions and you answered none of them. you werent even close to one.</div> Because that is against the law for Kobe's fans. You ask them when Kobe's 50 years old and compare a rising star at the time, they'll tell you Kobe at 50 is still better.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting WadeDynasty:</div><div class="quote_post">Because that is against the law for Kobe's fans. You ask them when Kobe's 50 years old and compare a rising star at the time, they'll tell you Kobe at 50 is still better.</div> That's lame. Watch who you class. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting THE DREAM:</div><div class="quote_post">YOU'RE FORGETTING SHAQ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.....Kobe had dominate Shaq, Wade has over the hill Shaq....and JWill and Payton were not that great in the backcourt, give me Fisher and Shaw anyday of the week....and even though I can't stand the guy Fox not only hit his 3's, but he was actually a pretty good defender.</div> I agree Shaq wasn't as dominant BUT he still created the same opportunities for the other players. The deeper Miami bench make up for it. If you gave the New York Knicks Shaq, expect ECF, even if he doesn't produce. The fact is he will still aid the other players by drawing double teams and attention, forcing firstly the opposing teams defensive system to change and then their offensive system to change. Shaq and Alonzo for 48 minutes made a huge impact aswell. When Shaq was on the Lakers, the other team had around 20 minutes a game to play without an impact centre. Teams playing against the Heat have no rest whatsoever against the big men. As far as Fox goes, he was a pure defensive presence. He had little offense but that was fine as he played the enforcer role we needed. I think we should wait until the end of the 2006-2007 season to see if the Heat can repeat like the Lakers did. If they do it again in 2007-2008 with a 3 peat, I will admit Wade is better than Kobe.
^^^lol, so now every player has to 3peat to be better than Kobe...hahaha <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">When Shaq was on the Lakers, the other team had around 20 minutes a game to play without an impact centre</div> so shaq only played 28 minutes a game?....damn 30 points in 28 minutes is reeeeeeeeeeeeeallly impressive!!!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting THE DREAM:</div><div class="quote_post">^^^lol, so now every player has to 3peat to be better than Kobe...hahaha</div> I guess you can't write a contructive reply so that's how you answer. If Wade won another title with Shaq next year I will admit he's as good as Kobe. Even though he doesn't have a domininant Shaq, the opportunities to score and provide offensivley are the same for Wade as they were for Kobe. Wade has the advantage of Alonzo and a deeper bench which make's up for the lower producing Shaq. When the game run's through Shaq more, as it did in LA, the tempo slow's down and can often be a momentum killer. Basketball is about run's during a game. <div class="quote_poster">Quoting THE DREAM:</div><div class="quote_post">so shaq only played 28 minutes a game?....damn 30 points in 28 minutes is reeeeeeeeeeeeeallly impressive!!!</div> Notice how I said "around 20" not "exactly 20." I didn't check the exact minutes but here they are since you can't reply with a decent arguement. It's actually about 15-16 minutes.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Laker_fan:</div><div class="quote_post">That's lame. Watch who you class. </div> It aches me to speak the truth too my friend. I couldn't think of another fan group who are so cocky as if they played the finals to win the titles.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">If Wade won another title with Shaq next year I will admit he's as good as Kobe. Even though he doesn't have a domininant Shaq, the opportunities to score and provide offensivley are the same for Wade as they were for Kobe. Wade has the advantage of Alonzo and a deeper bench which make's up for the lower producing Shaq. When the game run's through Shaq more, as it did in LA, the tempo slow's down and can often be a momentum killer. Basketball is about run's during a game.</div> So basically you're telling me that Wade right now with a crappy Shaq has the same advantages as Kobe with a Shaq who was unstoppable? That is a terrible statement. Alonzo DOES NOT make up for an old Shaq, the only thing Alonzo can do now is block a couple shots, he can't score he can't change a game entirely by himself. When you're saying that the game slows down with a younger Shaq it still slows it down with an older Shaq, you think he never touches the ball? You're telling me Shaq is a detriment to a team because he always slows the ball down? With a slower older Shaq the oppurtunities are obviously not equal to with a dominant one. Wade is the one who carries the team when they need it most, and scores the majority of the points whereas Shaq in his prime scored most of the points with Kobe chipping in. It's shown that Wade is able to carry his team with an aging Shaq who doesn't do nearly the things he did when he was younger, whereas Kobe with an 03-04 Shaq couldn't will his team to winning even 2 games vs. Detroit, and that's with a younger Shaq than now! Wade does not have to win 3 rings to be as good as Kobe because he will never have the oppurtunity to play with a Shaq like Kobe did, Wade will never be able to play with a player like the one Kobe did EVER, so it really isn't a fair argument when comparing the amount of rings.
well since you want a more analytical approach 2000 - Shaq avg. 40 minutes a game 2001 - Shaq avg. 39.5 minutes a game 2002- Shaq avg. 36.2 minutes a game now correct if my math is wrong but that means the big fella was on the floor 38 minutes per game appx.........so that's 10 minutes he wasn't playing.............10 minutes doesn't equal 20 minutes.
Why can't Lakers fans admit even one simple thing? That Shaq isn't the same as he was in Lakers uniform.
