Another lack of sympathy from me comes from the fact that the owner of the Mavs is such a hypocrite. He was whining about the league being to rough to benefit his team, but he doesn't like it if it's the other way around.
It seems to be odd that so many Raptor fans are in here trying to call out the Mav fans. Maybe they are angry they havent been near the playoffs in years. Id rather be a whiney fan of a Western Conference Champ than the fan of a 27-win team. Im sure that you would be angry too if your team got to the NBA Finals (Don't hold your breath) and didnt get any calls. No one wants to admit their team blew it, we are no different.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Bobcats:</div><div class="quote_post">Maverick fans bitching and moaning about the refs? Wow, that's a first...</div> Let me give you a few calls that went to the Heat's way Example One: The "phantom" foul call on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. Neither Dirk nor Devin Harris touched him. Example Two: Jerry Stackhouse suspended one game for a hard foul on Shaquille O'Neal. Ok, so maybe a flagerant, he got all body, but a suspension COME ON!! Stack couldn't even get to the ball, what else did you want him to do. Example Three: The No-Call backcourt violation on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. He established himself in the front court, then went back...an obvious backcourt violation, but no the refs "failed to see it" Example Four: Josh Howard's time out. If your a referee of thirty-years, you know that teams never take a time out after the first foul shot if they need to advance the ball. It was clear that Josh Howard and Avery Johnson were communicating on if they were gonna call a time out after the first shot. Avery was saying time out after the first shot to Howard, and Howard was trying to clear up with Avery by saying, "you want a time out (while making the time out sign twice to Avery)" Thats where the refs came up with the idea of he said time out twice. Example Five: The Miami Heat went to the Foul Line 17 times in game 1. The trips to the foul line steadily INCREASED every game, espically in game 5 where they went to the line 49 times!! The Heat were getting to the foul line on calls that the refs "let go" when the Mavs had the ball. Other Examples: -Jason Terry getting his shirt tugged before making the last shot in game 6. -Dwyane Wade going to the line almost everytime he took it to the hoop in near the end of the game. -Clock "malfunction" in game 3. -Shaquille O' Neals constant use of his arm to keep Devin Harris out of his face...etc.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TwinTowers:</div><div class="quote_post">Let me give you a few calls that went to the Heat's way Example One: The "phantom" foul call on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. Neither Dirk nor Devin Harris touched him.</div> See these 2 pictures? Good, let's move on. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Example Two: Jerry Stackhouse suspended one game for a hard foul on Shaquille O'Neal. Ok, so maybe a flagerant, he got all body, but a suspension COME ON!! Stack couldn't even get to the ball, what else did you want him to do.</div> What the hell does this have to do with the referees? <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Example Three: The No-Call backcourt violation on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. He established himself in the front court, then went back...an obvious backcourt violation, but no the refs "failed to see it"</div> Here's an explanation from shape: It was not a backcourt violation, Wade is allowed to touch the ball in the backcourt even though he was established in the front court. He jumped behind the halfcourt line and then touched the ball. They changed this rule a few seasons ago. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Example Four: Josh Howard's time out. If your a referee of thirty-years, you know that teams never take a time out after the first foul shot if they need to advance the ball. It was clear that Josh Howard and Avery Johnson were communicating on if they were gonna call a time out after the first shot. Avery was saying time out after the first shot to Howard, and Howard was trying to clear up with Avery by saying, "you want a time out (while making the time out sign twice to Avery)" Thats where the refs came up with the idea of he said time out twice.</div> I agree with you here. But this didn't cost Miami the series. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Example Five: The Miami Heat went to the Foul Line 17 times in game 1. The trips to the foul line steadily INCREASED every game, espically in game 5 where they went to the line 49 times!! The Heat were getting to the foul line on calls that the refs "let go" when the Mavs had the ball.</div> Maybe if the Mavs didn't settle for jumpshots and kept attacking the rim like Wade and the rest of the Heat did, they would've had more FT attempts. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Other Examples: -Jason Terry getting his shirt tugged before making the last shot in game 6. -Dwyane Wade going to the line almost everytime he took it to the hoop in near the end of the game. -Clock "malfunction" in game 3. -Shaquille O' Neals constant use of his arm to keep Devin Harris out of his face...etc.</div> Look, I'm tired of this already, the point is, the refs have nothing to do with the Mavs choking, or constant jumpshooting near the end of games, or Dirk and Josh Howard missing key FT's. Deal with it.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TwinTowers:</div><div class="quote_post">Let me give you a few calls that went to the Heat's way Example One: The "phantom" foul call on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. Neither Dirk nor Devin Harris touched him. Example Two: Jerry Stackhouse suspended one game for a hard foul on Shaquille O'Neal. Ok, so maybe a flagerant, he got all body, but a suspension COME ON!! Stack couldn't even get to the ball, what else did you want him to do. Example Three: The No-Call backcourt violation on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. He established himself in the front court, then went back...an obvious backcourt violation, but no the refs "failed to see it" Example Four: Josh Howard's time out.</div> Example One - That was most def a foul, although Wade did do some illegal stuff before that. Example 2: Stupid decision by Stern, that really was not worthy of a suspension, I was shocked when the league announced that. Like any team you just suck it up and play for your lost player. That's what the Mavs did, but they lost. Example 3: Yeah, you can't catch everything. Example 4: That was just stupid, at least we know that Josh will NEVER do that again. Okay you omitted probably the most legit example, i always bring it up, but Game 6: 26 secs left, Heat are up by 1, the clock is winding down, and Wade pushes off Dirk and they call a foul. If anything it should be an offensive foul or no call. The announcers were surprised and said ah just bad luck. That was so bad cuz I really thought the Mavs had Game 6 and they would have at least had a much better shot if the Refs didn't give Wade a free trip to the line. I've finally come to terms with this ref nonsense, Wade and the Heat played great. Stepped it up, Shaq thinks they can win at least 2 more b4 he retires, what the heck? Yeah right big fella...i hate him. Mavs future much brighter. By the way I'm surprised ur upset, under ur fave teams: Mavs, Heat. Hm? I like that ur defending the Mavs pretty hard, but if you like both teams that much wouldn't you not really care? Then again maybe the bad calls infuriated you as a NBA fan...
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting WhiteManCanJump:</div><div class="quote_post">It seems to be odd that so many Raptor fans are in here trying to call out the Mav fans. Maybe they are angry they havent been near the playoffs in years. Id rather be a whiney fan of a Western Conference Champ than the fan of a 27-win team. Im sure that you would be angry too if your team got to the NBA Finals (Don't hold your breath) and didnt get any calls. No one wants to admit their team blew it, we are no different.</div> Actually the Raptors were very close to the playoffs in 03-04, so I don't know if it's because of not being close to the playoffs in years. I think it's more because everyone was watching the finals, and everyone has an opinion on it, since there aren't actually any other games to watch. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Let me give you a few calls that went to the Heat's way Example One: The "phantom" foul call on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. Neither Dirk nor Devin Harris touched him. Example Two: Jerry Stackhouse suspended one game for a hard foul on Shaquille O'Neal. Ok, so maybe a flagerant, he got all body, but a suspension COME ON!! Stack couldn't even get to the ball, what else did you want him to do. Example Three: The No-Call backcourt violation on Dwyane Wade in Game 5. He established himself in the front court, then went back...an obvious backcourt violation, but no the refs "failed to see it" Example Four: Josh Howard's time out. If your a referee of thirty-years, you know that teams never take a time out after the first foul shot if they need to advance the ball. It was clear that Josh Howard and Avery Johnson were communicating on if they were gonna call a time out after the first shot. Avery was saying time out after the first shot to Howard, and Howard was trying to clear up with Avery by saying, "you want a time out (while making the time out sign twice to Avery)" Thats where the refs came up with the idea of he said time out twice. Example Five: The Miami Heat went to the Foul Line 17 times in game 1. The trips to the foul line steadily INCREASED every game, espically in game 5 where they went to the line 49 times!! The Heat were getting to the foul line on calls that the refs "let go" when the Mavs had the ball.</div> 1) It was a foul, the only argument is if you call the foul at that time, but I don't see how anyone can argue the actual foul happening. 2) Shouldn't have happened, and actually I think it's Stu Jackson that suspends people, not D.Stern. 3) Read the rules on that one, it was not a violation 4) If you look at a video from a fan at the game, Josh Howard signals twice, Dampier also signals for a timeout and then realizes the coach doesn't want one, and Devin Harris also does. In addition to that, all three of them started walking away. Dampier walked away then when he realized they were making a mistake went back. I'm not really sure how else that can be interpreted. 5) The Mavs weren't taking advantage of situations like the Heat were. All the intentional fouls on Shaq was getting Miami in the bonus very quickly, which meant every touch foul became FT's. Dallas outisde of Dirk and Stack don't have guys who draw fouls. Stack was jacking from outside, and Dirk was still getting to the line, but wasn't used to being guarded like a PF as opposed to a PG. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Other Examples: -Jason Terry getting his shirt tugged before making the last shot in game 6. -Dwyane Wade going to the line almost everytime he took it to the hoop in near the end of the game. -Clock "malfunction" in game 3. -Shaquille O' Neals constant use of his arm to keep Devin Harris out of his face...etc.</div> You know how they play advantage in soccer? You could say they were doing that because calling an on the ground foul when Terry had an uninterupted open three wouldn't have made too many people happy. Of course that's if he made the shot. If they had called it, and Dallas still lost, it would also be in the list of bad calls the refs made. In Game 5 Dallas went to the line 13 times down the stretch, and Miami 9. I'm not even going to respond to the clock thing. Shaq is fouled everytime he touches the ball, so I'm not going to respond to that either, cause if you made calls on him like every other player he would be going to the line 20 times a game. Defenders don't even use legal means to get him out of position, they have full two handed back pushes going on.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting WhiteManCanJump:</div><div class="quote_post">It seems to be odd that so many Raptor fans are in here trying to call out the Mav fans. Maybe they are angry they havent been near the playoffs in years. Id rather be a whiney fan of a Western Conference Champ than the fan of a 27-win team. Im sure that you would be angry too if your team got to the NBA Finals (Don't hold your breath) and didnt get any calls. No one wants to admit their team blew it, we are no different.</div> Last time I checked the Mavs used to totally SUCK. They used to be the laughing stock of the league before Cuban so don't say stuff like that about crappy teams. It happens to every team at some point look at Miami after Zo. Two top 5 picks in consecutive years. The refs didn't cause Dallas anything, they cost themselves the Title. There is no phantom foul look at the two goddam pics and you'll see that was a foul and if not then your incredibly biased.
Almost a week later and Mavs fans are still complaining. When will it end? It's like I said earlier, it wasn't the officials fault you lost the game. It wasn't their fault that the Mavs didn't attack the line to draw the fouls, like Miami was doing. It wasn't their fault that, when they went to the line, they missed clutch FTs at each opportunity (Howard, Nowitzki). It also wasn't the officials fault that the Mavs employed hack-a-Shaq. I could keep going and going with this, but I'm going to stop. All in all, you guys need to stop blaming the officials for everything and realize that you're team fell apart.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting playmaker15:</div><div class="quote_post">Last time I checked the Mavs used to totally SUCK. They used to be the laughing stock of the league before Cuban so don't say stuff like that about crappy teams. It happens to every team at some point look at Miami after Zo. Two top 5 picks in consecutive years. The refs didn't cause Dallas anything, they cost themselves the Title. There is no phantom foul look at the two goddam pics and you'll see that was a foul and if not then your incredibly biased.</div> That isnt what got me. Him equalling my team in FT's for a game is what got me. Shaq literally putting out his hand and pushing Devin Harris away countless times got me. However, if anyone wants to read the posts i have made here and in the Nba Basketball forum, you can tell that I dont totally blame the refs. There is no reason for other fans to come in here and tell us to quit whining. All of you know that if your team was 2 wins away from the championship and something like this happened, you would act the same way. Of course it was Dallas' championship to win, and we choked. But did you not think that us, as fans, would be bitter and angry that we threw away a chance at our first championship? If you can't see that, you arent a fan of basketball.
^^I understadn you guys are bitter but blaming the refs won't do anything, if you watch basketball you know that teams win and lose games not referees.
Dont blame the refs blame daniels. Or maybe even Avery Johnson. At the end they choked and had a lack of communication. GL Next Year!
Pictures were after the fact. Those pictures with Dwayne's body being tugged were taken AFTER the ref blew the whistle, read it in Mark's blog, so... yeah guy. BTW, Wade palmed the ball at the end of game five. Heh. Champion or not, you gotta admit, Wade is one ugly EXPLETIVE. EWW... I'm from Miami and still haven't adjusted yet. Oh well, anyway I didn't like the way things went down and I don't even like the Mavericks (I loved it when Kobe got 62 on them for example)! That series was ridiculous, just go to 82games.com if you continue to doubt. Ok ok so maybe Dirk isn't a beauty either but it's all good... That doesn't change the other things I said though.
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=057406F3CB637FAE I just read this thread but I still have found no legit reason as to why the call weren't the reason the Heat won <u>GAME 6</u>. Obviously it was the calls of game 6 that the Mavs fans are most pissed about. You guys are right that its not the refs fault the Mavs choked but IT IS the refs fault that so many bull calls were made. Lets face it, the refs in the NBA are either payed off or complete fucking idiots. This isn't the first time nor is the last. I agree whining wont do anything but still.... I'm still in shock from the foul on Dirk when Wade elbowed him.....Wtf?
Ref Arnt To Be Blamed Refs do there job they make mistakes everyone does yeh "wade fouled dirk" get over it man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting cokersimon:</div><div class="quote_post">Refs do there job they make mistakes everyone does yeh "wade fouled dirk" get over it man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Favorites: wade Miami heat 4 life baby</div> Nuff said. Of course Heat fans are saying " GET OVER IT ".
Yeah whatever. Their should have been at least another game. Refs make a few mistakes sometimes, other times they make ridiculous mistakes over a period of time. It doesn't always "cancel out" or ONLY "slightly lean" towards one side during a chain of games. I doubt the Mavs would lose two at home which is why other people (mostly from miami/fans of miami) want to remember the final result and not the process. Whatever.
