What should we do about small forward?

As I said before, Mullin's deep man love of Dunleavy will follow him to the grave. Well for the most part, since I too have mixed reviews about this draft and O'bryant was more or less the right pick for this club as well as Brewer was.

It's just too bad Mully couldn't swing a trade like Memphis did and offered more than Battier. For goodness sakes...

So the big question is who do we get for small forward? I mean we got "the disappearing act that can't shoot" and "the flying' idiot" as small forwards. What do we do now?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Run BJM:</div><div class="quote_post">Draft Bobby Jones at 38.</div>



I agree. Being dead and a pro golfer would be an upgrade over who we got now.

 

As of today, start Dun if he has a decent camp and because we have no other options. I can see sliding Richardson down there and having Pietrus at the two.
I would also like to see Baron running the point on offense with Ellis at the two and the reverse on defense. With Richardson at the three it would be fun to watch.
This all depends on match ups and they have to be recognized by Monty, its called coaching.
I didn't see a lot of Ike last year but for very short times could we play Ike at the three, Beans at four and POB at 5 to get PT? Or is Ike way to slow?
On another web site someone posted that with the draft we could see Beans at the four more often.

 

I see playing Jason at the three as a possible answer but not a solid, constant solution. Jason is small and the defense would hurt if he played too much SF. I just wish somehow we could take two inches from Perovic and add them to Mickael Pietrus.

To improve the SF position, a deal must be made. There are some patching moves that can be made by the roster's depth that can help the situation in some instances. The other way that the SF position would improve is by the improvements of Dunleavy and Pietrus, which isn't totally out of the question.

I am hoping that the Warriors can get rid of their big contracts, like Foyle now; followed by an awesome year of Mickael Pietrus where Pietrus can turn into that solution at SF. Though, I am thinking that the odds of this may not be very strong, especially to become the solution at SF. I do believe he could become a solid player at SG for someone else though.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting bayareafan85:</div><div class="quote_post">
I didn't see a lot of Ike last year but for very short times could we play Ike at the three, Beans at four and POB at 5 to get PT? Or is Ike way to slow?
On another web site someone posted that with the draft we could see Beans at the four more often.</div>
I think Ike would have to slim down and get a little quicker like Elton Brand suddenly got when he dropped down from 265. That's the only way I'd see Ike be able to play that position, but then again I don't know. The main thing is either way at SF or PF he's kind of a defensive liability if he's tasked with trying to stay in front. But at least he can defend the paint. He did pretty well against guys like Chris Bosh and Sheed since the refs weren't jabbing him with phantom calls on defense.

Also, I agree with the person who mentioned Biedrins being more of a tall power forward at this point in time. It's like Samuel Dalembert starting out or Tyson Chandler right now. Both those guys are highly athletic but in no way do they have a true center's body like POB will. The body type and frame is the key. It's like how some tall lanky dudes never bulk up. They just don't have the body to do that.

For power players, we ideally want our big men to have an NFL player's body. Big, but fast. I think Ike definitely has that. Jrich has that. Baron especially has that. Power and finesse is a good thing. Of course, there's always the one guy that looks frail, but he's super strong and really quick. We can tell Biedrins isn't strong enough yet to play the five, just like how Yao Ming got shoved off the block by the likes of Jeff Foster despite weighing nearly 40-50 lbs less than Yao. Now Yao is pretty hard to move because of his built up leg strength. He's got a good base now.

 

I would have rather drafted someone like Rudy G@y also, but I would like to work out a trade for Harrington or someone like that. My opinion is we should have drafted someone athletic like Carney and hoped that Taft is healthy and Biedrens develops nicely this summer. If those guys could stay healthy, out of foul trouble and learn to just shoot around 70% from the FT line we could have a nice tandem at center. Either way people would have been screaming like they are right now if we had not drafted a center instead of a SF. So my hopes now are that the above happens and this POB is at least as good as those guys, Ike becomes a major contributor, move Murphy and or Foyle/Fisher for an athletic SF like a Josh Howard or someone like that...

 

I'd SERIOUSLY consider doing a sign + trade for Al Harrington.

SERIOUSLY...

 

I like the James Posey and the Jumaine Jones idea if it can be argued that their presence will bring us some defense, ability to rebound, and hit some shots.

Al Harrington is something I wonder about because is he all about scoring stats? He doesn't seem to pass much and he is really a tweener between small forward and power forward. Whether this is also true of Ike, I don't know, but Harrington doesn't seem to be the kind that will challenge somebody at the rim nor will he play much defense at either power forward or small forward as he has his weaknesses for both. He does have a post up game and could be a very good bench player or a decent starter if used right...

He definitely isn't a dominant forward like Elton Brand or Zach Randolph. But beggars can't be choosers if they can get this guy for relatively fair price. It's just will he be a liability defensively?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting upsidedownside7:</div><div class="quote_post">I'd SERIOUSLY consider doing a sign + trade for Al Harrington.

SERIOUSLY...</div>

Potentially one of the better options among guys on the market,though his price-salary...and what we have to give up,might be too much for now.

Bear in mind...we won't be aiming at next year's title game,we want good progress and no setbacks. Atlanta's cap situation is a plus. They take a bad contract in a deal-we can add stuff-like a future pick or ?

I don't know if we can get Harpering as an MLE. He's a RELIABLE SF. I do think given ANY real chance Zarko or Pietrus would do at least as well as Dun. We KNOW Pietrus can be a VERY good defensive player,so I would play him and let him adapt. He is not dumb. He just has so little experiance-and the worst coach in the league to make it extra confusing.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting custodianrules2:</div><div class="quote_post">I like the James Posey and the Jumaine Jones idea if it can be argued that their presence will bring us some defense, ability to rebound, and hit some shots.

Al Harrington is something I wonder about because is he all about scoring stats? He doesn't seem to pass much and he is really a tweener between small forward and power forward. Whether this is also true of Ike, I don't know, but Harrington doesn't seem to be the kind that will challenge somebody at the rim nor will he play much defense at either power forward or small forward as he has his weaknesses for both. He does have a post up game and could be a very good bench player or a decent starter if used right...

He definitely isn't a dominant forward like Elton Brand or Zach Randolph. But beggars can't be choosers if they can get this guy for relatively fair price. It's just will he be a liability defensively?</div>

If you want a SF to challenge at the rim...we give Eric Hicks a call cause he went undrafted. At 6-6 240 he was #6 nationally in shotblocks. He had a 10 block triple double vs Marquette,a 7 block ghame vs U Conn,had games of 10 OFFENSIVE boards. He only took about 1 3pt shot a game but hit around 40% of them. A mini-Ben Wallace,or an Artest who does not shoot much.
Put Hicks and Ike at F and you could get away with Murphy or Zarko at C.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">If you want a SF to challenge at the rim...we give Eric Hicks a call cause he went undrafted. At 6-6 240 he was #6 nationally in shotblocks. He had a 10 block triple double vs Marquette,a 7 block ghame vs U Conn,had games of 10 OFFENSIVE boards. He only took about 1 3pt shot a game but hit around 40% of them. A mini-Ben Wallace,or an Artest who does not shoot much.
Put Hicks and Ike at F and you could get away with Murphy or Zarko at C.</div>
I'd take that compared to who we have. Any combo of smarts + athleticism + heart would be nice.

I'm tired of these projects that are athletic, but just don't know the game. I'm tired of these slow, soft, jump shooters that know the game, but they just plain suck in a game of strong athletes.

The teams that have the best combo of everything usually wins. We're either one or the other. The guys who should be playing the big spots is like our backcourt. Instead we got the worst decision makers on this team in the backourt aside from Jrich/Baron. Then let's not talk about how our frontline is uber soft. I don't think any of those guys enforce the paint like they should. I'd take a Dale Davis/Elden Cambell/Ben Wallace/Alonzo Mourning/Etan Thomas/Emeka Okafor/Antonio Davis type any day because they play the positions like their role was intended. None of this nice guy stuff.

Jrich knows what I'm talking about. He was basically calling out our frontline's intimidation factor. I'd call out everything. They got heart, but no size, strength, or athleticism down there.

 

I want our defense simple,with guys playing their man,no cute tricks where you got to be figuring all the time what the F you are supposed to do now.
On both ends of the floor guys are trying to remember dance steps,too much thinking that gets in the way of quick reactions,too many on-paper plans getting in the way of creativity. We wound up a low creativity team when by nature we should have been above average.

Changing some players may give less than the expected outcome if Monty handles them as expendable pawns.

 

The other thing is floor spacing too. We need guys who get deep deep position in the paint underneath the basket to give shooters more space for a midrange game. The only way we space the floor is with our multiple streaky ass 3-point shooters, because nobody moves off the ball like a motion offense should and guards don't call for screens or the big guys don't make good enough screens. If we watch guys like Rip Hamilton or even young Reggie Miller play, they're running around tirelessly trying to find openings to get midrange shots off and their big men do their job in setting up position at the precise moment. Only when shooters like those guys are really hot or wide open do they start taking 3's. 3's are the first thing we settle for because guys don't run the plays that work or they don't run the plays because they don't know. I think a lot of it is laziness and not practicing enough and the type of guys we have on the floor.

This again hammers home to having the smarts, athleticism, heart, but I also forgot STRENGTH. Biedrins was already be better than Foyle if he had the strength and maybe some of the smarts to not give a wimpy foul and let the other guy get the and1 basket. The guy already has like 60% field goals because he's doing a simle catch and dunk and nothing more. If we had two shotblockers at power forward/center, I'm pretty sure our perimeter D doesn't have as much pressure on them on team defense with the way handcheck fouls are called these days. We got big guys who can keep guys out of the paint for once if we use Biedrins/Diogu/POB.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting REREM:</div><div class="quote_post">I want our defense simple,with guys playing their man,no cute tricks where you got to be figuring all the time what the F you are supposed to do now.
On both ends of the floor guys are trying to remember dance steps,too much thinking that gets in the way of quick reactions,too many on-paper plans getting in the way of creativity. We wound up a low creativity team when by nature we should have been above average.

Changing some players may give less than the expected outcome if Monty handles them as expendable pawns.</div>
Man to man D is going to be impossible with our current warriors and harder for any guys with decent lower leg strength/lateral quickness and anticipation. With the new officiating though, team defense is probably the better method to make stops unless the other team simply cannot create with the ball (like we do without Baron). If that happens we play man to man defense and squeeze them. A well executed team cannot be everywhere at once just like a slow transition team can't guard guys who want to run. Sounds familar huh? I basically described beating teams like us (can't execute, can't create, can't defend in transition). I'd name several players that are the cause of this and Dunleavy ain't really the most to blame in this case. (Dfish/Foyle/Murphy).

I just hope we get that balance back, get more clearer defined roles for what the power forward and center position should do so that motion offense can be successful, declare a rule that any combo guard running point guard should know how to lead a fastbreak, and finally not look at everything in terms of stats, but what these guys do off the ball that leads to something that gets recorded in the stats. I mean it's about teamwork, not numbers. I mean guys like Ike he's doing great things that people don't notice when he's not scoring (like things to space the floor, to get the other team out of position, to help out on D). Dunleavy also does a few nice things, but he's absolutely hated. Baron, Biedrins and Zarko do some nice things as well. Fisher occasionally does as well as Jrich.

These guys are typically our smarter players and that's why I can't stand our raw ass 8 year center and a power forward that doesn't seem to do much on defense. I can understand him not boxing out on zone type defenses, but what the f is up with at the foul line?? That's inexecusable to not box out when the other team misses the 2nd foul shot. The same goes with the rest of the team. This is like the fundamental team play that eventually leads to the downfall later in the game.

 

For the Dunleavy problem, I say get Earl Boykins in and have him compete with Dun for the SF spot, because Boykins will own him.

 

Harrington S&T would be good for a Murphy + filler.

Or how about Murphy, MP and Zarko for Richard Jefferson of the New Jersey Nets? Do you think they'll go for it?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting jason voorhees:</div><div class="quote_post">Harrington S&T would be good for a Murphy + filler.

Or how about Murphy, MP and Zarko for Richard Jefferson of the New Jersey Nets? Do you think they'll go for it?</div>

Yes that would be a very good trade. Even if he makes close to the max, he's a HUGE upgrade over Dun.

I don't know if NJ goes for it. The trade makes sense for both sides but we are clearly getting the better end of the deal. If they are truly desperate for a double double guy, I could see it. I don't know the sentiment of the front office towards Jefferson. If Kidd loves Jefferson that would also make things ugly. He's had a history of getting what he wants. (Zo, getting Byron fired, Vince)

 

You could slide Murphy down to the 3 and start Ike at the 4. I know Murphy has the offensive ability to play the SF, but I'm not sure he can play there defensively cause I'm not sure if he can keep up with the quicker SFs in the league. Otherwise, you could slide JRich there and start Pietrus in the backcourt or simply start Pietrus there. Anything would likely be an upgrade over Dunleavy.