McKie providing a solid foundation for youngsters

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">You stated that Mckie looked slow and inefficient in one of your previous posts. Could that have been due to the lingering injury his body still had? On the other hand, possibly the fact that it was Mckie’s first year in the triangle offense? Maybe a combination of the two? Why not see if a healthy Mckie can contribute to this team. With the young core the Lakers already have why would they bring in another young inexperenienced player? </div>

Again, Profit is 29 years old, and is a veteran in this league. You stated that Mckie's problems could be attributed to his first year in the triangle, and injuries. Although I agree with the first part, I dont agree with the second. Mckie has been often injured in the past couple of seasons, and with him getting older, I dont see how he willl get any healthier. Last season he was out for about 1/4 of the entire season without even playing a single NBA game in the Laker's uni. The way I see it is, if we keep Mckie, he will just go out and re-injure himself again. Something he has been doing for the past couple of seasons.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You stated you do not see the point of having a bench player who does not contribute. Once again in addition to what I have already stated above. You have to consider that there are many different ways to contribute to a team and sometimes they don’t always involve your performance on the court. Mckie’s leadership to a young Lakers squad is something they will need when they are coming down to the stretch run of the season. You say you recognize what Mckie brings in as far as leadership, but you constantly fail to acknowledge that in your posts thus far in this thread. </div>

Mckie brings leadership, but to what extent do we want to keep him? You fail to realize this, but I, along with many other Laker fans do. Mckie's tank has run out. He is slow, old, and hesitates everytime he gets the ball. Sure, this is Aaron's first time in the triangle offense, but so was a lot of other players on the roster. Last seaosn, besides Kobe, the only other players part of Phil Jackson's coaching were Luke, George, and Cook. Everyone else was new comers that had to learn the triangle offense. I didnt see them struggle nearly as much as Mckie. Also, Im confident in Kobe's and Phil's ability to lead the team. If we need a good leader, why not just sign Scottie Pippen? He is part of many NBA Championships, master of the triangle. Why not just sign him and let him sit on the bench just like Mckie was doing last season? He could just play Mckie's role.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Also a player that has gone without mention thus far in this thread is Evans who the Lakers acquired from Detroit this off-season. Chances are he will see some time at the backup shooting guard role as well. Therefore, between him and Mckie you have two guys who are capable of coming in and playing 8-18 minutes a night in a backup role to Kobe. There is no need to bring in another shooting guard. </div>

Evans is a good swingman, but I see him fitting in the rotation when Odom and Vlad takes a seat on the bench. We could shift Odom to powerforward when Vlad is resting, and insert Evans at small forward. Or, we can substitute Odom out for Evans. Mckie gets paid 2 million this year, and then his contract runs out. So it's not like we are going to take a serious cap hit. There have been no interest at all in the market for Laron Profit, so I'm sure we can get him for cheap.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">In conclusion if you bring in Pinnock at this point he will not see any time next season, nor will he bring leadership off the bench. You bring in Profit and waive Mckie you end up paying both Profit and Mckie for the next several years simply to play less than 15 minutes a night. No one really knows what Mckie can contribute to this Lakers team considering he was injured last season. You don’t waive a player you signed an off-season ago to the full MLE to open up a roster spot.</div>

Mckie gets paid 2 million, his contract runs out after this season. If we resign Profit, it will most likely be for cheap, because like I said, there has been no interest in him yet in the FA market. I understand that bringing in Pinnock may not be a good idea. I have heard rumors that Pinnock may be playing overseas next season. With that being said, my simple argument is that we should drop Mckie for Profit, who will be able to help our bench.

 

Alright Brian you made me turn off madden so I could reply to you in this thread. Thanks a lot haha. Anyway?.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Again, Profit is 29 years old, and is a veteran in this league. You stated that Mckie's problems could be attributed to his first year in the triangle, and injuries. Although I agree with the first part, I dont agree with the second. Mckie has been often injured in the past couple of seasons, and with him getting older, I dont see how he willl get any healthier. Last season he was out for about 1/4 of the entire season without even playing a single NBA game in the Laker's uni. The way I see it is, if we keep Mckie, he will just go out and re-injure himself again. Something he has been doing for the past couple of seasons.</div>

Profit is 29 but he is not an NBA veteran. He has played only four seasons in the NBA, and not even full seasons at that. He has never played more than 42 games in a single season. How much leadership can he bring? If you add up all the total games he has played in the NBA it comes out to a total of 135 less than two full seasons. I rest my case.

Mckie on the other hand has played in over 700 NBA games including 75 playoff games that is a veteran . He has been injured these last couple of seasons, but not to the extent your making it out to be. Prior to this season, he had not missed more than half an NBA season in eight years. Like I stated previously Mckie has been working all summer down at Temple University getting his body in the best condition possible. I guarantee you he will come into training camp ready to play.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Mckie brings leadership, but to what extent do we want to keep him? You fail to realize this, but I, along with many other Laker fans do. Mckie's tank has run out. He is slow, old, and hesitates everytime he gets the ball. Sure, this is Aaron's first time in the triangle offense, but so was a lot of other players on the roster. Last seaosn, besides Kobe, the only other players part of Phil Jackson's coaching were Luke, George, and Cook. Everyone else was new comers that had to learn the triangle offense. I didnt see them struggle nearly as much as Mckie. Also, Im confident in Kobe's and Phil's ability to lead the team. If we need a good leader, why not just sign Scottie Pippen? He is part of many NBA Championships, master of the triangle. Why not just sign him and let him sit on the bench just like Mckie was doing last season? He could just play Mckie's role.</div>

You base this merely on one season? He had averaged over nine points in a reserve role in five out of the last six seasons prior to this one. He still has some left in the tank. You may be confident in Kobe?s ability to lead the team, but with that said Kobe has had a history of calling out his teammates in public situations during the course of games. Some guys do not respond well to that. The more leaders you have on your team the better. You mentioned Scottie Pippen which was funny considering you guys did bring him in as a coach during training camp last summer.

Again you?re writing Mckie off too soon. You claim he is slow and hesitant. You base this on one season in which he played 19 games? Give the guy a break he had an injury whittled season. Does that mean he will have one every year. Just because a veteran has a bad season does not mean he is over the hill. As you said before his contract runs out at the end of this season so why not see if he can give you something this year? What is there to lose? There does not seem to be much interest in Profit should Mckie not work out you can always sign Profit next off-season.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Evans is a good swingman, but I see him fitting in the rotation when Odom and Vlad takes a seat on the bench. We could shift Odom to powerforward when Vlad is resting, and insert Evans at small forward. Or, we can substitute Odom out for Evans. Mckie gets paid 2 million this year, and then his contract runs out. So it's not like we are going to take a serious cap hit. There have been no interest at all in the market for Laron Profit, so I'm sure we can get him for cheap.</div>

Listen to what you just said. There has been no inerest in the market for Profit. If that is the case what makes you think he will not be there next off-season? See what you have in Mckie this season. When his contract runs out after the season best bet is he will retire. Then you can go ahead and sign Profit.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Mckie gets paid 2 million, his contract runs out after this season. If we resign Profit, it will most likely be for cheap, because like I said, there has been no interest in him yet in the FA market. I understand that bringing in Pinnock may not be a good idea. I have heard rumors that Pinnock may be playing overseas next season. With that being said, my simple argument is that we should drop Mckie for Profit, who will be able to help our bench.</div>

Refer to paragraph prior to this. At the end of the day Profit will likely not contribute more in eight minutes of action a night then Mckie would, along with Evans (who will see some action at guard regardless). Your not missing out on some big time player here by not signing Profit. He will be there next season like you said there is not much interest in him. You can easily keep Mckie the entire season and still sign Profit next off-season. Or to make you happy you could keep Mckie through training camp into the start of the season if he gets injured waive him and sign Profit.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">Alright Brian you made me turn off madden so I could reply to you in this thread. Thanks a lot haha. Anyway?.</div>
lol. Sorry.



<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Profit is 29 but he is not an NBA veteran. He has played only four seasons in the NBA, and not even full seasons at that. He has never played more than 42 games in a single season. How much leadership can he bring? If you add up all the total games he has played in the NBA it comes out to a total of 135 less than two full seasons. I rest my case.</div>

I never realized Profit was only in the league for 4 years. But like I said, either way, the guy can play. If you saw him last season, you saw him leading the second unit. He is what kept the unit together. When he went down with the injury, the bench was obviously not the same.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Mckie on the other hand has played in over 700 NBA games including 75 playoff games that is a veteran . He has been injured these last couple of seasons, but not to the extent your making it out to be. Prior to this season, he had not missed more than half an NBA season in eight years. Like I stated previously Mckie has been working all summer down at Temple University getting his body in the best condition possible. I guarantee you he will come into training camp ready to play.</div>
The guy is 33 years old. I just don't see what he has left in the tank. Like I said, if we are looking for a leader, why not just sign someone like Scottie who has been a champion? It doesnt matter if he cant play, just leave him on the roster and let him be a "leader." After all, he wont be seeing many minutes anyways. Why not bring back Pippen, or sign Brian Shaw to the active roster?


<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You base this merely on one season? He had averaged over nine points in a reserve role in five out of the last six seasons prior to this one. He still has some left in the tank. You may be confident in Kobe?s ability to lead the team, but with that said Kobe has had a history of calling out his teammates in public situations during the course of games. Some guys do not respond well to that. The more leaders you have on your team the better. You mentioned Scottie Pippen which was funny considering you guys did bring him in as a coach during training camp last summer. </div>

Well, a couple of seasons ago, Mckie was getting slow, and his defense was obviously struggling. Last season, Mckie was slow, and he was unable to keep up with the point guards on the opposing team. Kobe has matured over the past seaosn, I'm sure everyone knows. He is taking players Sasha under his wing. He is starting to play more team ball, and overall he is a lot more mature. With that being said, I have no problem with Kobe leading our team.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Again you?re writing Mckie off too soon. You claim he is slow and hesitant. You base this on one season in which he played 19 games? Give the guy a break he had an injury whittled season. Does that mean he will have one every year. Just because a veteran has a bad season does not mean he is over the hill. As you said before his contract runs out at the end of this season so why not see if he can give you something this year? What is there to lose? There does not seem to be much interest in Profit should Mckie not work out you can always sign Profit next off-season.</div>

Although Profit has not generated much interest, I doubt he will sit on the market until next season. The guy can play, it's just his past injury that's hurting him.



Listen to what you just said. There has been no inerest in the market for Profit. If that is the case what makes you think he will not be there next off-season? See what you have in Mckie this season. When his contract runs out after the season best bet is he will retire. Then you can go ahead and sign Profit.



Refer to paragraph prior to this. At the end of the day Profit will likely not contribute more in eight minutes of action a night then Mckie would, along with Evans (who will see some action at guard regardless). Your not missing out on some big time player here by not signing Profit. He will be there next season like you said there is not much interest in him. You can easily keep Mckie the entire season and still sign Profit next off-season. Or to make you happy you could keep Mckie through training camp into the start of the season if he gets injured waive him and sign Profit.[/QUOTE]

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">Alright Brian you made me turn off madden so I could reply to you in this thread. Thanks a lot haha. Anyway?.</div>
lol. Sorry.



<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Profit is 29 but he is not an NBA veteran. He has played only four seasons in the NBA, and not even full seasons at that. He has never played more than 42 games in a single season. How much leadership can he bring? If you add up all the total games he has played in the NBA it comes out to a total of 135 less than two full seasons. I rest my case.</div>

I never realized Profit was only in the league for 4 years. But like I said, either way, the guy can play. If you saw him last season, you saw him leading the second unit. He is what kept the unit together. When he went down with the injury, the bench was obviously not the same.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Mckie on the other hand has played in over 700 NBA games including 75 playoff games that is a veteran . He has been injured these last couple of seasons, but not to the extent your making it out to be. Prior to this season, he had not missed more than half an NBA season in eight years. Like I stated previously Mckie has been working all summer down at Temple University getting his body in the best condition possible. I guarantee you he will come into training camp ready to play.</div>
The guy is 33 years old. I just don't see what he has left in the tank. Like I said, if we are looking for a leader, why not just sign someone like Scottie who has been a champion? It doesnt matter if he cant play, just leave him on the roster and let him be a "leader." After all, he wont be seeing many minutes anyways. Why not bring back Pippen, or sign Brian Shaw to the active roster?


<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You base this merely on one season? He had averaged over nine points in a reserve role in five out of the last six seasons prior to this one. He still has some left in the tank. You may be confident in Kobe?s ability to lead the team, but with that said Kobe has had a history of calling out his teammates in public situations during the course of games. Some guys do not respond well to that. The more leaders you have on your team the better. You mentioned Scottie Pippen which was funny considering you guys did bring him in as a coach during training camp last summer. </div>

Well, a couple of seasons ago, Mckie was getting slow, and his defense was obviously struggling. Last season, Mckie was slow, and he was unable to keep up with the point guards on the opposing team. Kobe has matured over the past seaosn, I'm sure everyone knows. He is taking players Sasha under his wing. He is starting to play more team ball, and overall he is a lot more mature. With that being said, I have no problem with Kobe leading our team.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Again you?re writing Mckie off too soon. You claim he is slow and hesitant. You base this on one season in which he played 19 games? Give the guy a break he had an injury whittled season. Does that mean he will have one every year. Just because a veteran has a bad season does not mean he is over the hill. As you said before his contract runs out at the end of this season so why not see if he can give you something this year? What is there to lose? There does not seem to be much interest in Profit should Mckie not work out you can always sign Profit next off-season.</div>

Although Profit has not generated much interest, I doubt he will sit on the market until next season. The guy can play, it's just his past injury that's hurting him.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Brian:</div><div class="quote_post">I never realized Profit was only in the league for 4 years. But like I said, either way, the guy can play. If you saw him last season, you saw him leading the second unit. He is what kept the unit together. When he went down with the injury, the bench was obviously not the same.</div>The Lakers bench is much more deep this season with guys like Evans, Farmar, Williams, and Turaf. I just don’t see much of a need to go through all the trouble of waiving Mckie to sign a guy who wouldn’t play more than ten minutes a night. Let alone have two guys fighting for a reserve role in which they would see only eight minutes. It would become like the 76ers situation having three guards (Green, Williams, and Ollie) competing for a backup role in which they would play less than eight minutes a night.


<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The guy is 33 years old. I just don't see what he has left in the tank. Like I said, if we are looking for a leader, why not just sign someone like Scottie who has been a champion? It doesnt matter if he cant play, just leave him on the roster and let him be a "leader." After all, he wont be seeing many minutes anyways. Why not bring back Pippen, or sign Brian Shaw to the active roster?</div>
The funny thing is all the guys you have mentioned have actually been brought to the lakers upon retirement. You act like no team in the NBA has veterans who they rely on for leadership purposes. Even the dynasty Lakers had guys who were a shadow of there former selves playing a leadership role. One that comes to mind immediately is Ron Harper towards the later championships.


<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Well, a couple of seasons ago, Mckie was getting slow, and his defense was obviously struggling. Last season, Mckie was slow, and he was unable to keep up with the point guards on the opposing team. Kobe has matured over the past seaosn, I'm sure everyone knows. He is taking players Sasha under his wing. He is starting to play more team ball, and overall he is a lot more mature. With that being said, I have no problem with Kobe leading our team.</div>Although, Kobe is in the process of maturing there are still times in which his leadership can be kind of questionable. For example his relationship with Smush Parker and his relationship with guys like Chucky Atkins during the season Phil was gone. Even though I agree Kobe has made huge strides it never hurts having veterans on a young team.



<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Although Profit has not generated much interest, I doubt he will sit on the market until next season. The guy can play, it's just his past injury that's hurting him.</div>
Where will he play? Overseas? Even if he were to get a contract at this point, it would likely be one year at the minimum so the Lakers could still pursue him next off-season. He is not going to get a multy year contract at this point.

 

Mckie is a great guy.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Best Kept Secret:</div><div class="quote_post">The Lakers bench is much more deep this season with guys like Evans, Farmar, Williams, and Turaf. I just don’t see much of a need to go through all the trouble of waiving Mckie to sign a guy who wouldn’t play more than ten minutes a night. Let alone have two guys fighting for a reserve role in which they would see only eight minutes. It would become like the 76ers situation having three guards (Green, Williams, and Ollie) competing for a backup role in which they would play less than eight minutes a night.</div>

It's kind of weird we are having a debate over Aaron Mckie. Our bench has gotten stronger over the past season, as you have pointed out. But if we sign Profit, it will make our bench even better. It never hurts to have more depth. Plus, you have to consider teams like the Clippers, Suns, and now Warriors (Don Nelson) will be playoff contenders. We need as much help as we can get. IMO, Profit will produce more for us, and our bench will be stronger. On the other hand, Mckie provides us with leadership in the long run. To tell you the truth, in the beginning of this, I was completely against the idea of having Mckie on the roster, but you have made a lot of valid points, and it's come to the point where I don't really care what happens. I would still take Profit over Mckie, but then again I dont find it as such a big deal.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The funny thing is all the guys you have mentioned have actually been brought to the lakers upon retirement. You act like no team in the NBA has veterans who they rely on for leadership purposes. Even the dynasty Lakers had guys who were a shadow of there former selves playing a leadership role. One that comes to mind immediately is Ron Harper towards the later championships.</div>
Well, Harper still produced for us in the latter part of his career. He was a good role player and he averaged around 6 points per game in his last season.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Although, Kobe is in the process of maturing there are still times in which his leadership can be kind of questionable. For example his relationship with Smush Parker and his relationship with guys like Chucky Atkins during the season Phil was gone. Even though I agree Kobe has made huge strides it never hurts having veterans on a young team.</div>
The whole Smush issue is blown out of proportion. There may be something going on, but it certainly isnt anything worthwhile for talk. As for the Chucky issue? I think it was ignorant of Chucky to make those comments, but then again, he apologized a couple of days later and everything was fine. Plus, Chucky has never been known as a humble guy.

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Where will he play? Overseas? Even if he were to get a contract at this point, it would likely be one year at the minimum so the Lakers could still pursue him next off-season. He is not going to get a multy year contract at this point.</div>
Thing is, if we are going to make a playoff push, we need as much help as we can get. Our division is extremely competitive, and now that Golden State signed Don Nelson, its only going to bring more competition.

 

Sorry Brian I have to side with BKS on this. He made some strong point.

I just realized something. This is the Lakers forum debate! :Biglaugh:

We should now create a thread to vote on who made their point clearer and put up a stronger arguement.

Lol anyway, I believe that if Mckie got what BKS said(backing Kobe) it wouldn't be bad. Loading your team full of young talent isn't what we need Brian, look at the Bobcats. The only person worthy of veteran on that team is Brevin Knight. Mckie will bring leadership, veteranship(if thats a word ), and defense if and when he comes off the bench healthy. He isn't a number one scoring option(isn't to say he can't score at all) but that old bag still has defense. Mckie coming off the bench should provide us with a small boost defensively and energy wise.

You can't deny the fact that Mckie is a veteran and has a bit of leadership, which was one of the biggest things you guys wanted this off season i.e. Sam Cassell. Granted he isn't the same as Cassell but he still brings the leadership and veteran type player we wanted and needed. I am not disappointed in getting him imo.

You are acting as if Profit will make or break our chances for a playoff push Brian. Young talent, especially Profit, shouldn't be weighed on so heavily. Profit is good yes but he wont do all you are making him out to be especially with this comment.

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Brian:</div><div class="quote_post">Thing is, if we are going to make a playoff push, we need as much help as we can get. Our division is extremely competitive, and now that Golden State signed Don Nelson, its only going to bring more competition.</div>

Also you fans.....thats right....fans.... need to stop talking like you're GM. "We can sign", " He will be avaiable"...bleh.

 

Yeah, BKS really made some valid points. If we are going to make a playoff push, then we will need more leadership on this young team. My only problem is with depth. Like I said, if we had more depth, I would have no problem with Mckie still being on the roster. With Profit, we get another guy that we know can play, and will strengthen our bench. With Kobe getting older, I just think it would be wise to limit his minutes as much as possible, just so he can stay effective longer. I just hope that next season he wont have to play like 48 minutes a game, and when he is off the court, our 2nd unit will continue to push and not give up leads