<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">That's a stupid argument, and you know it. Both Erving and Iverson were the focal point of their teams, so counting rings is a valid argument.</div> Not really, since that ignores the teams they had around them. Erving won his ring with league MVP Moses Malone, 3 other allstars in Malone, Cheeks, and Toney, and two first team All-Defense players in Cheeks and Bobby Jones. I said it before, and I'll say it again. Teams win championships, not players.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">I said it before, and I'll say it again. Teams win championships, not players.</div> Bingo. I'll guarantee that Allen Iverson WILL NEVER win an NBA Championship because he simply isn't a team player. Team players don't miss practices. Team players don't show up late for the last game of the season even if they're out of it. I don't care how many scoring titles Iverson has, or MVP trophy's. The big number is that he has ZERO Championships, and he'll always have ZERO.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting C.K.:</div><div class="quote_post"> I don't care how many scoring titles Iverson has, or MVP trophy's. The big number is that he has ZERO Championships, and he'll always have ZERO.</div> You missed my point.
Chutney, your right. Erving's career at this point would be better than Iverson's. I agree with that.
But, I still don't think you can completely dismiss a championship. You have to take in context, which is why I stressed the part about being reasonable about it. Erving was still the leader of that team (despite Malone winning MVP that year), and it takes something special to lead a team to that level. Iverson has yet to show that type of leadership ability. And while he has not been surrounded by as much talent as Erving, he has also made it harder for a GM to surround him with talented teammates.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Chutney:</div><div class="quote_post">. Erving was still the leader of that team (despite Malone winning MVP that year), and it takes something special to lead a team to that level. </div> When you have three other allstars on the team with you, including the league MVP, I don't see his leadership being such an important factor. Would Erving have won a championship with the team Iverson had around him in 2001? Probably not. I have no problem saying Dr. J was a greater player than Iverson. I just don't think the championship has anything to do with that. Greatness isn't defined by your championships. They can be an indication of greatness, but it doesn't follow that you need to have won a championship to be a great player.
