There's not gurantee in anything, so there isn't really anything for us to argue about. It's one game and out, if the NBA playoffs was one and out, Philly would've won a championship in 2001.
And what if he doesnt make a difference? What kind of thread is this...Dont be so stupid and start making statements like that, it wasn't as easy in the FIBA and it wont be as easy in the olympics as well.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting phunDamentalz:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe wouldn't have changed JACK. The very idea that Kobe would have changed the outcome IS A PART OF THE REASON why U.S.A. didn't win gold. The whole idea of we need a superstar, etc. It has nothing to do with choking; the guys on team USA are professional ballers and among the very best in the world and all have hit big shots in their career, the idea that Kobe is one level beyond is stupid cause he's not, he's mortal, don't you get it? Wade is one of the clutchest guys out there and he couldn't beat Greece by himself. Take kobe off the pedestal for once. And besides the 81 points what has he done since Shaq left? NOt that much.</div> Great Post man. What has Kobe proved on an international basketball stage? Nothing, because as far as I know he's never even played a game of international ball. I'm not saying he would hurt the team, or he shouldn't play for the team, but to say he would "easily" have lead them to gold is ridiculous. How about bringing back the guys that won team USA it's last gold? KG, Kidd, Vince, etc. People so easily forget how Vince dominated in Sydney, and was arguably USA's best player.
That's the problem with the american game everyone thinks its based on individuals, when its based on the team complex. Which is why the US got beat by a team with no NBA stars at all, its statements like "if we had so and so" that cause the US to lag behind the world. Its about the team not the individual. Todays NBA is dominated by teams with one good player and a bunch of followers, which is why NBA players have a hard time transitioning to equal team play.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">I never saw Sabonis play in the 80s. Perhaps he was an exception. But didn't he also play a lot on the perimeter and high post? That was where he was primarily stationed when with the Blazers.</div> I saw games where Arvydas was driving to the hole... No bull.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting virve119:</div><div class="quote_post">Great Post man. What has Kobe proved on an international basketball stage? Nothing, because as far as I know he's never even played a game of international ball. I'm not saying he would hurt the team, or he shouldn't play for the team, but to say he would "easily" have lead them to gold is ridiculous. How about bringing back the guys that won team USA it's last gold? KG, Kidd, Vince, etc. People so easily forget how Vince dominated in Sydney, and was arguably USA's best player.</div> Yeah right that was a stupid post. Kobe is the only player with top three per and 1st team defense in the NBA today, all that without a presence at Center, unlike Wade or LeBron. What has Wade proven on the international stage? What does Kobe not having played yet have to do with anything? Kobe is much better on defense and is a better Free-Throw Shooter. Make a few stops, make more free throws (the US Shot 58% from the free throw line in that game) and we have a good chance at beating Greece. Spain is another matter. The US didn't get a chance to play against them.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting huevonkiller:</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah right that was a stupid post. Kobe is the only player with top three per and 1st team defense in the NBA today, all that without a presence at Center, unlike Wade or LeBron. What has Wade proven on the international stage? What does Kobe not having played yet have to do with anything? Kobe is much better on defense and is a better Free-Throw Shooter. Make a few stops, make more free throws (the US Shot 58% from the free throw line in that game) and we have a good chance at beating Greece. Spain is another matter. The US didn't get a chance to play against them.</div> Kobe is a ball hog man, he takes 50 shots a game. Now give D-Wade or LeBron, even Melo that, and they'd be up there with Kobe status wise. Kobe wouldn't of done jack for this team, they were shooting for the team ball concept, no way in hell Kobe would of been helpful to this team. All you Lakers fans kiss Kobe's ass and act like he's god!
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">A few things here, Kobe isn't the best defender on the olympic team, that's Shane Battier. I'm a huge Kobe fan, but even I realize that Battier is better than him. And next, I don't think having Kobe would have mattered. We shot too many threes, we didn't go to our bigs enough, and we shot free throws horribly. Kobe might have helped, but we'll never know, so I don't think you can proclaim something like that.</div> I know Kobe is not currently the best defender on the team, I was merely speculationg. I think he can bring up his defensive level like in the early 2000's, if he has less responsibilities. Heh, this is all a hypothesis of mine, I am not proclaiming anything.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting J_Ray:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe is a ball hog man, he takes 50 shots a game. Now give D-Wade or LeBron, even Melo that, and they'd be up there with Kobe status wise. Kobe wouldn't of done jack for this team, they were shooting for the team ball concept, no way in hell Kobe would of been helpful to this team. All you Lakers fans kiss Kobe's ass and act like he's god!</div> Wow you have issues, this doesn't even merit a response. I merely reported the News to you. His per is that high, his defense is that good, and he does not play with a strong prescence at center.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting phunDamentalz:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe wouldn't have changed JACK. The very idea that Kobe would have changed the outcome IS A PART OF THE REASON why U.S.A. didn't win gold. The whole idea of we need a superstar, etc. It has nothing to do with choking; the guys on team USA are professional ballers and among the very best in the world and all have hit big shots in their career, the idea that Kobe is one level beyond is stupid cause he's not, he's mortal, don't you get it? Wade is one of the clutchest guys out there and he couldn't beat Greece by himself. Take kobe off the pedestal for once. And besides the 81 points what has he done since Shaq left? NOt that much.</div> Wade, Lebron, Melo are all good players and future great players. But there is a seperation between them and Kobe. Kobe at this point, is a smarter player than any of the "BIG 3" on Team USA. I saw one of the players on Greece damn near break Lebron's ankles right before he eyeballed a 3 in his face. I understand players comin off picks, but there is no way in hell they should be beating our players off the dribble or catching them off balance. Kobe is a GREAT player and Team USA has players "on the verge" of greatness. There still learning parts of the game Kobe has already mastered. Although Lebron is prolly more athletic, Wade is quicker, and Melo is stronger, Kobe's overrall WILL would've pushed that team over the top.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting J_Ray:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe is a ball hog man, he takes 50 shots a game. Now give D-Wade or LeBron, even Melo that, and they'd be up there with Kobe status wise. Kobe wouldn't of done jack for this team, they were shooting for the team ball concept, no way in hell Kobe would of been helpful to this team. All you Lakers fans kiss Kobe's ass and act like he's god!</div> This post is pure ignorance J_Ray. He does not take 50 shots per game, even when he scored his 81 points he took under 50 shots. Claiming Kobe Bryant doesn't understand the team concept is also ridiculous. He's one of the few players in the league who dedicates a majority of his life to basketball. He trains vigorously in the offseason and watches hours of game footage to pick out a team's weaknesses and then exploit them. Kobe is not a ball hog, he's a difference maker on the court. If his team is struggling to score, then yes, he's going to take over offensively and get his team back in the game with points. If his team is hitting shots, he'll continue to be the play maker and quarterback and offense. And when his team needs a defensive stop, he usually delivers for them. Having Kobe on the team wouldn't have guaranteed a Gold medal, but he would have been a positive influence on this young team. A lot of the players on Team USA respect his game and look to him for advice. I think Kobe would have elevated the intensity of this team and brought some passion to winning the tournament.
A totally agree with phunDamentalz. Thinking another individual addition will cause us to be a better team is the reason why we lost. We are already WAYYYYYYYY more talented than any team out there, more talent would just be useless. We need to play as a team, mainly on defense, but also on offense. Kobe's intelligent wouldnt help us defend the pick and roll, because it takes at least two people to stop the pick and roll, usually a 3rd and 4th to defend the roll from the weak side. Kobe's will would do nothin to help this team.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheFreshPrince:</div><div class="quote_post">A totally agree with phunDamentalz. Thinking another individual addition will cause us to be a better team is the reason why we lost. We are already WAYYYYYYYY more talented than any team out there, more talent would just be useless. We need to play as a team, mainly on defense, but also on offense. Kobe's intelligent wouldnt help us defend the pick and roll, because it takes at least two people to stop the pick and roll, usually a 3rd and 4th to defend the roll from the weak side. Kobe's will would do nothin to help this team.</div> At the very least, he would have helped the FT percentage of team USA and made some random defensive stop. That alone would invalidate your comment.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">This post is pure ignorance J_Ray. He does not take 50 shots per game, even when he scored his 81 points he took under 50 shots. Claiming Kobe Bryant doesn't understand the team concept is also ridiculous. He's one of the few players in the league who dedicates a majority of his life to basketball. He trains vigorously in the offseason and watches hours of game footage to pick out a team's weaknesses and then exploit them. Kobe is not a ball hog, he's a difference maker on the court. If his team is struggling to score, then yes, he's going to take over offensively and get his team back in the game with points. If his team is hitting shots, he'll continue to be the play maker and quarterback and offense. And when his team needs a defensive stop, he usually delivers for them. Having Kobe on the team wouldn't have guaranteed a Gold medal, but he would have been a positive influence on this young team. A lot of the players on Team USA respect his game and look to him for advice. I think Kobe would have elevated the intensity of this team and brought some passion to winning the tournament.</div> I agree with Shape as well as the following: Also look at the different teammates that those people have compared to Kobe if you want to talk about his NBA play. I won't say Kobe would've won the gold medal for US, but I will say that he would've helped. Anyone that says that he shouldn't and can't play international ball because he never has needs to hush up, cause all the people playing international bal right now for the US has had a first time too at one point and time, can they also not play international ball before they first played? That's not a legit argument so trash it. No doubt Melo, Wade, and Bron are great players, I'm merely stating that Kobe would help, these guys are too young to have to maintain composure throughtout those last minutes as we all witnessed. But they also have had clutch play as well. I believe the only problem with this team is experience. Playing together more will help them more, that's that. And I say this with or without Kobe.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting TheFreshPrince:</div><div class="quote_post">A totally agree with phunDamentalz. Thinking another individual addition will cause us to be a better team is the reason why we lost. We are already WAYYYYYYYY more talented than any team out there, more talent would just be useless. We need to play as a team, mainly on defense, but also on offense. Kobe's intelligent wouldnt help us defend the pick and roll, because it takes at least two people to stop the pick and roll, usually a 3rd and 4th to defend the roll from the weak side. Kobe's will would do nothin to help this team.</div> More talent is never useless, especially when you have the IQ to take advantage of your talent. Kobe is the embodiment of being a gifted athlete and understanding the fundamentals of basketball.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting shapecity:</div><div class="quote_post">More talent is never useless, especially when you have the IQ to take advantage of your talent. Kobe is the embodiment of being a gifted athlete and understanding the fundamentals of basketball.</div> but adding one person more intelligent adds nothing really since our problem was team defence not individual defence. Kobe's intelligence would not help us imo, just because no one else was willing to play as a team. Maybe kobe's leadership could have gotten them to play as a team, idk though. More talent is useless in that, we are already so much mroe talented that, we could have easily won if we played as a team, with a lot less talent. This is the NBA, just about everyone not in it, isnt good enough to be (europe wise). The europeans just play much more fundamentally sound ball, and share. I dont see how adding one guy would change any of those problems. Lets say Kobe does everything perfectly, and shares the ball and plays perfect defense (even help side, which he isnt great at) then we will still have problems with the pick and roll, and have trouble scoring since if kobe is passing, everyone else will still be jacking up threes to their heart's content. We have to learn that we cant outshoot these guys. We need to spread the ball and use our athletism and size to our advantage.
I don't know how well Kobe would have fit in with this team only b/c this team was built on speed and Kobe seems more comfortable operating in the half court. I can't really see him consistently advancing the ball with the pass nor can I see him running the lanes consistently in transition. Obviously what I know that he can help our national team with is his defensive intensity and his will to win but b/c of Kobe's strong willed personality I could see the team dividing into advocates and advisaries of Kobe. Kobe does not conform to his teammates. He is a leader (or loner depending on who you talk to) by nature. I don't know if the trust level would even develop for him to conform to the coach. It took some time for that to develop with Phil and in a three week span with other superstar talents surrounding him I'm not sure if he'd be able to make the adjustments that the coach may require him to make. That doesn't make him wrong if he doesn't b/c as we've seen in the past two WC's and in 2004 in Athens sometimes the coaches do not have all of the answers. Personnel hasn't been the problem the past four years. It has been managing and maximizing player personnel that has killed us -- along with our inability to defend at the international level. We don't need specialists, we just need a coach that can put the players that are selected in the best possible position to win the gold. If that means to try out a multitude of things in the exhibition and preliminary games to see what works w/ what line ups then so be it. We have no versatility whatsoever and I attribute that solely to the ignorance and arrogance of Jerry Colangelo (and before him Stu Jackson) and of our coaching staffs the past four years. I think that this thread should be titled: Make no mistake, w/ Chuck Daly the USA easily comes home w/ gold.
Wow just because U.S. loses a game, everone is mad. Its not like they can't lose a game just because they are U.S. The rest of the world has caught up, and its time U.S. realizes that they need to step up their game and stop taking it easily. Dont get mad just because U.S. lost. They will come home with Gold in 2008. Having Kobe on Team U.S.A wouldnt affect the team much in my opinion.
<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Moo2K4:</div><div class="quote_post">A few things here, Kobe isn't the best defender on the olympic team, that's Shane Battier. I'm a huge Kobe fan, but even I realize that Battier is better than him. And next, I don't think having Kobe would have mattered. We shot too many threes, we didn't go to our bigs enough, and we shot free throws horribly. Kobe might have helped, but we'll never know, so I don't think you can proclaim something like that.</div> Actually Kobe is a better defender than Shane Battier. Kobe spends more energy on the offense, thus he can't always put 100% effort to his defensive game. The 1st Defensive Team honor doesn't come because he was a superstar. Also to say we didn't use our big in that Greece game enough is pretty ridiculous. To doubt Coach K's coaching ability is simply plain ignorant. if you watch the game, that "baby shaq" was manhandled Elton Brand in the post to the point where Coach K had to take him out and played small ball. Also we were down by 12 coming into the 4th quarter, and using the bigs in desperate time is useless. Of course, by theory, we should have dominate them in the paint but they are playing great team defense to the point where the game now rely on outside shooting and free-throw, this is what Kobe is best at. After all, we lost this game wasn't because of our offense but it is our defense. We coudln't stop anybody on the pick n roll. Having Kobe and Shane Battier, at the same time, can at least provide some defensive stop. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Kobe is a ball hog man, he takes 50 shots a game. Now give D-Wade or LeBron, even Melo that, and they'd be up there with Kobe status wise. Kobe wouldn't of done jack for this team, they were shooting for the team ball concept, no way in hell Kobe would of been helpful to this team. All you Lakers fans kiss Kobe's ass and act like he's god!</div> Wack, you should just stop from here.
Iron Shiek, do you think Team USA would be more successful running halfcourt sets? In the NBA teams who execute in the halfcourt have won the last ten or so NBA titles. I'm not sure how well the strategy would translate into FIBA rules, but I'd love to hear your insight on it. I miss Chuck Daly on the sidelines coaching. He would be ideal for coaching under these circumstances because Chuck kept it simple on offense. He'd run the same play over and over again until you figured out how to stop it. Then he'd counter your defensive switch and force you to adjust again. He did a radio interview a couple of weeks ago down here in LA. He's spent a lot of time with workshops and basketball camps in Europe. He kept a journal of his experience and turned it into a book, Daly Life "Every Step a Struggle": Memoirs of a World-Champion Coach. He predicted the rest of the world would catch up with Team USA basketball 10 years ago. He mentioned this team might struggle since there's only one true center on the roster. Greece proved him right in overpowering Team USA.
