Article: Nelson ready to shake up the Warrior

Talk about brutal honesty. Nelson basically slapped our starting front court right there, and first, I thought it was a made up interview.

I am not terribly optimistic on Diogu's role with Nelson either. Nelson likes guards who can post up and forwards who can shoot. That's where Davis, Richardson and Murphy fits in. He also likes point forward and shot blocker if necessary, which is not Diogu's strength. And, I don't know Diogu just didn't shoot from outside or he just doesn't have 18 footer. But, last year, his majority shots came from inside.

http://www.nba.com/hotzones/popup.html

Diogu has skills, but I don't know his skills will fit into Nelson's system. To make things worse, like Clif mentioned, we have logjam at PF spot, and all Dunleavy, Murphy, Taft, and Zarko has some skills that Nelson may like. Even if Nelson likes Diogu, he may go with other players, who fits in better with his system. And, I can't recall one undersize PF Nelson really utilized. Everybody wish every Warriors players would thrive with Nelson. But, unless there are injuries, some people will be buried on the bench. I guess we will find out who those people will be once the season starts...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting Kwan1031:</div><div class="quote_post">And, I don't know Diogu just didn't shoot from outside or he just doesn't have 18 footer. But, last year, his majority shots came from inside.
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You'd be surprised. Diogu is actually a very good shooter, and probably has a better jumpshot than Murphy believe it or not. I think the fact that he is one of our highest FT% shooters says something about his shot. He has Elton Brand range I feel. In college he shot ~39% from 3pt... that has to say something.

The reason why his shots came from the inside is because thats what we needed him to do, score in the paint. It'd be interesting to see him nail 3's, which I believe he can. But whats the point of drafting a paint player if he's not in the paint.

I think if Ike doesn't adapt to a running game, Nelson will use him in games where the Warriors have trouble running against defensive teams. Since Diogu can score at will in slowed game.

 

That's what I heard in college as well. But, he hardly shot any 18 fters in his rookie season. And, because his short jumpers looked far better than his post up games in his rookie season, I was wondering whether he feels comfortable shooting outside jumpers or it's just a part of the game plan. Also, one of the reason why Nelson likes big man to shoot jumper is because those big man can spread the floor. While Diogu's short jumper looked good, he won't spread the floor like what Murphy can do.

If Nelson has no choice but to use Diogu, he will probably do well. However, we have a lot of players who may do well in Nelson's system, and sombody is bounded to be buried. Considering Nelson's history, I just can't feel very optimistic on Diogu's future...

 

Nelson has to adapt to the team's more versatile scorers IMO because if we ride the softie Murphy/Dunleavy F/C tandem this season, it will be a disaster. Having Diogu play a power position will combine the types of things Nelson likes in a forward like Antwan Jamison offensively or the way Danny Fortson put a body on people as an enforcer as F/C. I think Kwan has good reason to worry but I think Nelson could experiment with Diogu as the season comes along (Diogu definitely hustles enough and uses his brain like Mullin did). There's definitely more that we know about Murphy/Dunleavy versus any first year rookie who played in only a few games. Like AF brought up, it's good that Diogu at least knows how to get to the line at will (using his wide body and smooth footwork) and convert at the foul line.

I'm sure the rookie development last year wasn't that bad despite lack of playing time, but demoting Foyle and losing Fisher should affect the backup point/big man roles and should help Ellis and Diogu get even better in their sophmore year. Those are two good players with different types of nba bodies that we lack and they have solid heads on their shoulders. They are guys who understand the game better than our Euro projects. Experience is the one thing I hope the whole team can develop in addition to the skills their positions require to keep the game honest.

 

i want to hear nelsons specific oppinions on Ike, Monta and MP. Also, i'm curious to hear what he has to say about beidrins. what kind of playing time u think he'll give ellis and peitrus?

 

I think Diogu will play mostly center. I hope he does not get lost in the rotation...

 

There's no question J Rich will play + produce-so Nellie had little to say in terms of changes-though he may be using him more in the SF role. J Rich's style had been equal parts SE/SG anyhow.

Ike/Biedrens/Ellis each showed a lot-and expectations are generally that they get time and they produce. Nellie did talk about Ellis,if you are thinking speed-obviously he's got to be in the mix.
Otherwise-his statements were often focused on guys who-under the limits of Montyball-did not play like they probably can. Baron-Troy-Pietrus-Dun are guys who have had important roles over the last few years-so got discussed.

 

So if Murphy is starting at C, did he mean Dun would be starting at PF (with I guess Pietrus starting at SF?), or are we thinking Dun would start at SF but play some PF, and that Ike would start at PF? Or as REMEM hints, would JRich move to start at SF? I'm confused as to how all of this is going to work. What is the starting lineup? Assuming Murphy starts at C and Dun has to start somewhere...

 

Neslon also states that Murphy will get help in defendig centers..?. Who will this help come from in a small line-up with Dun at PF? I dont believe that Neslon will go that small for a starting 5. I would throw Ike or Biens in the starting line-up and leave Pietrus and Monta out.

 

I remember Monty using Murphy at C with Dunleavy playing dribble penetrating PG role at PF spot and that was horrible defensively, slow as heck + mediocre offensively. Nelson would probably only use this lineup in rare cases because like hiRez points out who would help Murphy and Dunleavy defensively? Dunleavy is a decent perimeter/post defender on a tall SF or light PF, but he's not going to defend the rim compared to Ike Diogu who actually led the Pac-10 in blocked shots (my opinion).

I would like to see this lineup instead.

PG: Baron Davis (double team threat, primary playmaker, primary offense in the post)
SG: Jason Richardson (primary or secondary scorer from anywhere, secondary playmaker on offense, sf on defense)
SF: Mickael Pietrus on offense/sg on defense (lockdown defender on either guard position, baseline 3 point shooter, 5th option scorer, can he make smart decisions on the break?)
PF: Ike Diogu (primary paint scorer, offensive rebounder, secondary playmaker from the high post or low post kickouts. Acts like a Danny Fortson type enforcer or Eduardo Najera type scrapper - Guys Nelson liked at one time in Dallas)
C: Zarko Cabarkapa (primary playmaker from the top of the key when Baron is off the ball, not a good rebounder, but an offensive nightmare for the center guarding him. Is like a lighter Dirk Nowitzki that can't rebound or block shots very well. Good passer and ballhandler for when we need to create.)

Bench:
PG: Ellis
SG: Devin Brown
SF/PF: Dunleavy
PF/C: Biedrins
PF/C: Murphy

Yeah, I pretty much don't like Murphy (consistent scoring/rebounding but limited defensively or playmaking) or Dunleavy (just plain inconsistent) Zarko is inconsistent as well, but he is on the closer side of the spectrum to Dirk Nowitzki with the ball or Toni Kukoc type passing. Zarko borrows something from both players who could play some center if they wanted to compared to a pure position type of guy like Ike Diogu. I think Ike needs to play to bring some scrappiness and creativity that Murphy can lack We need that one dude that all the Dallas teams seemed to have with either of Fortson or Najera to battle their way for offensive rebounding position.

Pietrus would be 5th option offense and would handle the role at SF guarding the opposing shooting guard (hopefully Nelly recognizes the value that Pietrus could have on guarding shooting guards instead of small forwards). Jrich could outrun most small forwards on offense but would be exposed defensively so he should probably guard the other team's least scoring swingman. He could be a better offensive version of Desmond Mason, but we should be cautious against the kinds of lineups where Shawn Marion, Rashard Lewis or Carmelo Anthony get substituted against him. It hurts him offensively and defensively...

I would think that if Nelson truly wants scoring and all the athleticism and guys who can rebound/shoot the ball playing, he would go with my suggested lineup but sub in Murphy for when we need a 3 point marksman or a good defensive rebounder who can bring some consistency to two already questionable international players starting (Pietrus/Zarko). Dunleavy should have to prove himself from the bench, I think, because these past years he really hasn't done much to warrant starting. He is just like Foyle IMO. Those two did some great things in college, are great teammates, got drafted high in the nba, but the nba transition has not been so great for them as starters.

So far Foyle/Dunleavy were the players that were in question last season when the starting lineup actually changed. Monty saw some value in Pietrus (when he actually got 20 points, scored on putbacks, shot okay from the field), but he's not a very coachable player because he is unpredictable and doesn't understand the plays or nba rules (not smart or natural in basketball instinct).

When Pietrus started doing worse and couldn't get out of a shooting slump, it was Dunleavy back in again, but then Foyle was replaced with Ike (a guy who actually is more polished than any of our current reserve big men). So if either Pietrus or Dunleavy starts, I don't care as long as Zarko and Ike get some burn instead of Murphy. This starting roster should have creative players not the kind like Fisher or Murphy... Besides we need some consistency off the bench...

 

P.S.: Where do we find a suitable small forward on the cheap? We've got no reserve small forwards...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting custodianrules2:</div><div class="quote_post">P.S.: Where do we find a suitable small forward on the cheap? We've got no reserve small forwards...</div>

Maybe Bonzi for cheap for one year on the MLE

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AnimeFANatic:</div><div class="quote_post">Maybe Bonzi for cheap for one year on the MLE </div>
His agent would probably laugh, but who knows. Maybe Bonzi will do the Stephen Jackson thing he did with the Hawks, but Bonzi's like 30 now isn't he? I doubt he'll get big money, especially because he could wash up and be a head case at the same time. Thank goodness Dun, Baron and Foyle and Fish weren't absolute whiners. Talk about collective trade value taking a big dump.

Bonzi is a mess when he shoots, but he does everything else well. He is a red flag though... He is strong in some ways like Jrich as a power guard.

 

Well there were rumors of him going to the rockets for their 2 mil MLE... despite his potential of being a head ache, he could be the piece the Warriors need alongside Baron and J-Rich. And if he does sign for a MLE, I hope it's here.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quoting AnimeFANatic:</div><div class="quote_post">Well there were rumors of him going to the rockets for their 2 mil MLE... despite his potential of being a head ache, he could be the piece the Warriors need alongside Baron and J-Rich. And if he does sign for a MLE, I hope it's here.</div>
If he's going for that cheap, I wonder why the Spurs haven't contacted him. Did they run out of renewable MLE? I would use him to replace Mike Finley or as a scoring substitute for Bowen (If Bonzi isn't shooting himself out of games that is).

 

His goal is to join the FA market next season with high value. I doubt the Spurs would give him the chance to build his numbers up when they have Bowen and Finley.

 

True that. But there is a ring involved