Hornets vs. Warriors @ Home Nov. 9, 2006

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">The team has responded and after tonight, they are 3 and 2 and have only had one bad game. Not a bad start.</div>
I think they are 3-3. But I agree, that it's not a bad start considering that J-rich has not played well and has disrupted their chemistry to some extent.

 

I really love this kid Monta. As mentioned, he has really stepped up to the plate. One gripe I have is he's not a pure point guard and he's shown signs of immaturity in crunch time. But, he's learning and learning fast thanks to Nellie.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Kensaku Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I really love this kid Monta. As mentioned, he has really stepped up to the plate. One gripe I have is he's not a pure point guard and he's shown signs of immaturity in crunch time. But, he's learning and learning fast thanks to Nellie.</div>

Nelson feels the same way as he's stated before, that to become great Monta needs to become a PG or else he'll just be a 6th man SG in his career. Nelson is doing what he can to make Monta a PG.

From the games recap:

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Ellis, whose minutes have increased every game, fouled out in the final minutes and got a huge ovation from the crowd and a hug from Nelson.

"Monta is a little turnover prone, but we are willing to fight through that with him," Nelson said before the game. "He needs to be on the floor more. His numbers are better than everybody on the team. He defends well ... the only negative to his game is his assists-to-turnovers ratio." </div>

 

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">You don't want Donnie Nelson here because that would be nepotism. We had that trouble last time around.

I think Mullin and Nelson will be a good management combination. Nelson hopefully will tell Mullin off when it comes to doling out contracts. He's got the experience to be able to tell Mullin he sucks to his face and not worry about getting fired. I can't see Monty ever doing that.

Mullin will be able to reign in Nelson, too, when he starts trying to take over. It's still Mullin's team after all. However, Mullin will probably listen to Nelson more in terms of personnel. What was good to hear was Nellie say that he will start looking at changing the team if he has to. The team has responded and after tonight, they are 3 and 2 and have only had one bad game. Not a bad start.</div>

Actually, Nelson won't be around forever, so his son Donnie could make a better GM if Mullin fails to make something happen soon. Donnie was sort of instrumental to the Mavericks resurgence. And of course Nelson played a big part, but he and Donnie were looking at players in Europe and they found underrated talent in different places. I'm not sure we did that much after Nelson was let go.

 

Here's the knee jerk reaction that I assumed would be on the board by now:

Do you think that we should package JRich in an attempt to get a bigtime 3,4, or 5?

I mean, Dunleavy, Murphy, and JRich should all officially be on the trade list. I know everyone will want Monta, Ike and Beans now.

Does it make sense to get rid of some youth that are playing well to try to get a guy like Oneal or Garnett?

 

I thought we played well. The three's were a bit too much but Roberson was money off the bench. We ran the floor very well and Richardson should have sat out earlier. He clearly wasn't ready or in shape.

Our rebounding is really bad and our interior defense is still really bad. I really think we need to hire a big man coach and have him teach our guys to properly box out. The FT shooting coach should be given a pulitzer prize, get a big man coach....NOW. If we can marginally improve by hiring another coach, then DO IT.

Our free throws were good, our backcourt was great and Dunleavy played pretty good even though he plays like a barefoot, pregnant woman.

 

<div class="quote_poster">CohanHater Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Here's the knee jerk reaction that I assumed would be on the board by now:

Do you think that we should package JRich in an attempt to get a bigtime 3,4, or 5?

I mean, Dunleavy, Murphy, and JRich should all officially be on the trade list. I know everyone will want Monta, Ike and Beans now.

Does it make sense to get rid of some youth that are playing well to try to get a guy like Oneal or Garnett?</div>

If Pietrus continues to play well and Jason is still struggling or on the bench, maybe there is a possiblility to trade Jason Richardson in a package for a post player like Jermaine O'Neal or Shawn Marion. This has only been the first week of the season. I think more answers and ideas of this team can be made a month or so from now. However, the problem with depending on Pietrus to be a starter is that he is very injury prone. But I think there are a lot of possibilities of different types of trades the Warriors can do before the deadline this year. It will be interesting to see if the Warriors decide to make one and which one they would make.

 

I'd be surprised to see a deal for an older $20 mill a year player-especially if we give up J Rich and several young players. It's hard to mix the contracts of-say-J O'Neal-Foyle-Dunleavy...and have something for the rest of the team.
A hundred versions of Dump Foyle,Dump Dunleavy have been mentioned somewhere-but none happened and many would have cost us a lot.

J Rich is the Go-To scorer unless his knee crumbles to dust...or we get a knockout deal. Nellie will be pretty reluctant to deal him.

The Warriors need these players to improve,need the team to improve,need to win. Then we are not seen as desperate,our guys are not seen in terms of their flaws. Then we are not "tossing in" a guy who takes off.

Something we MIGHT do....Dunleavy and Warriors 07 #1 for- ?
I think we are seen as an under .500 team. When we DO start winning-the value of that pick drops. Dunleavy's stock is not high now. It won't get better when his role shrinks.

 

I wouldn't trade our 2007 #1 pick, but would trade Philly's #1 pick. The 2007 draft is way deep and we could always make a trade to move up. As for Dunleavy, I'm resigned to trading him next year when his BYC status comes off.

For example, in the 2006 draft, we could've won the coin flip from Houston and gotten Rudy Gay. That wasn't supposed to be a deep draft. Or if we had Nelson as coach last season, I doubt he would've let JRich play against Dallas which was a meaningless game except as a moral victory and confidence booster. If JRich didn't play, then likely we would've had one more loss than Houston and again had a shot at Rudy Gay.

That said, we do need to make a trade in order to get more rebounding and interior defense. I'd see if Memphis would be willing to give up Hakim Warrick for Ike. Ike is a bit short at PF while Warrick would be the taller and more athletic PF that Don Nelson needs. We may have to take some Memphis baggage like Stomile Swift, but we can send them Zarko in return and Keith McLeod to even up salaries.

I'm also fine with trading MP because we can play JRich at SF with a Monta - Baron backcourt or move MDJ back to SF. We also have Matt Barnes now who can play some SF.

It doesn't look as if MDJ will be playing much PF anymore since that experiment wasn't very successful.

 

<div class="quote_poster">upsidedownside7 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Our rebounding is really bad and our interior defense is still really bad. I really think we need to hire a big man coach and have him teach our guys to properly box out. The FT shooting coach should be given a pulitzer prize, get a big man coach....NOW. If we can marginally improve by hiring another coach, then DO IT.</div>

Nellie has said he doesn't think boxing out will do the trick. He wants the Warriors smaller guys to hit their man and bounce out in order to get rebounds. I also think he means to go for the strip or tap the ball out if they aren't in postion to grab the ball. Usually, the smaller man will have to go around the bigger man in order to go after the rebound. That's not to say they can't block out if they get position, but it's more likely the smaller Warriors will be the ones getting blocked.

Still, I think the Warriors end up trading for a bigger and mobile man. They can play Murphy and AB if need be to shore up rebounding. Maybe get POB in there for a few minutes. I think Nelson would give up some of their running game in order to get boards. Since MDJ at PF has failed, Nellie has said he'll go with Ike and Murphy at PF.

 

All good comments and perspectives. I like.

Who could have foreseen Dun failing at power forward?

Not to sound like a broken record or a hater, but how can a guy who plays so small for a 6'9-6'10 230 lb man, play one position size higher? Also, traditionally power forwards or centers (mainly center) should be the last line of defense. Sure Dun's got some games where he dishes out 4 assists, maybe a few blocks, and the occasional dribble drive move, but its not his game on a nightly basis. I'm really hoping for Biedrins to move up but can he stay on the floor? Also, I meant Murphy kind of does the same when he's asked to do something besides rebounding and shooting. He can pass, block maybe 1 shot every other game, and maybe score inside, but he's not really that big of a guy either, except for the defensive glass.

Maybe the Warriors did try to do something in the offseason with Chris Wilcox, Melvin Ely or somebody that could emulate a big guy that can finish inside or somebody... Anyone remember those Chris Wilcox rumors or Melvin Ely? BTW I'm not sure if Ely is a good finisher, but he is a good post defender and shotblocker when he puts his mind to it (from what I've heard and seen). But his numbers as of late don't look good, but he looked decent at the end of last year. Same with Wilcox.

 

Man... Luke Walton is becoming what Dunleavy was supposed to be. And Luke Walton costs cheap!

 

I don't like Dunleavy's demeanor. He's too passive it seems. There's a lot better scoring, passing, dribbling small forwards out there and we seem to miss out on them or Mullin won't try to land a trade for them when they're value is low. Like I wonder if we could have been that team to get Joe Johnson from the Celtics. I wonder if we could have been that team to get Diaw from Atlanta. I wonder if we could have gotten Mike Miller when fans and coaches were frustrated with his shot selection and softness. I'll take any of those guys over what we have. We've got a giant bust on our hands if we don't believe Dun can get his numbers back like in '03-04 season. Even if he put up decent numbers for starting small forwards, he still wasn't very good that often. He was invisible. That's not what starting players do.

I don't know what is attainable for the Warriors in trades or ability to scout out other talent, but I wish they wouldn't latch on to these homegrown guys that just don't have that decent nba athletic ability or the drive to lead by example. Dun is a captain of all things... Man... things better change soon because we can't have a guy who does only well in preseason be captain for the entire regular season and just continue to suck. It's not all Dunleavy's fault, but he's a big portion of why we suck. He just doesn't fit anywhere right now and he might never fit because he doesn't shoot well in the nba, he chokes on free throws for a pure shooter type, and he is too slow, soft, or weak for certain positions.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Gohn Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I think they are 3-3. But I agree, that it's not a bad start considering that J-rich has not played well and has disrupted their chemistry to some extent.</div>

I just hope they stay that way when they get on the long road trips. A team is good when they can win on the road, especially against teams they are supposed to beat.

I can't wait for Jrich to get healthy because I think he'll make a nice small forward like a Bonzi Wells/Desmond Mason type only better. And if Pietrus can ever replicate his 5 assist game, he'd make a dynamite shooting guard sort of like how Ricky Davis did on the Celtics/Twolves. The thing I hated about Jrich being a shooting guard is he is not that great on the dribble penetration and drive and dish. He's okay, but anytime he spins his way in the paint, he's going up with it. The same problem of not being able to drive much goes with Dunleavy and his lack of quickness to dribble penetrate against small forwards. He can do it against more athletic/quicker guys his own size, but that's only if they respect his step back jump shot enough to get pump faked into the air or moved off balance. If Dunleavy doesn't shoot, there's no way he can operate with the ball. It gets even more complicated by the fact we have no big man presence in the paint to pass to inside or get defenders to collapse inside. It might play a small factor in whether a shooter feels safe in taking a jumper rather than looking inside first or knowing there are strong offensive rebounders getting inside position to grab the miss if we fall short.

 

Dunleavy is just not good. But Joe Johnson? Yeah he's nice but at $12-13M per season? You think Dunleavy's a drag on the cap, what would Joe Johnson do?

Pietrus with 5 assists was awesome, I just hope he's not going to fall in love with the 3 again.

This game was a good win but again, the Warriors, up 9 early in the 4th get stops and then jack up 3s. Luckily, the Hornets could not stop Baron late in the 4th.

 

<div class="quote_poster">philsmith75 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Dunleavy is just not good. But Joe Johnson? Yeah he's nice but at $12-13M per season? You think Dunleavy's a drag on the cap, what would Joe Johnson do?

Pietrus with 5 assists was awesome, I just hope he's not going to fall in love with the 3 again.

This game was a good win but again, the Warriors, up 9 early in the 4th get stops and then jack up 3s. Luckily, the Hornets could not stop Baron late in the 4th.</div>

12-13 mil ain't bad for a borderline all-star in JJ, especially when Dunleavy makes about $9 mil. Imagine if we didn't have Foyle or Dun with those ridiculous contracts... JJ would have been awesome.