What I find interesting about this thread is the amoung of young talent the league has at the PF/C positon... Dwight Howard Yao Ming Chris Bosh Zach Randolph Carlos Boozer You also have Amare Stoudemire trying to get back to a high level of basketball, and Andrew Bynum has surprised everyone with a few of his productive games. Another big man who's making strides is Andris Biedrins in Golden State. He's shooting a gawdy 77% from the field, has one game with 6 blocks, another game grabbing 12 boards. Then of course there's Mr. Consistency, Elton Brand. I know the league has been focused covering the guards in the league, but the big men are definitley on the rise again in the NBA.
<div class="quote_poster">Eclipse Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> It's funny how people keep saying that Howard will be better than all these players. They've said that this season, and last season. I haven't seen him improve much over his first 3 seasons. His numbers are getting better but not by much. </div> You must not be watching the Magic that much. The numbers don't show a huge improvement, but he has certainly become a much better player. His rookie year, he was basically just a dunker and would get all of his points from offensive rebounds or Steve Francis dishes on drives. Last year, he had maybe one move and was way more effective crashing the glass. This year he is actually getting most of his points from getting the ball on the block. He has developed a really nice spin move and has shown off a couple of sweet moves this season. You can say pretty much the same thing with his rebounding and defense. He actually has low post moves this year. He is averaging 9.28 shots a game so far this season, which is why his PPG hasn't really improved. He averaged over 10 shots a game last year. He also isn't getting to the line as much. This is more due to the fact that he is turning it over so much. One of the main reasons why is because he has been getting the ball outside of the paint and he tries putting it on the floor. He doesn't have a good enough offensive game for that. He needs to get better positioning closer to the paint, where he only has to make 1 or 2 dribbles at most. The biggest improvement from Dwight this season is his ability to pass. He has really been a good passer out of the double teams. He still makes bad passes, but he's making much better decisions with the ball. I agree with og15 about his defense. He really isn't that good of a man to man defender yet. Most of the time his man puts up a lot of points. Hence Harrington putting up over 30 2 nights ago and KG putting up 28 last night. He has really improved on his help defense and timing, which is why the increase in his blocks. His biggest problem is that he just isn't consistent. He seems to ALWAYS come to play against the great players. His 3 best games so far this season have been against Ben Wallace, Kevin Garnett, and Jermaine O'Neal.
<div class="quote_poster">shapecity Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">What I find interesting about this thread is the amoung of young talent the league has at the PF/C positon... Dwight Howard Yao Ming Chris Bosh Zach Randolph Carlos Boozer You also have Amare Stoudemire trying to get back to a high level of basketball, and Andrew Bynum has surprised everyone with a few of his productive games. Another big man who's making strides is Andris Biedrins in Golden State. He's shooting a gawdy 77% from the field, has one game with 6 blocks, another game grabbing 12 boards. Then of course there's Mr. Consistency, Elton Brand. I know the league has been focused covering the guards in the league, but the big men are definitley on the rise again in the NBA.</div> Let's not forget Emeka who's also having a monster year.
<div class="quote_poster">Eclipse Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Perhaps the reason is Howard doesn't have a reliable offensive game right now? Do you think it would be a good idea for the Magic to make Howard the focus of their offense?</div>I don't think he should be the focus, but he should certainly be getting more touches than what he is. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Better than Yao? Possible, but I doubt it. It's funny how people keep saying that Howard will be better than all these players. They've said that this season, and last season. I haven't seen him improve much over his first 3 seasons. His numbers are getting better but not by much.</div>Yao, to me, hasn't proven to be a dominant post defender yet. He's good, but not dominant. He gets dunked on by guards constantly and still hasn't been the shot blocker he should be at his height. Also, Howard has improved quite a bit. His offensive game is much better than what it was his first season and he can step out and hit the jumper occasionally. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Who said that he has no offensive game? Certainly, I didn't write anything like that. I also would not even compare him to Yao's offensive capabilities right now. It's not even CLOSE.</div>Well, you yourself just said he isn't reliable, which could be a round-about way of saying he doesn't have a very good one. And I wasn't even comparing him to Yao. He's never going to be the player Yao is on offense, simply cause he's a back to the basket player, Yao is more comfortable facing the basket and shooting mid range jumpers and hook shots. Their offensive games are complete opposites to say the least.
<div class="quote_poster">Moo2K4 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I don't think he should be the focus, but he should certainly be getting more touches than what he is. Yao, to me, hasn't proven to be a dominant post defender yet. He's good, but not dominant. He gets dunked on by guards constantly and still hasn't been the shot blocker he should be at his height. Also, Howard has improved quite a bit. His offensive game is much better than what it was his first season and he can step out and hit the jumper occasionally. Well, you yourself just said he isn't reliable, which could be a round-about way of saying he doesn't have a very good one. And I wasn't even comparing him to Yao. He's never going to be the player Yao is on offense, simply cause he's a back to the basket player, Yao is more comfortable facing the basket and shooting mid range jumpers and hook shots. Their offensive games are complete opposites to say the least.</div> Stop basing your reasons off of sportcenter highlights. He moved out of the way...he was already in foul trouble damn!
<div class="quote_poster">Moo2K4 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Yao, to me, hasn't proven to be a dominant post defender yet. He's good, but not dominant. He gets dunked on by guards constantly and still hasn't been the shot blocker he should be at his height. </div> Yao gets dunked on a lot because he is a target. Players have extra motivation to dunk on the tallest players and the best defensive players. It was like that way for Shawn Bradley (even though a lot people just hated that guy) and Mutombo. They probably view it as a challenge. <div class="quote_poster">Moo2K4 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Well, you yourself just said he isn't reliable, which could be a round-about way of saying he doesn't have a very good one. And I wasn't even comparing him to Yao. He's never going to be the player Yao is on offense, simply cause he's a back to the basket player, Yao is more comfortable facing the basket and shooting mid range jumpers and hook shots. Their offensive games are complete opposites to say the least.</div> Well he isn't reliable, right? By no means was I inferring that he has no offensive game. It's limited right now but it's still better than average. Right now it's mostly using his athletic/physical abilities to score much like how Amare did in his first couple of years.
<div class="quote_poster">igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Stop basing your reasons off of sportcenter highlights. He moved out of the way...he was already in foul trouble damn!</div>So every time a guard dunks on him, he's in foul trouble huh? Great argument.
I would prefer to call him inconsistent. The guy does well against Ben Wallace and KG but can't do anything against Jermaine O'Neal or anybody else for that matter. Sure, when he does something, he is unstoppable but he still is developing. The guy is still getting way too many TOs and is not a good shooter. You have to give him 2 more years to be an all-around player. The man is dominant but he needs more or of an all-around offense to do something.
<div class="quote_poster">Moo2K4 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">So every time a guard dunks on him, he's in foul trouble huh? Great argument.</div> Yao's 1on1 defense is pretty good, which usually doesn't show up in blocks. He has trouble, due to his size, moving his feet to cover someone else's man, which, if you can do well, shows up in blocks, and if not too well, shows up in ESPN's highlights. Sometimes that's put on the spot by his team's lack of good perimeter defense (andof course, battier was acquired to address that).
<div class="quote_poster">AirJordan Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I'd take Bosh over anyone in that list, maybe Ming, but he's injury prone.</div>What proof do you have that he's injury prone? Cause he had a freak accident last year? Prior to last year, I don't think he even missed a game. You can't call him injury prone simply cause he missed a nice chunk of last season when he didn't really miss anything prior to that.
<div class="quote_poster">Moo2K4 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> Yao, to me, hasn't proven to be a dominant post defender yet. He's good, but not dominant. He gets dunked on by guards constantly and still hasn't been the shot blocker he should be at his height.</div> How tall is he? 7'6'' right? One of the tallest centers ever to play. When he stands with his hands up he is probably around 8'6'' right. This is what I see Yao do everytime someone comes to dunk on him. He puts his hands up trying to draw the foul, but the guy is so huge and has some longs hands that he gets the fould called everytime. I wouldn't say Yao is an excellent post defender, but he isn't bad either. And please don't even talk about height now. How many centers do you see play as great as Yao Ming who are above 7'3''? Barely anyone right? Yao's main game is offense. His defense isn't bad, so I would say gettting 1.8 blocks a game is pretty good. Remember, he already has had a 7 blocks in a game already, and now dont say it was on Eddy Curry. I careless about that, a block is a block, not mattering who it was on. And I may have a bad memory, but tell me when was the last time Yao get dunked on by a guard? I remember when Michael Finley stuffed him last year, but thats last year. Also, I hate it when people like you only look at bad things Yao do. He gets dunked on, wow. Remember when Alonzo Mourning got dunked on by VC? Mourning is one of the best shot blockers in the game. Yao, I have to say, hasn't been really aggresive, but overall, he is playing really well. You just can't say someone is better than another just because a person got dunked on by a guard. I remember when Hakeem got dunked on by Kevin Johnson, Ewing by John Starks. I careless if Yao gets dunked on by a guard, but what really matters to me, is how much he does for his team. And also, Yao does not get dunked on by guards constantly. He may get dunked on here and there, but never constantly. Look at Gheorghe Muresan's(7'7'') stats. At most the guy averaged 14.5 ppg, 9.6 rebounds, and 2.26 bpg. Look at Manute Bol's(7'7'') stats. At the most he averaged 3 ppg, 4.3 rpg, and 3 blocks a game. Look at Yao's (7'6'') stats. The guy has been in the league for 5 years. I based Bol's and Muresan's stats over the whole career's listing their best average in each category. Now look at Yao's 22.3 ppg, 10.2 rpg, and 2 bpg. He is clearly better than anyone other center ever near his height. He may get dunked on, but that really doesnt matter. Every great center I am sure has been dunked on before. But that doesnt matter. When you said he isn' the shot blocker he should be at his height, I had to write the stats out. Gheorghe Muresan who is 7'7'', averaged .26 more blocks in a season than Yao. And that was his best average throughout his whole career. While Yao, in only 5 years in the league, has gotten 2 blocks a game already, you never know, but he may end up getting more than 2.26 blocks in his career. He is a good shot blocker for his height. Other centers who were his height averaged about the same number of blocks as Yao does.
D12! 24/21 today!! BEASTLY!!! How can we steal him for the Lakers like we did with shaq. I would take him over Yao anyday... Yao had a pretty sick game himself. 33/16 but I still like the upside of D12 more....
Dwight proved himself today, again. 22 points, 21 rebounds. This "kid" is a monster, NOT ! Okay-okay.;D (Borat inside jokes).
