<div class="quote_poster">Umair Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Like I said before, this Hayes and Howard argument needs to end. I dont care how or who helps the team more as long as both help enough for us to win games. Yao scored 23 points in fourth quarter and that shot with 11 seconds to seal the game. With Tmac out, we definetly needed Yao to step up and he did. Great win!</div> To be fair, durvasa at least attempts to be objective. If JHo plays a good game, he will say so. If some aspect of Hayes game went poorly he will say so as well. The only person attempting to bring the Hayes vs. Howard argument is Rock4life (who is far from being objective, his bias is very clear). He only does it when Howard is playing well and usually tries to put down Hayes in some way (Notice how this topic only surfaces when JHo plays well). I'm also a huge Hayes fan, and I will admit that Howard is playing pretty well thse past few days.
<div class="quote_poster">foo82 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">To be fair, durvasa at least attempts to be objective. If JHo plays a good game, he will say so. If some aspect of Hayes game went poorly he will say so as well. The only person attempting to bring the Hayes vs. Howard argument is Rock4life (who is far from being objective, his bias is very clear). He only does it when Howard is playing well and usually tries to put down Hayes in some way (Notice how this topic only surfaces when JHo plays well). I'm also a huge Hayes fan, and I will admit that Howard is playing pretty well thse past few days.</div> U guys are so whiny.....First off, to say I've NEVER acknowledged Hayes playin good is completley FALSE. I've ALREADY given the man credit for playin good earlier. Here's one of my quotes earlier in the season: <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life:</div><div class="quote_post">I can respect ur opinion, but I disagree. Short term, Hayes is playing good. I'm sure some of u are gonna make excuses, but it's bound to happen. Howard can do everything Hayes is doing and he can hit a jumper and make free throws.</div> ^^^^ The Proof is in the pooding However I find it humorous earlier in the season when Hayes was playin somewhat good, how u some of you didn't mind boasting and throwin it Rock4life's face lol. Here are some quotes I dug up: <div class="quote_poster">Quoting TmacGarnett Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Well I think Juwan's 0% FG% last night pretty much proved that he isn't better than Chuck Hayes.</div> <div class="quote_poster">igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">More like, seems lazy, but really just sucks at defense and offense. He use to be an okay/above average player, but ever since he came to the Rockets his game went down. He needs to get his FG% up and bang around more down low.</div> <div class="quote_poster">igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I wouldn't wait. I recognized that Hayes was the better PF last season when he was on the floor. JVG has noticed that, probably convinced by Morey, so this season and he is giving the bulk of the PF minutes to Hayes. So far, Hayes has produced. But don't admit that you were wrong or anything. I don't want you to jinx Hayes or somethin. </div> <div class="quote_poster">foo82 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I actually reached this conclusion by page 2. Several times I had the urge to say his name fit his profile in that hes as stubborn and as stupid as a rock.</div> Talkin about me^^^^ <div class="quote_poster">TmacGarnett Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I'd like to note. Every game Juwan has started. We either lost or almost lost.</div> <div class="quote_poster">squall15 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">First of all, sorry to jump in. But I've been keeping up with this discussion and decided to jump in... Neway, Rock4life, in my opinion, you have a twisted logic. One day you would say one thing, one day you would say another.</div> <div class="quote_poster">Durvasa:</div><div class="quote_post">Pretty soon, Rock4Life is going to be changing his tune. It's JVG's fault Juwan's numbers aren't very good. He isn't using him properly!</div> <div class="quote_poster">Quoting igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Sorry Rock4Life, I don't mean to gang up on you or whatever, but Juwan Howard is mediocre at best. He does get downplayed a lot around here, but that doesn't change the fact that he is a below average PF. I don't know how you can feel so strong that he deserves the backup PF spot when Battier starts.</div> My point......So what's the difference when I speak up for my position? Oh I get it, NOW u guys are tired of hearing about this debate. As soon as Howard starts playin good, you guys all of sudden have nothin to say Could it be because you were WRONG? Or could it be that you refuse to acknowledge I was somewhat RIGHT about Howard bein valuable to this team? Some of you said the guy was washed up. Do u still believe that? Overall, I hope we keep playing well. Both Howard and Hayes are playin good, but I stick to my opinion that Hayes isn't close to the player Howard is. Thank you
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Some of you said the guy was washed up. Do u still believe that? </div> Who said Juwan was washed up? You said that Chuck barely belonged in the league, and you even endorsed cutting him from the team in the preseason. Do you still believe that?
Wow. While I don't care about who is better, I think many of you are<u> underestimating</u> Juwan. This was the face of a franchise in the Washington Bullets and ever since he got here, he's done his share at PF. Every now and then he can also do some scoring for us and has been rebounding the ball well lately. Even Bill Worell And Matt Bullard commended Juwan Howard for doing his part in the team. You guys are treating Juwan like he's untalented scrub who we got from training camp or something. Too much, man.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Who said Juwan was washed up?</div> Howard is washed up.
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">U guys are so whiny.....First off, to say I've NEVER acknowledged Hayes playin good is completley FALSE. I've ALREADY given the man credit for playin good earlier...</div> Well, just like Durvasa said, earlier this season you said Chuck Hayes should be cut. Do you still believe that? Here are quotes: <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">...Hayes should be cut</div> Next point, <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> My point......So what's the difference when I speak up for my position? Oh I get it, NOW u guys are tired of hearing about this debate. As soon as Howard starts playin good, you guys all of sudden have nothin to say ...</div> Wow, I never thought you actually said this. I never really post anything, but I come here at least 3 times a day and check forum. When Juwan played bad for 2-3 (or more.. I don't remember), you didn't post a single thing in "Juwan and Hayes argument thread". For you to even say this, maybe you should think before you actually make a post. I never really want to get in the argument myself. Even though I did say Hayes will do better. Proof? Sure..., <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Howard has been playin good basketball. Last game i believe he had 8pts & 13rebs. He's been rebounding and defending in limited mins. He's obviously not happy, but he's bein professional about it. Givin consistent mins, he's gonna get it back.</div> Above is November 18 post. After that, you didn't post until : <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Howard has been playin good basketball. Last game i believe he had 8pts & 13rebs. He's been rebounding and defending in limited mins. He's obviously not happy, but he's bein professional about it. Givin consistent mins, he's gonna get it back.</div> December 4. I believe Juwan played bad in some of those games (between 1-3 games IF I'm not mistaken. The reason I use "IF" (caps) because I don't want you to jump back on me and say "NO, HE ONLY PLAY BAD 1 GAME". ). But neway, I believe you have something busy to do. So, I'm not gonna ask anything about it and you don't even have to answer any of these comments. Cuz, I don't want one anyway. <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> First of all, sorry to jump in. But I've been keeping up with this discussion and decided to jump in... Neway, Rock4life, in my opinion, you have a twisted logic. One day you would say one thing, one day you would say another. These are two statements I quoted.... - "We can go back and forth with comments from other ppl, I'm going off what I believe not some smuck or stat nerd..." - "huh? Sorry to say it again, but I'm just not interested in this. I analyze the Rockets the way I wanna do it, by watching them every nite..." I thought you don't go off with comments from other people? How come.... - "...Don't believe me, ask the Rockets announcers who praise Howard's play as soon as he steps on the court. They also called him a good rebounder and defender, something that you refuse to acknowledge..." (Your quote again) Anyway, "Did you listen to Jonathan Feigen (Rockets beat writer) on 610am yesterday? He was talking about how opposing NBA scouts were just raving about Chuck Hayes. One of them told him that they consider Chuck to be one of the top defensive PFs in the league..." I believe you also refuse to acknowledge what Chuck Hayes can do for us... Chuck Hayes ftw...</div> That's what I said. For you to even quote my statement shows that you don't even read them and plus, that post by me is not even relevant to current post. "I have to repeat myself with you, because ur listening skills are that of a 1st grader". Well, I have to use your quote here. So, next time read them all, are we cool? The reason I even say that because you... <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">We can go back and forth with comments from other ppl, I'm going off what I believe not some smuck or stat nerd. Juwan Howard still has some game left, I could careless what this guy has to say.</div> Then, <div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">... Don't believe me, ask the Rockets announcers who praise Howard's play as soon as he steps on the court. They also called him a good rebounder and defender, something that you refuse to acknowledge.</div> Previous sentences are not important to this matter. Now, read 1st statement and then 2nd statement. 1st statement basically implied that you don't care what others (you said you're going off with what you believe and not some smuck or stat nerd) said. 2nd statement for you to even use that statement, you're just... I don't have a word for it I guess... Now, I make this post about 20-30 (to confirm post and stuff, and I don't know how to use "quote"), so please read them carefully. Read them for at least 3 minutes (just kidding). So anyway, I don't want to get into further discussions in this. I can't find the quote but there is a post where you basically said you don't care about stats. The moment you said that statement, I'm just basically speechless. So, I'm not going to drag myself further into this conversation cuz it's pointless. But don't get me wrong, I still stick for Chuck Hayes. If Howard comes out to do better than Hayes, then so be it. What can I say? Should I tell Hayes to do better? I can't do that. Even if Hayes does better than Howard, I can't say anything except one thing. I believe you predict more right than wrong (you post it somewhere). So, you can add this to your record if you wrong. I think for you guys who still debating on Howard/Hayes cases, should just wait until season is over. You don't have to reply this rock4life, unless you READ THEM WELL. Just kidding. But I'm not going to discuss any further regarding Howard/Hayes. Peace out.
<div class="quote_poster">igotask8board Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Howard is washed up.</div> There u go right here Durvasa^^^^^
<div class="quote_poster">Rock4life Wrote</div><div class="quote_post"> There u go right here Durvasa^^^^^</div> Too much sarcasm on page 3.
