Losing Givens & McGinest was tough, but I was ok with that. But losing Vinatieri on top of that makes me begin to question the very same people who have brought us a dynasty. In the big picture losing a kicker wouldn't seem like the end of the world, but Adam isn't just any kicker. Vanderjerk may have a better FG %, but kicking inside that dome is a big difference from kicking in Foxboro. There is no1 more clutch than #4 & I'm scratching my head trying to figure out what the mgt's offseason plan actually is. I applaud their refusal to overpay players, but you also have to show a willingness to make the team better. Perhaps letting go of veterans who have already had the taste of a SB is a wise move. Maybe their feeling is we need new guys who's primary motivation is winning a title. That's a sound plan, but Adam is not a guy I would classify as $ hungry. Or so I thought. Maybe I was wrong about him. Maybe his current motivation is securing his place in the hall of fame & where else but Indy can he gobble up points faster. All I do know is that I'm very concerned about the direction the Pats are taking right now. They have $ to spend & thus far have kept their hands in their pockets.
you know they pulled off a dantasy with the exact same strategy so i wouldnt question them if i were u, they are still contenders in my eye. As long as Brady is there. I see why ur doubting them though i think i would too but i wouldnt be too disgruntled
Yeah but when guys like Brady, who stay for less $ are seeing core players leave don't they have to question themselves. I mean if the organization isn't willing to show loyalty to them why should the player show any back? I think there is something to be said for maintaining your core group of players together. Perhaps they are just another example of a victim of their own success.
Honestly, I'm thinking '06 won't be all that great of a year. I'm thinking 8-8, 9-7, or possibly 10-6. However, '07 and '08 will be a different story, IMO. I think we're going to get quite a few young guys in there under Belichick's wing and they will shine like crazy in a year or two. I don't like to think negatively, but we're just moving/losing/changing/signing (eventually) too many players to be SB contenders in '06.
I won't rule out the Pats until Belichick and Brady are no longer there. New England losing McGinest, Vinatieri, & Givens makes the division up for grabs even more. The AFCE is still a 2 team race for now. It might change w/ how the jets draft. Buffalo is still SOL IMO.
I don't blame the Pats fans for being sick over losing Vinatieri. I've been an NFL fan for 30 plus years and I believe Vinatieri might be the best kicker that I have ever seen. Bakes is dead on the money about Vinatieri's ability to kick in obscene weather. However, I would be cautious about calling Vinatieri money hungry. I don't see anything wrong with a kicker of his caliber wanting a decent payday. Usually, everyone in this forum piles on a player for going to a team, with no chance of winning, because that proves their greed. coughMushinMuhammedcough I wonder how many folks, in the forum, can muster enough objectivity to give Adam Vinatieri some credit. By picking the Colts over the Packers, Adam has given himself a much better chance of playing deep into January next year.
Well reportedly the Pats offered him enuff $ to make him the highest paid K. But that wasn't enuff to keep him so what other conclusion are we to come to? I would also offer up the fact that Indy plays in a dome as another deciding factor in his decision.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bakes781)</div><div class='quotemain'>Well reportedly the Pats offered him enuff $ to make him the highest paid K. But that wasn't enuff to keep him so what other conclusion are we to come to? I would also offer up the fact that Indy plays in a dome as another deciding factor in his decision.</div> I don't know about you, but I might conclude that Vinatieri might think the Colts have a shot at the Super Bowl next year and the Patriots are done.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DolfanDale)</div><div class='quotemain'>I don't blame the Pats fans for being sick over losing Vinatieri. I've been an NFL fan for 30 plus years and I believe Vinatieri might be the best kicker that I have ever seen. Bakes is dead on the money about Vinatieri's ability to kick in obscene weather. However, I would be cautious about calling Vinatieri money hungry. I don't see anything wrong with a kicker of his caliber wanting a decent payday. Usually, everyone in this forum piles on a player for going to a team, with no chance of winning, because that proves their greed. coughMushinMuhammedcough I wonder how many folks, in the forum, can muster enough objectivity to give Adam Vinatieri some credit. By picking the Colts over the Packers, Adam has given himself a much better chance of playing deep into January next year.</div> Mushin had no chance to win in chicago?? Hmmm, i could of swore they had a 1st rd bye. Fact is, everyteam has a chance to win, so unless the bears want you, go take the money
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (BearsFan1)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DolfanDale)</div><div class='quotemain'>I don't blame the Pats fans for being sick over losing Vinatieri. I've been an NFL fan for 30 plus years and I believe Vinatieri might be the best kicker that I have ever seen. Bakes is dead on the money about Vinatieri's ability to kick in obscene weather. However, I would be cautious about calling Vinatieri money hungry. I don't see anything wrong with a kicker of his caliber wanting a decent payday. Usually, everyone in this forum piles on a player for going to a team, with no chance of winning, because that proves their greed. coughMushinMuhammedcough I wonder how many folks, in the forum, can muster enough objectivity to give Adam Vinatieri some credit. By picking the Colts over the Packers, Adam has given himself a much better chance of playing deep into January next year.</div> Mushin had no chance to win in chicago?? Hmmm, i could of swore they had a 1st rd bye. Fact is, everyteam has a chance to win, so unless the bears want you, go take the money </div> I should make it clear that I never said Mushin Muhammed never a chance to win in Chicago. That's what was thrown in my face when I was defending him.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DolfanDale)</div><div class='quotemain'>I don't know about you, but I might conclude that Vinatieri might think the Colts have a shot at the Super Bowl next year and the Patriots are done.</div> Well they just lost their stud RB so I'd beg to differ on that view. Colts offered him more $ that's all it came down to. Good luck to him. I've expressed my dissatisfaction with the Pats, but I still have faith they will make some moves to better the team. They've been consistent about how they spend it's just a shame to see the core players of the past leave.
At some point, every player needs to make his one time huge pay day....this was his chance to get the huge money, and no other kicker, ever had such a chance....the other deciding factor in my opinion is the offense in Indy....with that offense and that dome, he has a chance to score tons of points and eventually become the NFLs all-time leading scorer....if you put his clutch accomplishments up for hall of fame voting in 10 years, he may or may not get in....but if you add in being the NFLs all-time leading scorer, he does improve his chances....
there is some talk about number 4 and his back problems. i don't think the pats wanted to guarantee him money. In Bill I trust that's all I know. I said what are they going to do with the loss of bledsoe, milloy, law and a few others that i didn't think the team could replace. Bill has an eye and the best football mind currently coaching in the NFL. I hate too see number 4 go but I am sure Bill knows what he is doing, even if everyone is the area has questions about it. I can't wait for the season to begin and see what happens.
Well in the case of those other players you mentioned we had an adequate replacement in place. There is no1 who can replace the loss of Vinatieri IMO.
My take on the whole thing is that 1) players age and get tired and 2) there are new, younger players coming into the NFL every year that are going to be as good, if not better than the current NFL veterans. I'm not saying that losing these guys didn't hurt, but the Patriots organization also needs to look into the future of these guys. As I've learned in the stock market unfortunately, past performance does not guarantee future success. For all we know, that kick in the Denver game and the fact that he is aging may have started the creation of another Vanderjagt out of Adam. What I love about the NFL is that nobody knows and we'll just have to see in '06. I know we won't suck this year but I'm not going to get my hopes up for a super bowl. The NFL isn't designed to cater to long term dynasties so we can't realistically expect to keep it going.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (DolfanDale)</div><div class='quotemain'>I don't blame the Pats fans for being sick over losing Vinatieri. I've been an NFL fan for 30 plus years and I believe Vinatieri might be the best kicker that I have ever seen. Bakes is dead on the money about Vinatieri's ability to kick in obscene weather. However, I would be cautious about calling Vinatieri money hungry. I don't see anything wrong with a kicker of his caliber wanting a decent payday. Usually, everyone in this forum piles on a player for going to a team, with no chance of winning, because that proves their greed. coughMushinMuhammedcough I wonder how many folks, in the forum, can muster enough objectivity to give Adam Vinatieri some credit. By picking the Colts over the Packers, Adam has given himself a much better chance of playing deep into January next year.</div> LMAO.. mushin muhammad huh... well i think chicago is a legitamite threat to make the SB in 06, with that D, and now a good Offense.. I don't blame players for wanting a payday when proven time and time agian like Adam has.. The ones who make me sick are players like TO who thinks that he is so much more then everyone else.. and deserves the money.. If i were an nfl star and i produced and produced i would want whats best for me.. think about it would u turn down a pay raise at your job? not a shot in hell would u pass it up.. and i kind of get tired of people frowning at players wanting more money well this is their job and i can't blame them for wanting a pay raise
I think it's safe to say there's a significant difference in the amount of $ we make in comparison to a professional athlete. If we don't try to make as much $ as we can the result could be we eventually become homeless. If player X doesn't take the highest offer then he only has 4 luxury cars instead of 6.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (bakes781)</div><div class='quotemain'>I think it's safe to say there's a significant difference in the amount of $ we make in comparison to a professional athlete. If we don't try to make as much $ as we can the result could be we eventually become homeless. If player X doesn't take the highest offer then he only has 4 luxury cars instead of 6.</div> Yes there is a huge difference in what we make compared to them but at the same time.. if u were adam and lets face it he is getting older.. and kickers don't exactly make what a wr does or a QB i really don't blame him for wanting the money.. yes his base salary is alot more then i will ever make but at the same time.. if i were him i would go for the money too.. he already has the rings... why not go for the money?
