What is your best WHAT IF team on the Warriors? It's got to be current players.

Just because Saint was a GM and PJ was a headcoach, that doesn't mean Saint had more power than PJ (see Lakers and Jackson and various powerful headcoahches and no-name GMs). Saint was hired as a helper of PJ, and Cohan came out and said that PJ had ultimate power. Saint didn't have a power to overrule PJ nor fire him. The only person who could do was Cohan himself. That's why ultimate fame/blame goes to PJ, not Saint.

Dampier got 8 mils per year, Foyle got 4 mils per year, Caffey got 5 mils per year, Fortson got 6 mils per year, and Jamison got max. I really didn't think Dampier/Foyle combo was bad. Our center position was always considered above average, and if you can spend 12 mils to do so, I won't have any problem with it. Caffey and Fortson signings were bad. Without a question. Jamison signing was necessary. Because, back then Warriors was considered as a revolving door, and we desperately needed to show that we will actually keep players.

The main difference between Saint and Mullin's signings are that Saint signed players when we absolutely needed to, when Mullin signed players when we don't have to resign. Also, Saint always chose raw players with upside, when Mullin chose limited upside but 1st class citizen...

 

<div class="quote_poster">Clif25 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">95-98 were HORRIBLE. 2002 was pretty bad as well in terms of drafts. Wait, even the Jason Terry for Mookie Blaylock draft was kind of iffy. What year was that 1999 or 2000?</div>

Well, we did end up Murphy out of that pick, so it's not a complete disaster. Of course, the way Murphy is playing, it can be considered as one now, but...

 

Kwan saved the day for me. Now I don't have to explain that much to Clif why I didn't think Mullin was better than Saint for free agent signings. Thanks Kwan. I didn't think Saint would be in a rush to re-sign Dunleavy that quickly and he would have chosen a better FA center if there was one. In fact, getting a strong center or centers is the first start in making sure we have any chance of protecting the paint. Right now we don't protect the paint because very many people on our team aren't strong or big enough to clog that lane. That's why Darko and Dwight Howard can just get in there so easily. (apparently there's no way to make paragraphs here. it keeps making everything into one block) It's similar to pick up ball when they get all the big tall guys on one team and the small, lightweight guys on the other. The little guys can't do anything but pick at the ball or try to jump better than the bigger guys can. The little guys can win if they start running, but if that defense gets set, little guys settle for outside shots because they can't post up or find it easy to finish over the taller, bigger guys. I'm just naming one example so maybe people can relate to it.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Kwan1031 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Just because Saint was a GM and PJ was a headcoach, that doesn't mean Saint had more power than PJ (see Lakers and Jackson and various powerful headcoahches and no-name GMs). Saint was hired as a helper of PJ, and Cohan came out and said that PJ had ultimate power. Saint didn't have a power to overrule PJ nor fire him. The only person who could do was Cohan himself. That's why ultimate fame/blame goes to PJ, not Saint.

Dampier got 8 mils per year, Foyle got 4 mils per year, Caffey got 5 mils per year, Fortson got 6 mils per year, and Jamison got max. I really didn't think Dampier/Foyle combo was bad. Our center position was always considered above average, and if you can spend 12 mils to do so, I won't have any problem with it. Caffey and Fortson signings were bad. Without a question. Jamison signing was necessary. Because, back then Warriors was considered as a revolving door, and we desperately needed to show that we will actually keep players.

The main difference between Saint and Mullin's signings are that Saint signed players when we absolutely needed to, when Mullin signed players when we don't have to resign. Also, Saint always chose raw players with upside, when Mullin chose limited upside but 1st class citizen...</div>

Well, if you add it all up. (8+4+5+6) x $1 million + a max contract = a large portion of the salary cap. I believe a max contract like Jamison's contract might had been about $10-12 million. So that is 33-35 million dollars out of Fortson, Dampier, Caffey(which became Sura), Jamison, and Foyle. You weren't going to win with that group of players being the main guys. The other players included players like Starks, Mills, Terry Cummings, Mookie Blaylock, and Felton Spencer. Basically the formula used under or at least when St. Jean was GM was a formula for mediocrity. The team had no cap room to sign free agents, besides one time when they spent it on Fortson, and there was no future besides Jamison, when he finally came along. Then of course the other players like Starks, Cummings, Blaylock, and Spencer had left and were replaced by players from the 2002 draft things changed. However since there was so much money used on players like Fortson, Dampier, Sura, Mills, Jamison, and Foyle the team just didn't have the space to keep the part of the team that could have grown into something good and above the mediocrity.

I can't agree fully with the "Jamison signing was necessary" statement. I agree that Jamison needed to be kept. However I always think that market value is the best way to go when signing a player. Now if Jamison's market value truely was that high, then I won't be too hard on the contract Jamison received. But otherwise, with what I know, which may be less than you Kwan, the Warriors seemed to resign Jamison to the contract as a publicity stunt to show that they are willing to spend the money, rather than trying to be smart with their money and the salary cap limits of the team's future. I think even Danny Fortson's contract may have been a type of publicity stunt because I remember a lot of talk about how Cohan can't be that bad because he's at least spending the money to "improve". Going back to Jamison, he has the same contract as Vince Carter and I can't believe so much to think that Vince Carter and Antawn Jamison had the same or even similar market value at the time of their extensions. Now if Jamison did have similar market value as Pierce, Carter, or Dirk at this time, then I accept that contract, but otherwise I don't see it being "necessary" to sign him the way the Warriors did. Actually Dirk, Pierce, Vince, and Jamison have the same contract.

Basically with St. Jean there were a lot of conditional questions which may be tough to answer, such as who had the final say and ultimate control during certain periods: Was it PJ or was it St. Jean? Of course St. Jean wasn't given the best roster either, I mean look at the previous drafts before that were complete (hall of fame/shame) busts. The main formula for St. Jean however was constant mediocrity. There was never a constant plan for the future. The team always strove to not be the worst but also failed to be good, known for this period as mediocrity. Finally after the heavy spending on mediocrity it came back and bit the franchise in the butt with the Arenas situation. This heavy spending on mediocrity, in particular with Dunleavy and Foyle is what gives many fans and followers fear for the near future with the rise of Ellis and Biedrins; and really I can't blame those pessimists or realists even too much for these thoughts.