Steve Francis has reportedly been negociating a buyout with the knicks what do you guys think about picking him up?
True but what other teams do? Plus in the article it also says he is "rehabbing" his knee in houston.
<div class="quote_poster">tinyballer Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">True but what other teams do? Plus in the article it also says he is "rehabbing" his knee in houston.</div> He's working with John Lucas in Houston. If Francis is really intent on coming back, he could just sign with us for the rest of the season for the minimum, and then the Rockets could sign him to a long-term deal in the offseason. To do that though, someone would have to be waived, maybe a buyout with Sura? Also, Francis will get enough money from the buyout to hopefully not worry about how big his new contract would be.
Yeah, I don't have too many problems with Francis coming back. He wasn't playing too bad with the Knicks this season considering he was playing with Richardson, Marbury, Crawford, and Robinson. Although he turned the ball over a bit too much for my taste, Francis still brings enough assists and points to balance it out. Most importantly however, he'll give us a lot of depth at the point guard position and overall, boost our second unit. I'm thinking a bench of something like this- Steve Francis, Luther Head, Juwan Howard, Dikembe Mutombo. Hayes was playing brilliantly with the stars and giving us very good numbers so I think it'll probably be in the best interest of the team if Howard gets benched. On the bench, Howard can still get decent minutes and with Francis drawing some double teams, should be able to get him some good looks with his mid range jumper.
<div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Yeah, I don't have too many problems with Francis coming back. He wasn't playing too bad with the Knicks this season considering he was playing with Richardson, Marbury, Crawford, and Robinson. Although he turned the ball over a bit too much for my taste, Francis still brings enough assists and points to balance it out. Most importantly however, he'll give us a lot of depth at the point guard position and overall, boost our second unit. I'm thinking a bench of something like this-</div> Are u serious? Francis has to be the worst decision maker in Rocket history. Skip can be eratic, but Francis makes him look like John Stockton. Our team right now is very smart, why mess that up? <div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Steve Francis, Luther Head, Juwan Howard, Dikembe Mutombo. Hayes was playing brilliantly with the stars and giving us very good numbers so I think it'll probably be in the best interest of the team if Howard gets benched. On the bench, Howard can still get decent minutes and with Francis drawing some double teams, should be able to get him some good looks with his mid range jumper.</div> I obviously disagree. When the season gets deeper, teams are gonna crack down on ur weaknesses. So being that Hayes is a offense liability and struggles against taller longer players, it's only right he be used for specific situations like rebounding. I'd rather see Bonzi/Howard/Battier split the minutes at PF and give us a more all around arenal at PF. Even Snyder can slide over and give us some quickness. Francis doesn't really fit on this team being that he's not a true point guard and too small for shooting guard. With Luther Head shooting lights out, I'd suggest we stand pat.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Are u serious? Francis has to be the worst decision maker in Rocket history. Skip can be eratic, but Francis makes him look like John Stockton. Our team right now is very smart, why mess that up?</div> Fo' shizzle. Because it would certainly benefit us to have a good offensive sparkplug coming off the bench. Head's pretty inconsistent while Wells has yet to emerge as the offensive difference maker everyone thought he would turn out to be. Besides, he won't be the number one or number two offensive option on the team, so its not like he's going to be allowed to constantly jack up shots like he did while Rudy T was here as coach. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> I obviously disagree. When the season gets deeper, teams are gonna crack down on ur weaknesses. So being that Hayes is a offense liability and struggles against taller longer players, it's only right he be used for specific situations like rebounding. I'd rather see Bonzi/Howard/Battier split the minutes at PF and give us a more all around arenal at PF. Even Snyder can slide over and give us some quickness. Francis doesn't really fit on this team being that he's not a true point guard and too small for shooting guard. With Luther Head shooting lights out, I'd suggest we stand pat.</div> Wells, Snyder, and Battier aren't going to cut it at powerforward in most situations (especially against bigger guys like Randolph, Boozer, Duncan, or Nowitzki). Why not bench Howard and let him play as a boosted offensive coming off the bench? While McGrady or Yao is resting, Howard can do his thing and score points for us to help weather the storm. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to insert all our offensive players in the starting lineup while the bench stays weak. If we have Howard in the starting lineup with Yao and McGrady, he's really not going to get the ball enough to play efficiently for us (considering his best attributes is scoring/shooting). Meanwhile, coming off the bench with one of the stars out, at least he will get a decent amount of touches.
<div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Fo' shizzle. Because it would certainly benefit us to have a good offensive sparkplug coming off the bench. Head's pretty inconsistent while Wells has yet to emerge as the offensive difference maker everyone thought he would turn out to be. Besides, he won't be the number one or number two offensive option on the team, so its not like he's going to be allowed to constantly jack up shots like he did while Rudy T was here as coach.</div> Head inconsistent? He's shooting 45% from the 3ptline, and leading the league in 3pt's in the 4th quarter. He one of the best clutch shooters in the league. Francis is the definition of inconsistent. What more of a "spark plug" could he be than Luther Head already is? <div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Wells, Snyder, and Battier aren't going to cut it at powerforward in most situations (especially against bigger guys like Randolph, Boozer, Duncan, or Nowitzki). Why not bench Howard and let him play as a boosted offensive coming off the bench? While McGrady or Yao is resting, Howard can do his thing and score points for us to help weather the storm. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to insert all our offensive players in the starting lineup while the bench stays weak. If we have Howard in the starting lineup with Yao and McGrady, he's really not going to get the ball enough to play efficiently for us (considering his best attributes is scoring/shooting). Meanwhile, coming off the bench with one of the stars out, at least he will get a decent amount of touches.</div> I think Howard/Battier/Bonzi can do a better job at PF than Hayes can if he got the bulk of the minutes. Howard won't get as many touches on most nights as a starter with Yao back, but he'll make life alot easier for Yao being that his man can't double off him as often. The spacing on the floor will be alot better with Howard's range. Yao will have alot more space to work with. Howard's also proven he can hit the boards and defend when he needs too. Overrall, I don't see why Howard can't start. Bonzi/Head/Snyer can give us the spark of the bench that we need. Battier will slide over to PF when Howard goes out and we'll still be effective. You made a good point about us guarding the Dirks, Duncans, Boozer's etc..But if anybody I think Hayes will struggle with them more than anybody. Being that he's only 6'6.
They wont double Yao anyway because Tracy's on the floor so your point is mute. Why would they double Yao to leave Tracy open?
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Head inconsistent? He's shooting 45% from the 3ptline, and leading the league in 3pt's in the 4th quarter. He one of the best clutch shooters in the league. Francis is the definition of inconsistent. What more of a "spark plug" could he be than Luther Head already is?</div> None of your points really back up your point that Head's consistent. 45% from the three point line doesn't really show if he's consistent or not, since its an average. Neither is leading the league in three pointers in the fourth quarter, since some nights he can make like eight while other nights he'll make one. I, on the other hand, bring up points that actually matter. Take the last five games of Head for an example- December 31 (Memphis) - 18 points, 6-8 from the field, 5-6 from three January 3 (Seattle) - 9 points, 3-8 from the field, 1-4 from three January 5 (Utah) - 7 points, 3-6 from the field, 1-4 from three January 7 (Minnesota) - 7 points, 3-10 from the field, 1-8 from three January 8 (Chicago) - 10 points, 3-8 from the field, 2-6 from three Personally I liken him to an Eddie House who has better handles. Some nights Head can get ridiculously hot and make a barrage of threes while other nights he'll stay cold and give us only a couple points a game. While Head is a good sixth man, Francis in my opinion, with his ball handling abilities, can draw up more coverage from the other team when he drives to the rack (something Head can't do). So while Head can stop teams from double teaming the stars, Francis can actually draw some more coverage and can get more guys open. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I think Howard/Battier/Bonzi can do a better job at PF than Hayes can if he got the bulk of the minutes. Howard won't get as many touches on most nights as a starter with Yao back, but he'll make life alot easier for Yao being that his man can't double off him as often. The spacing on the floor will be alot better with Howard's range. Yao will have alot more space to work with. Howard's also proven he can hit the boards and defend when he needs too. Overrall, I don't see why Howard can't start. Bonzi/Head/Snyer can give us the spark of the bench that we need. Battier will slide over to PF when Howard goes out and we'll still be effective. You made a good point about us guarding the Dirks, Duncans, Boozer's etc..But if anybody I think Hayes will struggle with them more than anybody. Being that he's only 6'6.</div> Battier, Bonzi, and Snyder aren't as muscular as Hayes and are natural guard forwards. They aren't really out there to box out, while with Hayes, the term "box out" has been instilled in him since college. Its not like I'm advocating for Hayes to get the majority of the minutes, rather, I'm suggesting splitting the minutes between Howard and Hayes. Battier should only be used at powerforward when the opportunity presents itself. With Hayes, Yao can drift out more towards mid range, where he can take shots (he's good at those anyhow) while Hayes can grab the offensive rebounds in case he misses (which he's good at too). With Howard however, if you leave him out there, most likely we won't be getting as many second chances since Yao doesn't have the ability Hayes does at grabbing offensive rebounds. If Howard really can rebound and defend consistently, why doesn't he do that every night instead of just "when we need him to". Because honestly, I think we "need him to" every night. Its not that Howard can't start, its that the team would be better off with Howard being benched. Most likely, he'll probably be getting the same amount of minutes as when he's starting, so I don't see the difference. The reason why Hayes defends better against the elite powerforwards compared to Battier or Wells is that he's stockier, more muscular, and a natural powerforward. He can bang around inside with the big guys for the rebounds while Battier and Wells aren't really inclined or taught to do so.
<div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">None of your points really back up your point that Head's consistent. 45% from the three point line doesn't really show if he's consistent or not, since its an average. Neither is leading the league in three pointers in the fourth quarter, since some nights he can make like eight while other nights he'll make one </div> I'm confused? If the guy is one of the best 3pt shooters in the league (and he's making them in the 4th quarter when it counts) then he's consistently coming thru when it counts most. Depending on the defense, he might not get the looks night in and night out. His job is to shoot, and he's doing that VERY efficiently. Explain to me how Steve Francis is gonna be more consistent? <div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">December 31 (Memphis) - 18 points, 6-8 from the field, 5-6 from three January 3 (Seattle) - 9 points, 3-8 from the field, 1-4 from three January 5 (Utah) - 7 points, 3-6 from the field, 1-4 from three January 7 (Minnesota) - 7 points, 3-10 from the field, 1-8 from three January 8 (Chicago) - 10 points, 3-8 from the field, 2-6 from three</div> Personally I liken him to an Eddie House who has better handles. Some nights Head can get ridiculously hot and make a barrage of threes while other nights he'll stay cold and give us only a couple points a game. While Head is a good sixth man, Francis in my opinion, with his ball handling abilities, can draw up more coverage from the other team when he drives to the rack (something Head can't do). So while Head can stop teams from double teaming the stars, Francis can actually draw some more coverage and can get more guys open.[/QUOTE] I'm still confused? Who cares about Eddie House, Luther Head is a BETTER shooter than House is. The fact is, he's one of BEST 3PT SHOOTERS IN THE LEAGUE. That means he's one of the most CONSISTENT at making his shots (45%) Francis's ball handling skillz? Are you serious Francis was an atrocious ball handler while he was here, and he STILL is with the Knicks. I still get flashbacks of all the STUPID passes he threw on fastbreaks <div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Battier, Bonzi, and Snyder aren't as muscular as Hayes and are natural guard forwards. They aren't really out there to box out, while with Hayes, the term "box out" has been instilled in him since college. Its not like I'm advocating for Hayes to get the majority of the minutes, rather, I'm suggesting splitting the minutes between Howard and Hayes. Battier should only be used at powerforward when the opportunity presents itself. With Hayes, Yao can drift out more towards mid range, where he can take shots (he's good at those anyhow) while Hayes can grab the offensive rebounds in case he misses (which he's good at too). With Howard however, if you leave him out there, most likely we won't be getting as many second chances since Yao doesn't have the ability Hayes does at grabbing offensive rebounds. If Howard really can rebound and defend consistently, why doesn't he do that every night instead of just "when we need him to". Because honestly, I think we "need him to" every night.</div> I disagree......I don't think Hayes will anymore effective against longer players than Bonzi/Battier/or Howard. Battier is the best defender on the team, so if need be we'll stick him on the Duncan's, Dirks, or Boozer's. The problem with Hayes is his man will be left to drift, smothering Yao like a bed sheet. The ONLY way Hayes is gonna make his shots is if it's uncontested. Being that San Antonio, Dallas, and Detroit are all defensivley great that's highly unlikely. So what we're doing with Hayes starting is taking a gamble. Early it might be effective, but later it's gonna be costly. Especially if teams go to "Hack-a-Hayes" mode. Starting Juwan is the safest thing to do. If we're getting killed on the boards, then Hayes will be ready to come off the bench. His niche is rebounding, but that's not enuff to make him a starter in this league (my personal opinion). Howard has been rebounding rather consistently lately. His defense is also underrated by you guys. <div class="quote_poster">AznxBaller Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Its not that Howard can't start, its that the team would be better off with Howard being benched. Most likely, he'll probably be getting the same amount of minutes as when he's starting, so I don't see the difference. The reason why Hayes defends better against the elite powerforwards compared to Battier or Wells is that he's stockier, more muscular, and a natural powerforward. He can bang around inside with the big guys for the rebounds while Battier and Wells aren't really inclined or taught to do so.</div> Hayes is very stocky. But he's too short and doesn't really have enuff length or atheticism to be effective against the bigger PF's. Plus, as I stated his man will be left to drop down and give Yao problems on offense. Howard might not be a defensive stopper, but niether is Hayes. Battier on the other hand IS. I beleive Battier is the best bet to cover those type players anyway. He's 6'8 and has the right combination of size, strength, and quickness.
I know he doesn't appear to fit our system but check out his stats. He has nearly always been a +0.300 3 pt shooter with T-Mac and Yao he'd get more open shots instead of him always need to dribble around to make the shot he could just shoot the open ones. He also has the ability to create something out of nothing which could help out the second unit a lot when we play a small running game like Hayes Snyder Head Francis Lucas. That line up could hold oneself both rebounding and possible defensively while they can get points on the board quick and francis could be the guy that creates something out of nothing when needed because he gets stuck. Plus we don't know what kind of injury can suddenly hit us so having more depth just means its for the better. So i believe even though he doesn't appear to fit he would be a great addition.
Pft, I wouldn't touch Stevie with a 10 foot pole sprayed with hospital grade antiseptic wash. Seriously, the guy has problems everywhere he goes, and is unable to find a role that suits whatever team he's in. Yes his role in the Rockets many years ago did fit, but we seriously sucked monkey butt back then. We could do with a better PG though.
