<div class="quote_poster">Franchise4Ever Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I would agree with you if every other superstar player wasn't like that....</div> I have to agree with you for the most part. There are some though. Take Ray Allen for example. What a class act that man is. Anyways, we are straying from the topic. Kobe's appeal got denied, the Lakers lost to the Knicks, time to move on. Maybe the NBA will be consistent from now on.
Anyone that watches Kobe consistently knows without a doubt that the slap to Manu was unintentional. Once ever few games Kobe will do exactly what he did against Ginobli. He either gets blocked or gets hit and traffic and when he loses the ball he throws his arms out in the exact same way to try and sale a foul. After watching the video a few times it seems as if Kobe is walking away but once he realizes that Manu isn't getting up, he turns back and goes and puts his hand on the back of Manu's head and apologizes. The suspension was ridiculous and I hate the "Big Wigs" of the NBA more and more with every decision they make. They blew this one big time and they should come out and own up to it...... But they won't.
<div class="quote_poster">KobeTheLegend Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Anyone that watches Kobe consistently knows without a doubt that the slap to Manu was unintentional. Once ever few games Kobe will do exactly what he did against Ginobli. He either gets blocked or gets hit and traffic and when he loses the ball he throws his arms out in the exact same way to try and sale a foul. </div> If you're going to flop and flail your body in all directions, and consequentially you knock another player to the ground, you need to accept responsibility for the consequences. "I didn't mean to hit him. I just flopped and he was in the way" isn't any kind of excuse.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">If you're going to flop and flail your body in all directions, and consequentially you knock another player to the ground, you need to accept responsibility for the consequences. "I didn't mean to hit him. I just flopped and he was in the way" isn't any kind of excuse. </div> While I agree you have to admit that the league went a bit far. It wasn't intentional, and Kobe did not mean to put Manu in harms way.
<div class="quote_poster">Franchise4Ever Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">While I agree you have to admit that the league went a bit far. It wasn't intentional, and Kobe did not mean to put Manu in harms way.</div> It does seem harsh. But look at it this way: If it happened in the middle of a game, even at the beginning of a game, it probably warranted an immediate ejection. Contact above the shoulders that puts a player on his back will not be tolerated, and "his face got in the way of my flopping motion" isn't an excuse. Because the ejection didn't occur then and there, the suspension effectively moves it to the beginning of the next game. That being said, if I was a fan who bought tickets specifically to watch Kobe at MSG, I'd be pissed off.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">It does seem harsh. But look at it this way: If it happened in the middle of a game, even at the beginning of a game, it probably warranted an immediate ejection. Contact above the shoulders that puts a player on his back will not be tolerated, and "his face got in the way of my flopping motion" isn't an excuse. Because the ejection didn't occur then and there, the suspension effectively moves it to the beginning of the next game. That being said, if I was a fan who bought tickets specifically to watch Kobe at MSG, I'd be pissed off.</div> It is only an ejection if it was determined it was intentional. There is no way he would've gotten ejected if it was any part of the game. Otherwise, everytime somebody gets poked in the eye, somebody gets ejected. It just seems utterly ridiculous that Kobe would be punished in the same manner as Baron Davis for trying to PUNCH Ross or KG and Hamilton mixing it up ... Anyone who has had a jumpshot blocked before knows that there is that split second in mid-air where your balance is lost. Kobe swinging is arm back was a combination of a reflexive action of trying to regain balance and fighting for the loose ball. or maybe Kobe can really think that quick - 'oh snap, i got blocked, let me use my eyes in the back of my head to see where Manu is so I can smack him to the ground while using the eyes in the front of my head to locate the ball and catch it in mid air and take another shot all in one motion' .... Spiderman couldn't have pulled that off.
<div class="quote_poster">notMuchgame Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">It is only an ejection if it was determined it was intentional. There is no way he would've gotten ejected if it was any part of the game. Otherwise, everytime somebody gets poked in the eye, somebody gets ejected. </div> NBA rule book says the following on flagrant fouls: <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> To be unsportsmanlike is to act in a manner unbecoming to the image of professional basketball. It consists of acts of deceit, disrespect of officials and profanity. The penalty for such action is a technical foul. Repeated acts shall result in expulsion from the game and a minimum fine of $1000. A flagrant foul-penalty (1) is unnecessary contact committed by a player against an opponent. A flagrant foul-penalty (2) is unnecessary and excessive contact committed by a player against an opponent. It is an unsportsmanlike act and the offender is ejected immediately. </div> The definitions are unfortunately ambiguous. You could argue that the contact in this case was unsportsmanlike, since it resulted from a flop which is unsportsmakelike. It was "unnecessary" because he didn't have to flail his arms -- he did so just to try to get a call from the officials. And it is excessive because the contact landed across a player's face and dropped him to the ground.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">NBA rule book says the following on flagrant fouls: The definitions are unfortunately ambiguous. You could argue that the contact in this case was unsportsmanlike, since it resulted from a flop which is unsportsmakelike. It was "unnecessary" because he didn't have to flail his arms -- he did so just to try to get a call from the officials. And it is excessive because the contact landed across a player's face and dropped him to the ground.</div> Who is to say he didn't he have to flail his arms? Who is to say he was flopping? Again, after watching the replay dozens of times, it looks like a reflexive reaction when balance is lost in mid-air. Now with that said, could I be wrong? yeah ... could you be wrong? yeah ... and that's the point, there is nothing concrete that would warrant a Lakers loss ... (oh btw, they were 2 point underdogs coming into the gamE). Baron trying to punch Ross, that's concrete. Rip and KG fighting, that's concrete ... this is not
<div class="quote_poster">notMuchgame Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Who is to say he didn't he have to flail his arms? Who is to say he was flopping? Again, after watching the replay dozens of times, it looks like a reflexive reaction when balance is lost in mid-air. </div> There's some evidence that it was a flop: What Kobe was really trying to do
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">There's some evidence that it was a flop: What Kobe was really trying to do</div> Hah, case closed. Thanks for the link, it just established what I've seen in the past.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">NBA rule book says the following on flagrant fouls: The definitions are unfortunately ambiguous. You could argue that the contact in this case was unsportsmanlike, since it resulted from a flop which is unsportsmakelike. It was "unnecessary" because he didn't have to flail his arms -- he did so just to try to get a call from the officials. And it is excessive because the contact landed across a player's face and dropped him to the ground.</div> All of this deciding what is intentional or not is exactly why Kobe should not have been suspended. If players, analysts, and fans alike can be so divided on the issue then it CANNOT call for a suspension. No one seems to think it warranted a one game suspension and many people do not even think it was unintentional. By doing this the NBA has set a precedence of using one man's subjective opinion to decide what was intentional or not. Stu Jackson may very well not like Bryant... or some other players who some teams may now starts campaigning against. Bruce Bown in my mind should get a number of suspensions as well from now on... his putting his feet under jumping players also isn't in the natural motion of the game and many players have complained about it... so now subjective opinion should hand him out a few suspensions as well. The biggest argument against the suspension is that former NBA players see what Kobe did as a natural motion of flopping or trying to clear space to grab the rebound on a last second play. All players do it... it just so happened that Ginobili (also a notorious flopper) got hit in the face AND San Antonio filed an anonymous complaint or a complaint they asked to keep anonymous (according to the ESPN analysts who can't believe this would be an issue unless someone complained).
<div class="quote_poster">Fiyah Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">The biggest argument against the suspension is that former NBA players see what Kobe did as a natural motion of flopping or trying to clear space to grab the rebound on a last second play. All players do it... it just so happened that Ginobili (also a notorious flopper) got hit in the face AND San Antonio filed an anonymous complaint or a complaint they asked to keep anonymous (according to the ESPN analysts who can't believe this would be an issue unless someone complained).</div> Flopping is bad for the game. If this suspension is going to discourage it, that is a good thing.
<div class="quote_poster">durvasa Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Flopping is bad for the game. If this suspension is going to discourage it, that is a good thing.</div> Hmmm... so how about punishing the floppers. You can't possibly be labeling Kobe Bryant a flopper. So I am guessing you would be for anything that discouraged flopping. Do you genuinely think this latest suspension will do that... or that the objective of the suspension was to discourage flopping? Tell me you seriously think that. Please. Flopping rarely results in someone getting hurt... so no... this supension will not stop the Ginobilis or Wades or anyone else noted for flopping from continuing to do so... and you know it. All this suspension does is make a case for other teams who want to get players in trouble for inadvertently or not hittinhg other players. Be prepared for a backlash from this.
<div class="quote_poster">Marbire Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">It was blatant and obvious. I pointed this out a couple times in the game thread in this forum, but both times my post was deleted for no reason. GJ moderators. Good call by Stu. Yes, I'm sure Pop can read Kobes mind. And if Kobe felt "terrible" about the play, he wouldn't have given Gino a quick glare, and just walked away........ While Manu is on the ground grabbing his face. Wow, Kobe sure knows how to express his emotions. And even if it WAS accidental, which it clearly wasn't, Kobe should get suspended for that ridiculous flop.</div> he checked on manu afterwards. stop hating.
<div class="quote_poster">Fiyah Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Flopping rarely results in someone getting hurt... so no... this supension will not stop the Ginobilis or Wades or anyone else noted for flopping from continuing to do so... and you know it. All this suspension does is make a case for other teams who want to get players in trouble for inadvertently or not hittinhg other players. Be prepared for a backlash from this.</div> It will discourage players from wildly flailing their arms in traffic trying to draw a foul. Kobe's arm motion wasn't natural. Routine, inadvertant contact will not be officiated any differently.
I agree with durvasa. I do think there should have been a foul at least on that play, but I don't believe that it warrants a suspension. It's tough to say if it was intentional or not, but I hope we all can agree that it wasn't his normal shooting motion and that he was either a)flailing his arms out to intentionally hit Ginobili in the face(not likely),or flailing his arms to get a cop out from the refs. If it was the most likely , then it would be a loose ball foul at worse. Even if it was an accident and no harm intended he should have gotten either a personal foul at worst or a flagrant foul. There's plenty of contact that is accidental that is a foul. I just hope that this at least leads to less cop outs for the superstars from the refs.
No way it warrents a 1 game suspension even if it was intentional... a personal foul or flagrant foul yea. But if Garnett can throw a ball and throw a punch and get only 1 game and Raja Bell clothesline, then this is BS.
<div class="quote_poster">Mr.Wade Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">No way it warrents a 1 game suspension even if it was intentional... a personal foul or flagrant foul yea.</div> If it was intentional then I would definitely think it would warrant a 1 game suspension or possibly 2. Anyone have a youtube clip of what KG did to get the 1 game suspension?
<div class="quote_poster">Omarion Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">If it was intentional then I would definitely think it would warrant a 1 game suspension or possibly 2. Anyone have a youtube clip of what KG did to get the 1 game suspension?</div> Invalid Video Link
