Warriors vs Lakers in 1 hour...

<div class="quote_poster">DTKennedy Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">i think we're looking at another late lottery pick :/</div>

That's not a bad thing, really. I mean if this team even squeaked into the playoffs, the way they're playing it would be an embarassment anyway. Is there anyone in the top 7 seeds that GS could even win ONE playoff game against? I doubt it.

Better to just get healthy, develop the young guys, see if Powell can give you something at PF, and hope fur a VERY ACTIVE offseason, IMO.

 

<div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">That's not a bad thing, really. I mean if this team even squeaked into the playoffs, the way they're playing it would be an embarassment anyway. Is there anyone in the top 7 seeds that GS could even win ONE playoff game against? I doubt it.

Better to just get healthy, develop the young guys, see if Powell can give you something at PF, and hope fur a VERY ACTIVE offseason, IMO.</div>

Agree completely

 

I think we were fooling ourselves thinking this team was better after the big trade. It's different, but it still hasn't gotten better. So I think we have to improve via trade and the draft. I was one of the earlier ones to advocate tanking, but didn't bring it up because we had the 8th spot even if it was very momentary. Thus, at this point, it's not a bad idea to play the young guys some minutes and give them experience. POB, Azubuike, Monta, Beans and Powell. Let them play!

Second, I don't think it's so bad that we have to blow the team up, but we have too many guys who play the same position. In other words, the pieces we got are interchangeable, but don't give us an upgrade of the players that we need.

For example, MP or Barnes. They each have their strengths, but they make mistakes, have low b-ball iq and don't do things well enough to make an impact. Sometimes they score, rebound or make good defensive plays, but they don't do it enough to be consistent. It's hard to say we should keep either them.

Or how about AL at power forward? We found out he's not really a power forward and while he's not a real good player, he's just enough of a player that he starts, but he's not a go to guy or anything like that. Yet we let him shoot like he is.

Next is JRich and Jax. Jax is better defensively while JRich is offensively, but neither has the all around skills to be the guy we can count on. Sure JRich plays with a lot of heart, but maybe we need someone who can do more. Same with Jax. He's had some good games, but he like AL, is just enough of a player to merit starting but not get all the shots that he is getting.

Next, is the PG position. Baron's our best PG, but he's got his warts, too. He's not consistent enough of a playmaker even though he gets assists, to give us the assurances that he will be our PG of the future. I don't think he's played well enough to say he's our future. OTOH Monta is our future at PG (imho and Nellie's), but he's not the shooter nor the playmaker that we need now. He still has turnovers and isn't consistent enough as a shooter to be the go to guy.

Next, let's look at the C and PF positions. We have AB, who has been fine, but don't have an adequate backup for him at this time. Our most lacking position is PF as we don't have the point forward Nellie wants nor a guy who can rebound and provide interior defense.

There you have it in a nutshell. We aren't a bad team, at least not bad enough to be in the running for a top three draft pick, nor are we a good enough team (even after the trade) to be a playoff contender. We're still a less than mediocre team that's capped out and unless we make trades and get a good draft pick, we're not going to improve our situation.

 

I always thought the reason Mully was targeting Harrington was that it was all there was....after the first top tier free agents.... Harrington looked from the start of free agency as the one guy that we could afford, with Murphy and Ike at the time playing PF.... we really only had Dunleavy/Pietrus at the 3..... I think Dunleavy was proving already to be an off the bench guy.... so i think .... i hope he was targeting AL as a 3....

But he is disappointing.... i never realized how fearful a guy could act.... it is like that show pros vs joes... and they are going against drexler and willis ... just throwing up stuff hoping it will go in ....

I kind of disagree that you can lump j-rich in with barnes and pietrus as a poor ball handler..... i think he has improved vastly.... and with barnes and pietrus you can see the turnover coming.... in panic.... barnes just a blockhead..... I think i have a nickname for BArnes.... almost as good as the towel .... not as telling as fisher the liability.....

how about barnes = mybad

 

I wonder if Powell could get a sniff of starting at PF and let Harrinton play SF. Let Jackson come off the bench. I cant believe how horrible a finisher Harrington is at the rim. I dont know what I like better. Murphy getting his shot stuffed or Al throwing up prayers for layups...

 

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I think we were fooling ourselves thinking this team was better after the big trade.
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The Warriors couldn't fool me! I know this team Yeah, we could let them play a little longer together and see if they improve as a team, but I don't think it's a team yet. It's a patchwork quilt as all the years before where proponents of the Warriors playoff chances claimed it was a team still trying to grow together or that it was going to be an 8th seed solely because of Monty getting fired and being replaced with Don Nelson who has the 2nd most wins as a head coach in nba history. We knew that a was lie and Don Nelson and any other coach would suffer with this roster. We're trying to put together scraps to resemble a team, yet it's not a team because our best players tend to play the kind of game that fails (a low % jump shooting team that doesn't play defense or run something good to avoid turnovers and low % desperation shots).

A real team plays together and accomplishes things together. This looks more like a collection of players trying to do stuff on their own and watch while one guy tries to create something and they don't react to the play by doing something proactive. That's why even when Dunleavy was sucking badly, he had a point about this club not playing team ball and relying on the natural instincts of one bad shooting, injury prone player (Baron Davis). This was the same crap as before and I felt it had less to do with the coaching than it did with the general incompetence of guys like Mullin, St. Jean, and all the other bufoons with the very top being owner Chris Cohan. Yeah they might have learned from their mistakes, but they came up with new mistakes or they're trying to find the correct answer. The job is a hard one, that's why I don't think these guys can do it anymore than people who criticize (like me) and have never done the position. My beef is like every citizen wanting a better president + cabinet (and especially defense secretary) than the one we have. It's an honest gripe.

But back to the team, which is not really a team. The players out there on the floor could stand to learn a few more plays to make teamplay easier, but yet it's the middle of the season. What can we do? Besides, I think Barnes and Pietrus are lost causes. They are so bad as natural bball players that I think to pay them more than the MLE would be robbery on their part.

It's like who else could we use at PF or SF when we don't have a prototypically built and talented one? AH, Pietrus, Barnes are all duds at PF and I think we're being overly hopeful with what Josh Powell can accomplish. He's more of the same hustle, only we haven't seen him too much. He could be just as lousy when it comes to keeping up with the quick decision making you have to have at the nba level. Guys like Barnes and Pietrus could be great players at other levels, but in the nba, these guys are just lacking upstairs. I think they kill the team momentum at times. Plus same with AH and sometimes Jax. Although I think Dun was decent at times, I'd prefer Jax doing something good as opposed to nothing good or nothing bad. Do something! If contracts didn't matter, I'd even think Murphy was a better fit than Al, because at PF, we gotta rebound and not take so many damn shots and coming up short. Make a freakin' layup for gosh sakes. Even Murphy the weak finisher he was could do that.

Maybe proponents of AL thought because he wasn't white meant he was stronger and more athletic than Murphy, but that's crap I say. I'm not saying I miss Murphy, I just dislike AH a lot more and that will probably never go away unless we get an Elton Brand or a Tim Duncan. But how many are there of those types of guys with bodies, minds, and skills in the same package? With our luck, we get one of the three, but not two.

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
Second, I don't think it's so bad that we have to blow the team up, but we have too many guys who play the same position. In other words, the pieces we got are interchangeable, but don't give us an upgrade of the players that we need.
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We don't have to blow up the team, but we definitely have to do more than just stand pat and make two bad moves for every good one. This mistakes that Mullin and company made early on were correctable in the end, but it definitely cost time. Time is a factor when the window of opportunity could be closing on us right now. We got Baron Davis who is injured every single year right about this time and his value is crap, we've got Jrich who is a good player but is very limited, and we got a few young guys that could make or break a franchise but we don't know that yet. In between the time discovering what we have, we should be making smart free agency moves and managing our salary structure a lot better. Sometimes there's no opportunities to make things happen and it's a high pressure situation. The early decision making is why I think the management of this club in the last decade has been doing an incredibly horrible job of trying to balance all these factors and make a contingency plan in case something didn't work. Too much fixing or undoing of the previous guy's mess.

But my biggest criticism has been with Mullin not being prepared to wait at the right times, and to pursue the market aggressively at others. He did it assbackwards with going for broke in 2004 and did absolutely crap after landing Baron Davis (a steal of a trade btw, but came with no momentum like with how the Suns targeted guys to fit in with their top two players + Steve Nash). I totally felt with the amount Mullin gave Murphy and Dunleavy and Fisher, you'd think he thought those guys were as good of a jump shooter as he was. What an incredible misjudge in talent and waste of resources so early in the game. Then there was Foyle which left us scratching our heads wondering if he knew something we didn't... maybe there was miracle cream he was rubbing on these players?

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">

For example, MP or Barnes. They each have their strengths, but they make mistakes, have low b-ball iq and don't do things well enough to make an impact. Sometimes they score, rebound or make good defensive plays, but they don't do it enough to be consistent. It's hard to say we should keep either them.

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I think their styles of play is like Mullin and company's GM-ing. They make one good move in a game or decent move to keep us interested or content, but they do a few bad things or nothing at all which infuriates. Their moves tend to put a lot of bad stuff on the guys having to coach these teams like Don Nelson (even if he tends to be too attached to his small ball loving ways, but that's all he knows and it works for regular season play with the right players). But all this bone headedness is just is something we can't afford if we want to go further than we have in the last few years, which was absolutely nowhere... Fans must have spent their money on tix realizing that this club was all for show, no substance whatsoever and these ownership and management guys don't act like they care or they don't know.

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
Or how about AL at power forward? We found out he's not really a power forward and while he's not a real good player, he's just enough of a player that he starts, but he's not a go to guy or anything like that. Yet we let him shoot like he is.
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Everyone who has watched his game could have told us that. That's why he switches teams a lot (not by choice) and that's why most of the time he's come off the bench. One dimensional all the way and I've been crying that aloud since the time we got him, but there are a few hopefuls that don't want to see the light that he is what he is. I tend to believe what Indiana and Hawks fans said about him because they've studied his game in similar offenses. He is what he is a role player that scores and does nothing else great. I'm not very happy about him because it makes me remember why we traded for him (Murphy, Dunleavy was a lot worse at times and more expensive). Oh and it cost us a solid player that actually plays like a big player. And you know Nelson... he's not too fond of big players. He'd probably cast Elton Brand or Tim Ducan out if Ike was even at that level in the future. Didn't even give Ike a chance. What a waste. If that was Ike's fate, we should have gone after Andrew Bynum, converted the 9th pick into two lower picks and grabbed somebody like Gerald Green, Danny Granger, or Andray Blatche...

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
Next is JRich and Jax. Jax is better defensively while JRich is offensively, but neither has the all around skills to be the guy we can count on. Sure JRich plays with a lot of heart, but maybe we need someone who can do more. Same with Jax. He's had some good games, but he like AL, is just enough of a player to merit starting but not get all the shots that he is getting.
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I disagree, Jax isn't better defensively, but he is better at making plays (some of the times). What Jax has in thet toolbox is a lot better as a shooting guard than Jrich has IMO. But you're right, we have no clear cut star that can do almost everything with efficiency. We think Baron is that superstar? Hell Monta is already a better shooter and finisher than him. JRich is usually a better finisher than most of the entire players on this roster. I think what sucks is that everyone on this roster can't shoot free throws. Can't even do the most fundamental aspect of the game which is to knock down penalty shots where nobody is contesting you or putting a body on you. Absolute mentally weak guys on this club. But I appreciate the guys actually trying to get fouled versus the ones that would rather shoot a lazy three than drive the lane and chop up their D.

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
Next, is the PG position. Baron's our best PG, but he's got his warts, too. He's not consistent enough of a playmaker even though he gets assists, to give us the assurances that he will be our PG of the future. I don't think he's played well enough to say he's our future. OTOH Monta is our future at PG (imho and Nellie's), but he's not the shooter nor the playmaker that we need now. He still has turnovers and isn't consistent enough as a shooter to be the go to guy.</div>

Let's not forget Baron isn't healthy enough to be a consistent playmaker for us. What good is 8 assists a night when he's down for 30 games in a season when we need every single win opportunity? Not only that, but the guy can't shoot worth crap. I mean I wouldn't mind if he was playing like Jason Kidd, but he's a scorer's mentality or else he wouldn't decide to pull up with a lackadaisical 3 point attempt after the team has already missed 5 of their last 3 pt attempts. Drive motha-! Ellis is obviously a work in progress at point, but one thing is clear. He shoots way better than Baron Davis. He actually pulls up off the drive and nails the midranger. He actually finishes at the rim. He for the most part, makes his free throws, although he's streaky for reasons unknown. Montay Ellis is shooting 47% for the year and that's something Baron Davis only wishes he could do. If Ellis keeps up at his rate, it's not unreasonable he couldn't finish with 47% as long as he doesn't settle for lazy shots he can't make.

It would be great if Monta Ellis can be as natural about making the right decision as Baron Davis is. But it can't be taught. You either see it or you don't and that comes with the player's focus, their natural instinct to see the play before it happens, and experience.


<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
Next, let's look at the C and PF positions. We have AB, who has been fine, but don't have an adequate backup for him at this time. Our most lacking position is PF as we don't have the point forward Nellie wants nor a guy who can rebound and provide interior defense.
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We don't have defense period. There's not much help AB is going to do when he's constantly being blitzed by two players or taken out of the play entirely when they shield him off. There's a few players that can be exploited constantly if Nelson doesn't take him out and I feel one of them is Pietrus and the other is Al Harrington. Those guys either aren't quick enough, strong enough, smart enough or aggressive enough to play the kind of help D or see the play coming before it happens. Poor AB gets screwed by the refs, but he also gets screwed by his own teammates' shortcomings and himself. AB probably has to work on his foul trouble, but he can't help being undersized at the position Nelson wants him to play and so he has to be more aggressive in order to force more jumpshots and keep people away from the basket. Instead they just pound the ball inside against us and go for high % layups or high % foul shots... It's sickening. We need more depth if we can't find the talent, because teams just go right down the middle on us or kick it out on an uncontested jumper.

I don't think adding more smaller scorers really solves anything if we can't control the glass or keep the rebounding disparity down.

<div class="quote_poster">jason voorhees Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">
There you have it in a nutshell. We aren't a bad team, at least not bad enough to be in the running for a top three draft pick, nor are we a good enough team (even after the trade) to be a playoff contender. We're still a less than mediocre team that's capped out and unless we make trades and get a good draft pick, we're not going to improve our situation.</div>

Like always. It's purgatory for us Warrior fans. How can we be positive when management and ownership hasn't shown us any promise or results? I feel like maybe I have myself to blame because of my perception or expectations in this product known as basketball.

 

Dynasty are made by draft picks. Our drafts have been mediocre at best. Part of it has to do with bad luck, the other part from missed opportunities. We have made due with some of our picks but when you miss out on players like McGrady, Bryant, Amare etc just from poor judgement, that is a hard pill to swallow when you choose Foyle, Dunleavy etc. We have gotten somewhat lucky by finding diamonds in the rough like Arenas and Ellis, but wind up getting sh1t on in the process. Oh well. I think we are officially out of the playoff hunt now because this road trip is against hardly any slouches and all we have left in the season are the likes of Dallas, San Antonio, Denver etc. I say we will have less than a .500 record for the next month and a half and get stuck with another 8-11 pick...

 

I think the trade was terrific. It didn't really make the team much better, if at all, but it was terrific. We got rid of Murphy / Dunleavy, and frankly even if they're not much better SJax and AL will be more valuable trade chips this offseason. Sure we gave up Ike but we got a sleeper prospect in Powell who I happen to REALLY like all around. And Sarunas for McCleod is a no brainer. The best thing is that it helped our cap situation: we owe less $$ for less years now. So while it didn't make this team playoff caliber, it was still a great trade by Mully IMO, and best of all it showed the league and the fans that he's willing to accept a mistake (Dunmurphy) and to have some guts and pull the trigger on a BIG TIME deal. As a fan, I applaud Mullin for that.

Now, there's still so much more work to do. If you want to play Nellie Ball, you're going to need a Dirk Nowitzki. Otherwise don't play Nellie ball. This running team frankly isn't very good at running, which is sad. They're mostly poor ball handlers, wioth poor vision, and poor passing skills. SJax, Baron, Sarunas, and Monta are exceptions, but JRich, Pietrus, Barnes, Harrinton, etc all leave something to be desired. Now, Barnes can really run the floor with energy, which is a good thing, but when you compare this team to the Suns... they're WORLDS APART -- not in terms of marquee talent -- just in terms of how they see the floor, how they run the break, how they fill the lanes, and how they finish in transition. WORLDS APART.

As long as Nellie's here, however, it's Nellie-Ball or bust. So IMO this team should be entirely focused on getting a Power Forward THAT NELLIE WILL ACTUALLY PLAY AT PF. We need the best PF we can get that will actually be played at the 4 alongside Beans. This is the only priority right now.

Sure we could get Gasol / KG but you know what? Nellie would play those guys at the 5 and make Beans come off the bench. SO we can't go after those guys. Brand, JO, Boozer? Same story. Nellie would adamantly REFUSE to play them at PF, instead benching Beans, playing JO or KG at the center, and having AL "baby-hook" Harrington play the PF.

So, rather than go after the best piece, we need to go after the piece that Nellie would actually play at PF. Someone who can run the fast break, pass, and shoot. Hopefully they'll sneak in and rebound/block shots, too, but don't tell Nellie that or he'll bench them.

I wonder if Nowitzki is available?

Monta+JRich+Harrington+Pietrus for Dirk...

 

Was courtside yesterday and it was depressing. Just no fire to the team, weak finishes around the bucket, woeful rebounding.

The first 6 mins were fabulous, Warriors were up 21-13, then zip. You do the math, they got pounded, inside, outside.

Monta showed up, but no one else did. When there's no fast break, the Warriors simply break down into dribble, dribble, desperation shot or just one pass and long jumper. No idea how they finished 43% because it looked like 30% when the game was on the line.

Harrington is not a good finisher and when the J's off, he's worth nothing because as others have said, he's a terrible rebounder.

Jackson is actually not a bad player, he makes sweet passes and has a nice shot, but he tends to go 1 on 1 alot.

AB played fantastic. Someone get him some more shots. Unbelievable how many rebounds he gets given that he is one slim guy. His FT is back to being awful though. What happened? He got a hitch somehow now?

 

<div class="quote_poster">Warriorfansnc93 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Dynasty are made by draft picks. Our drafts have been mediocre at best. Part of it has to do with bad luck, the other part from missed opportunities. We have made due with some of our picks but when you miss out on players like McGrady, Bryant, Amare etc just from poor judgement, that is a hard pill to swallow when you choose Foyle, Dunleavy etc. We have gotten somewhat lucky by finding diamonds in the rough like Arenas and Ellis, but wind up getting sh1t on in the process. Oh well. I think we are officially out of the playoff hunt now because this road trip is against hardly any slouches and all we have left in the season are the likes of Dallas, San Antonio, Denver etc. I say we will have less than a .500 record for the next month and a half and get stuck with another 8-11 pick...</div>

The problem in the past hasn't been who the Warriors have drafted for the most part unless if you want to go as far back as Foyle. The problem has been horrible contract extentions. I would take Arenas, JRich, Jamison, Monta Ellis, Andris Biedrins, Troy Murphy, Ike Diogu, Chris Taft, and maybe even Mike Dunleavy if they had decent contracts. Right now I would love to see Jamison here for Al Harrington and Jackson or whomever else. Though the Wizards probably wouldn't do that.

Basically the Warriors are in the audition mode yet again. They were in this mode earlier when Dunleavy and Murphy were the front court, JRich was out and Roberson, Barnes, and later Azubuike were getting auditioned for the team. Now it seems as if the team is in another audition, trying to find who they are and what they want and need to do.

One of the problems is that all of these players never went to college, in particular Stephen Jackson and Al Harrington. In college you learn how to win as a team as a top player especially if you have a scholarship and have nba potential. Carmello Anthony most likely wouldn't be as good as he is right now if he didn't go to Syracuse and won big there. He would probably be like how Al Harrington or Stephen Jackson is right now. I mean even for the top high school players like Kobe, KG, and TMac, they have all really needed a lot of tutorage on how to play as a team member and not just a one man show which hasn't been an easy transition (Maybe KG is TOO unselfish). One thing that I see is that these guys play too much like it is a one man show and that they are the star. Even Baron Davis, even though he did go to college, plays like this but slightly to a lesser degree. Monta Ellis doesn't really fit this category too much, but I think Jackson and Harrington do a whole bunch.

I agree that the Warriors have too many repeats of players who play the same position. That is why I was kind of positive about trading someone like Jason Richardson for Jason Kidd. However I must say that Jason Richardson does look extremely good right now. His shot is so smooth and he looks quicker and faster than ever. Al Harrington is going to need to work a lot on conditioning for next season. But also because of these repeats, I think trading some of them, outside of JRich for Jamison would probably help. He'd bring some inside scoring and rebounding, and he can definitley run the break.

 

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Maybe proponents of AL thought because he wasn't white meant he was stronger and more athletic than Murphy, but that's crap I say. I'm not saying I miss Murphy, I just dislike AH a lot more and that will probably never go away unless we get an Elton Brand or a Tim Duncan. But how many are there of those types of guys with bodies, minds, and skills in the same package? With our luck, we get one of the three, but not two.</div>

We should've known better about AL, but Mullin was going to offer him $60M and try to land him, so we were lucky Indiana stepped in and took him off our hands. We weren't the only ones who thought AL was more athletic, a better rebounder and a better scorer than what we got. AL is good at times and has improved his rebounding, but he's still too inconsistent in shooting and takes way too many shots. Maybe he still needs to get in better conditioning. But compared to Murphy, he's more suited to the style Nelson is playing. I liked Murph and was a fan, but in the end his lack of defense and effort in playing PF or C just ended up wanting us to get rid of him.

Now we know that AL is a tweener and prolly someone better suited at SF than PF for this team. At least his contract isn't as bad as Murphy's so it will be easier to package him in trade for a Rashard Lewis. Maybe we can showcase AL and have another team take him off our hands in a package with another player.

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">But my biggest criticism has been with Mullin not being prepared to wait at the right times, and to pursue the market aggressively at others. He did it assbackwards with going for broke in 2004 and did absolutely crap after landing Baron Davis (a steal of a trade btw, but came with no momentum like with how the Suns targeted guys to fit in with their top two players + Steve Nash). I totally felt with the amount Mullin gave Murphy and Dunleavy and Fisher, you'd think he thought those guys were as good of a jump shooter as he was. What an incredible misjudge in talent and waste of resources so early in the game. Then there was Foyle which left us scratching our heads wondering if he knew something we didn't... maybe there was miracle cream he was rubbing on these players?</div>

I wanted Mullin to make a trade before the deadline, but since he didn't, we can hope he'll pull off another good trade during the off-season. I doubt he's going to stand pat saying he expects the team to get better (internal development) like last season. If he does that, then this team is done for again.

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I disagree, Jax isn't better defensively, but he is better at making plays (some of the times). What Jax has in thet toolbox is a lot better as a shooting guard than Jrich has IMO. But you're right, we have no clear cut star that can do almost everything with efficiency. We think Baron is that superstar? Hell Monta is already a better shooter and finisher than him. JRich is usually a better finisher than most of the entire players on this roster. I think what sucks is that everyone on this roster can't shoot free throws. Can't even do the most fundamental aspect of the game which is to knock down penalty shots where nobody is contesting you or putting a body on you. Absolute mentally weak guys on this club. But I appreciate the guys actually trying to get fouled versus the ones that would rather shoot a lazy three than drive the lane and chop up their D.</div>

I just think JRich is a better player, better fit and better for the Warriors in the long run than Jax. Of course, it also makes him one of our most valuable trading chips.

Jax takes some bad shots and plays too much one on one. If he's on, then it's great, but his shooting isn't consistent enough. He shouldn't be shooting 15 - 20 shots a game. I think his defense is pretty good, especially on the perimeter. He usually keeps his feet moving which is key to stopping a good offensive player.

Either way, I'd look to see how they mesh with the team Nellie and Mullin is assembling and then decide which one to go with.

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Montay Ellis is shooting 47% for the year and that's something Baron Davis only wishes he could do. If Ellis keeps up at his rate, it's not unreasonable he couldn't finish with 47% as long as he doesn't settle for lazy shots he can't make.

It would be great if Monta Ellis can be as natural about making the right decision as Baron Davis is. But it can't be taught. You either see it or you don't and that comes with the player's focus, their natural instinct to see the play before it happens, and experience.</div>

Well, I'd like to see Monta play the PG position more. It's a good chance to develop his skills there. I guess he's about done as well as he could at this point. He's still a work in progress. If Monta can become the PG of the future, then he'd be more valuable to this team and we can trade Baron.

<div class="quote_poster">custodianrules2 Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Like always. It's purgatory for us Warrior fans. How can we be positive when management and ownership hasn't shown us any promise or results? I feel like maybe I have myself to blame because of my perception or expectations in this product known as basketball.</div>

Yup. I have to agree with you there. It's purgatory because we have to win the lotto in order to get a top three pick, and even if the team tanks, the best we could do is get a number 7 pick or something around there.

Yesterday, I figured it out. If we are a PO team, then it takes a .500 team to be one. The Ws would have to go 16 - 9 the rest of the way to get there. Pretty much done for.

If you want to suck and draft, say a #7 draft pick, then we can go 8 - 17 and have a pretty good shot at that pick or if the ping pong balls go our way, we can hope for a top 3 pick.

Either way, we're in between, so it won't be easy to do.

 

In terms of draft vs. playoffs, the Warriors have been about the worst team in sports history in terms of being right in between and thus sucking on both ends.

 

If I were in charge, I'd be ready to blow up this team and trade everyone, absolutely everyone except Monta and Andris right now. They are garbage and except for those two players there is nothing but a pile of garbage with which to build a future on. Every one of them is flawed and overrated and I'm sick of it. No tweak is going to save this team or make it a serious contender, it needs to be demolished, swept away, and started from scratch. Face it, they're not winning a damned thing before Nelson retires or dies anyway, so that's not a factor IMO. The demons need to be exorcised and the curse lifted. Think of it as a brand-new expansion team starting with two great picks.

 

<div class="quote_poster">AlleyOop Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">In terms of draft vs. playoffs, the Warriors have been about the worst team in sports history in terms of being right in between and thus sucking on both ends.</div>

I was thinking if we went on a losing streak, we could get around a #7 pick. At #7, we could get an impact player, i.e. stud front court player, who can help right away considering this is a deep draft for PF/C types.

But, we can't be so bad that we'll catch Boston, Memphis, Philly and Milwaukee.

The next five teams that are in worse order of finish are Atlanta, Charlotte, Seattle, Portland and Sacramento.

We're similar with New York, Minnesota, New Jersey and the Clippers.

#7 was too optimistic. Likely we'll be in the #10 - 14 range. If we were going to pick today, then it would be at #10. It's tough to get an impact big man who can help right away there.

 

<div class="quote_poster">HiRez Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">If I were in charge, I'd be ready to blow up this team and trade everyone, absolutely everyone except Monta and Andris right now. They are garbage and except for those two players there is nothing but a pile of garbage with which to build a future on. Every one of them is flawed and overrated and I'm sick of it. No tweak is going to save this team or make it a serious contender, it needs to be demolished, swept away, and started from scratch. Face it, they're not winning a damned thing before Nelson retires or dies anyway, so that's not a factor IMO. The demons need to be exorcised and the curse lifted. Think of it as a brand-new expansion team starting with two great picks.</div>

This is all on Cohan IMO. If he were a better owner he would have hired the right people to begin with in making this franchise successful. There's a common factor why we suck so badly all these years and it started with him back in 94. Bad ownership is another reason why the niners suck now it's because those owners are garbage as well. I still profess that the best owners in the nba are fans themselves and they know who to hire to build that team for them.

I've got this feeling that nobody talented wants to work for Cohan because like the basketball roster, gm-ing is probably a team sport and nobody wants to join a team full of frustration and nobody dependable or smart. If Mullin and company starts overriding decisions where the smaller guy says, hey don't sign Dunleavy and Murphy so soon, he'd probably ignore the advice from the smaller guy and follow his own hunch that Dunleavy/Murphy is talented just like him. Billy Beane these guys ain't.

It's like with our government. They got guys on the bottom saying this is the way things are, and the guys at the top are totally doing their own political crap and ignoring what the guys underneath are telling them. Then they replace those guys with the people that do agree with them. Isn't that what happened to Musselman somewhat or maybe why Mullin brought in Nelly? Hey no big men depth because we blew it on big stiffs! Great! Let's play small. There has to be a reason why EMuss was fighting with the front office and some of the players. Maybe the players weren't basketball smart, the GMs weren't paying attention to what they really had now and looking two years down the road. Maybe when it came down to it, both players and the GM team were doing a horrible job earning their pay.

I just don't understand how it's even possible for a team to be this bad for so long. It's a statistical anomaly. We figure a team is really unlucky or just really plain incompetent.

I guess everything comes in a vicious cycle because I feel like I've already said this every single month or every week. It's like coming off a bad addiction of sorts and I'm in the low point.

 

It wasn't the first time we are rumored to target Harrington. Ever since Mullin became VP, his name always seemed to link with us. I think Mullin liked him when he was in Indiana.

Like Alleyoop mentioned, there is also no question that the trade still is a terrific one. Not only we got better players, both Jackson and Harrington are more tradable than Dunelavy and Murphy. I mean, don't you think it's unfair to expect a major solution from Dunleavy and Murphy package? Another good thing about Harrington is that he is capable of being a 6th man. So, we can improve either position without worrying about what Harrington would do. And, I am still surprised that it only took Diogu, whom we may never utilize, to dump those two guys. Of course, the trade is made to make other trades. Mullin still has a lot of jobs in this offseason.

But, who do we trade? Biedrins is definitely out of the question, because it's just way too hard to get a big man in this league. Monta has very high value, but it will take awful a lot to trade him. All Davis, Richardson and Harrington have values, but they aren't exactly hot trading chips like Monta due to their salaries. After that, we pretty much don't have good trading chips. Despite Jackson put some impressive numbers with us, his trading value is minimal, if not negative. Pietrus is gone, and we need Cabbage's expiring contract. Foyle may be bit easier to trade, but nobody will accept his contract willingly. And, we will probably hold onto POB, until we know what we will get from him.

Sooo... Where do we get that magical PF, who can play with Biedrins in Nelson's system? From this draft? First, we aren't exactly in a great position to draft quality PF, so I guess this road trip will answer awful a lot of question. If we completly bomb this road trip like 1-4 or 0-5, you will see a lot of Powell, Cabbage, POB and others, since Nelson is known for tanking when necessary. Hopefully, we can reach like top 7 at the end. Or trade? Do we trade Richardson? Or even Monta? To get players like Gasol? As much as I would love not to trade players like Davis, Richardson, and Monta, while getting a dream big man, it just isn't realistic. We really, really, really need a solid big man, because this current players live and die with 3 pts. Maybe, we will luck out and make PO. Or, this team finds some chemistry, and play better as a team. But, without a big man, we will always remain as a 3 pts bombing team, and relying on 3 pts like relying on lottory. As much as I hate to say it, if it costs Davis or Richardson to start a conversation to get a big man, I think we should bite that deal. If it cost Monta? Errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr... Dang... Ugh... Why do I get a flashback of Richmond-Owens trade...

 

I know that people are worried about Jackson's potential blow-ups, but honestly.. If I were building for the future, I'd hold on to Ellis, Beidrins and Jackson. Even though Jackson is streaky, he's a Nelly type of player. he actually does everything well (not potentially do everything well like Dunleavy). Jason is another guy that I'd like to hold on to, but if he can be moved (assuming he picks up his game in these last games) and a big game player can be brought in, I'm ok with it. Baron is movable do to his star power alone... and Foyle's contract is almost up. I think that there are more pieces than you think that ther are on this team. Harrington is movable, and I wouldn't be sad if he were moved. Other teams making a push would love to have him. Let's see where Mully takes this, I think it should be a nice offseason.

 

Well I am not going to be against people freaking out and wanting to blow this all up. I was thinking about the same thing for a little while, at least making some moves. Right now though, the Warriors are only 1.5 games out of the playoffs. Last weekend was horrible. But the Warriors know right now how important this current road trip is in order to make the playoffs. Who knows, maybe something clicks with a day off to gel a little more and to get to know each other and things will be better this week. Nothing is going to be easy, but if you run away after two big losses and when things seem tough, then you deserve to lose. I hope this team isn't like that. I think teams in previous years were like that, but I hope this team is different.

Jason Richardson looks awesome physically and his form especially shooting the ball is sweet. Hopefully Harrington and Jackson can help this team vs. the upcoming opponents from the Eastern Confrence since they have played them more than the other Warriors have. The big players are Pietrus and Barnes. If Pietrus all of a sudden clicks into the gear and form he was playing at the start of the season when Nelson was so high on him and if Barnes just becomes a role scorer and big energy and rebound guy then I think that definitley bumps this team from losers to winners.

This team is weird. When we are high on them, they lose. When we are down on them, they start to come back. I agree that we have legit reasons to be down on this team, especially with recent performances.

Objectively though, the Warriors are 1.5 games out and I think it only takes about a week to gain that amount of space in the standings, which is what the Warriors have and more. So I am not ready to give up yet. Maybe if they fall on their faces this week then I will join you guys.

 

<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">
Objectively though, the Warriors are 1.5 games out and I think it only takes about a week to gain that amount of space in the standings, which is what the Warriors have and more. So I am not ready to give up yet. Maybe if they fall on their faces this week then I will join you guys.</div>

I think it's safe to think that on a road trip the team will fall on its face

 

I think it's safe to think that we'll probably not make the playoffs. Oh yeah and it's not the coach's fault, either. You either have the pieces or you don't. Like in chess, you have to think a few moves ahead and you have to keep the right pieces. What good is having a few bishops and pawns, but no queen, rooks, or knights? I think our situation is totally on the ownership and the management they have picked to run this franchise. It's just plain bad. Nothing has changed.

If Cohan were governor of California he'd be recalled faster than Gray Davis.