<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Hows 30 and 12 for ya? </div> those are nice numbers but overall he still didn't have a "great" game last night.......he was MIA until the last 2 minutes, and there were some questionable calls down the stretch....a win is a win, but if I'm a mavs or dirk fan there are still some things that would worry me about last nights win...
I smell some hate up in this thread. Dirk soft? No. He isn't the clutchest player, but he isn't soft, either.
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">seriously for an MVP candidate and the leader of his team, yes he was "stinking it up".....you should never consistently play "pretty good" in a playoff series if you're the supposed MVP.....for God sakes the man was averaging 20 points a game in the series (at around 40% shooting) and falling away from guys who were shorter than him before the last 2 minutes of last nights game.......</div> That doesn't sound very true at all. "For God's sake" the Warriors also match up well against Dirk, don't make it sound like he never gets past the First Round. Dirk has come back against the Rockets after they had an 0-2 Lead and was fantastic in the playoffs last year until the Refs started rewarding the more aggressive team in the Finals. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> like I said I'll agree to disagree on Dirks softness with you guys because there are PLENTY of fans, media, and basketball experts who feel the same way.....</div> Only for this GS series.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Dirk soft? No. He isn't the clutchest player, but he isn't soft, either. </div> I just honestly don't believe that this guy will ever "lead" his team to a title, because I just don't feel like he's the "guy" to do it......his lack of inside play (he's not that quick off the dribble, and he has no moves on the block), mental lapses, and occasional passiveness just aren't things that I say make up a "leader" or even a "MVP"...Dirk is a great player, but not someone who I'd build my franchise around, UNLESS I have someone who can score down low, rather that be from penetration or post play (which the mavs don't have)
So you spent 10 pages in this thread complaining about a player who isn't even on your team? I think somebody is jealous...
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">That doesn't sound very true at all. "For God's sake" the Warriors also match up well against Dirk, don't make it sound like he never gets past the First Round. Dirk has come back against the Rockets after they had an 0-2 Lead and was fantastic in the playoffs last year until the Refs started rewarding the more aggressive team in the Finals. </div> LMAO, anyone who watched that series know that Jason Terry, Josh Howard, Daniels, Finley, and Stack were the ones that brought the Mavs back in that series...you must have not watched the games, because anyone who did would never say that......Dallas's length and athleticism in the backcourt is the reason they came back....not because of Dirk....Tmac and Ryan Bowen made him look ridiculous at times in that series... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">So you spent 10 pages in this thread complaining about a player who isn't even on your team? I think somebody is jealous...</div> yeah that must be it.....
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">I just honestly don't believe that this guy will ever "lead" his team to a title, because I just don't feel like he's the "guy" to do it......his lack of inside play (he's not that quick off the dribble, and he has no moves on the block), mental lapses, and occasional passiveness just aren't things that I say make up a "leader" or even a "MVP"...Dirk is a great player, but not someone who I'd build my franchise around, UNLESS I have someone who can score down low, rather that be from penetration or post play (which the mavs don't have)</div> He could have easily lead his team to a title last year if Wade had gotten a couple less calls. Heh.
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">LMAO, anyone who watched that series know that Jason Terry, Josh Howard, Daniels, Finley, and Stack were the ones that brought the Mavs back in that series...you must have not watched the games, because anyone who did would never say that......Dallas's length and athleticism in the backcourt is the reason they came back....not because of Dirk....Tmac and Ryan Bowen made him look ridiculous at times in that series...</div> To me it seems like you didn't watch Dirk's run in the post-season last year. That's just one example, but considering how you hate on Dirk at the current moment, why would you give him any credit for that HOU series either? Of course he played a role in that series, not that it is crucial at all for my argument. Here let me clarify once again: <div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">those are nice numbers but overall he still didn't have a "great" game last night.......he was MIA until the last 2 minutes, and there were some questionable calls down the stretch....a win is a win, but if I'm a mavs or dirk fan there are still some things that would worry me about last nights win...</div> 30 and 12 isn't enough? Lol man. What questionable calls? Are you ******* serious?! LMAO you're a Wade fan. Shut up with that stuff.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">That's just one example, but considering how you hate on Dirk at the current moment, why would you give him any credit for that HOU series either? Of course he played a role in that series, not that it is crucial at all for my argument. Here let me clarify once again:</div> Dirks stats from that series by each game 21 points, 5-19 FG 26 points, 8-21 FG 28 points, 9-16 FG 18 points, 4-14 FG 23 points, 9-22 FG 19 points, 5-22 FG 14 points 5-14 FG Dirk was not the problem against the rockets in that series, which brings me back to the point that the guy is a talented player, but not someone who will consistantly carry his team and bring them to the promised land....guys who are 6'8 give him problems, because he's not quick enough to get around them, and his post game is non-existant.....a player of his caliber shouldn't be that easy to contain...... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">What questionable calls? Are you ******* serious?! LMAO you're a Wade fan. Shut up with that stuff.</div> there were some questionable calls down the stretch, but the warriors killed themselves with missed layups and bad offensive possesions...so Dallas deserved it last night...
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Dirks stats from that series by each game 21 points, 5-19 FG 26 points, 8-21 FG 28 points, 9-16 FG 18 points, 4-14 FG 23 points, 9-22 FG 19 points, 5-22 FG 14 points 5-14 FG Dirk was not the problem against the rockets in that series, which brings me back to the point that the guy is a talented player, but not someone who will consistantly carry his team and bring them to the promised land....guys who are 6'8 give him problems, because he's not quick enough to get around them, and his post game is non-existant.....a player of his caliber shouldn't be that easy to contain......</div> You just mentioned a bunch of role players yet excluded Dirk; yes that was biased of you. You're not taking his three-pointers or FTs into account so his TS% was more respectable then it seems. But this brings me to my next point... so? He was terrific last year in the playoffs. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> there were some questionable calls down the stretch, but the warriors killed themselves with missed layups and bad offensive possesions...so Dallas deserved it last night...</div> Yeah, that's more like it.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You just mentioned a Bunch of Role Players yet Excluded Dirk; yes that was biased of you. You're not taking his three-pointers or FTs into account so his TS% was more respectable then it seems. But this brings me to my next point... so? .</div> that's because those role players (who are all star caliber...Terry,Howard,Stack) are the reason the mavs won that series....seriously you must have not watched that series, because any rockets or mavs fan or nba fan would tell you that Dirk was MIA during that entire series, there wasn't "one" game where he actually played great. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">He was terrific last year in the playoffs</div> until the finals.......and last I checked those still count as the playoffs.....he was decent in the finals, had he been great the Mavs probably win, because man for man they were much more talented than Miami...Wade = clutch, Dirk = soft...that was the ultimate difference in that series...
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">that's because those role players (who are all star caliber...Terry,Howard,Stack) are the reason the mavs won that series....seriously you must have not watched that series, because any rockets or mavs fan or nba fan would tell you that Dirk was MIA during that entire series, there wasn't "one" game where he actually played great.</div> Again that's stretching the truth (he had some respectable games) and what I said before. I never gave him the majority of credit for those wins but the fact is that he won that series. If Steve Nash plays sub-par but his team comes back from a series like that then I'd bet you'd be giving him a lot of dap. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> until the finals.......and last I checked those still count as the playoffs.....he was decent in the finals, had he been great the Mavs probably win, because man for man they were much more talented than Miami...Wade = clutch, Dirk = soft...that was the ultimate difference in that series...</div> Even in the Finals he played great. Check out Games 2, 3, and 6. The Heat were also allowed to play him quite physical as well (like Duncan was allowed to get touched in his DEN series this year). The Heat were aggressive and got away with murder. Wade = got too many FTs in the Finals Dirk = not the most clutch but not "soft"
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Again that's stretching the truth and what I said before. I never gave him the majority of credit for those wins but the fact is that he won that series. If Steve Nash plays sub-par but his team comes back from a series like that then I'd bet you'd be giving him a lot of dap.</div> yes he won the series....but not because of what he did...he won because he was wearing the winning teams uniform..he had little impact on the outcome of that series....and Phoenix can't afford for Nash to play sub-par an entire series... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Even in the Finals he played great. Check out Games 2,3, and 6. The Heat were also allowed to play him quite physical as well (like Duncan was being allowed to get touched in his DEN series this year). The Heat were aggressive and got away with murder. </div> are you serious???...I remember distinctively Dirk playing good in the 1st half of game 6, but pulling a dissapearing act in the 2nd half...at one point he threw a bad pass to Eric Dampier in the crunch time, because he didn't have the stones to take the shot himself....if you call Dirk's play "great" in the finals last year, then you have very low standards of great play....
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">yes he won the series....but not because of what he did...he won because he was wearing the winning teams uniform..he had little impact on the outcome of that series....and Phoenix can't afford for Nash to play sub-par an entire series...</div> What does it matter? I don't care about ONE playoff series. The fact is that he got the job done but you wouldn't give him ANY CREDIT. You mentioned guys like Daniels before Dirk, you're BIASED. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> are you serious???...I remember distinctively Dirk playing good in the 1st half of game 6, but pulling a dissapearing act in the 2nd half...at one point he threw a bad pass to Eric Dampier in the crunch time, because he didn't have the stones to take the shot himself....if you call Dirk's play "great" in the finals last year, then you have very low standards of great play....</div> I remember Posey and Haslem were fouling Dirk throughout the series. I also remember Dirk getting fouled by Wade with 26 seconds to go in Game Six and he didn't get the call, then the game was over. Dirk didn't play "great" in the Finals but he didn't need to; he's not trying to be the GOAT.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">What does it matter? I don't care about ONE playoff series. The fact is that he got the job done but you wouldn't give him ANY CREDIT. You mentioned guys like Daniels before Dirk, you're BIASED. </div> that's because he really wasn't the reason they won that series.....yes he scored points on shooting miserably from the field, BUT he was never the X-factor in that series <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I also remember Dirk getting fouled by Wade with 26 seconds to go and he didn't get the call, then the game was over. Dirk didn't play "great" in the Finals but he didn't need to. </div> oh okay......so your leader/MVP/leading scorer, etc. doesn't need to play "great" in order to beat another great team......that's a new one.......
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">that's because he really wasn't the reason they won that series.....yes he scored points on shooting miserably from the field, BUT he was never the X-factor in that series</div> Right but he was A LOT more important than Daniels. That's just another example of your hating. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> oh okay......so your leader/MVP/leading scorer, etc. doesn't need to play "great" in order to beat another great team......that's a new one.......</div> Of course he didn't have to play great to win that series, the Heat would have lost with a few less whistles. Dirk isn't Larry Bird, he's not trying to compare resum?s. However, 06-07 was a brand new Season and he indeed played like the MVP. Now he has to finish the Warriors off but he didn't "stink it up" Games 1-4. Either way, Dirk wasn't "soft" in the Finals, just not great.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Right but he was A LOT more important than Daniels. That's just another example of your hating. </div> funny how Daniels is the only name you pulled out of there....Terry,Howard, and Stackhouse were WAY more important than Dirk in that series...had they not shown up (like their leader) Big D would've been swept... <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">the Heat would have lost with a few less whistles. </div> LOL, not this again....when you're up 2-0 and have a double digit lead with 6 minutes remaining in game 3 you have no right to blame the officials for losing the series for you........give credit where credit is due...Miami was just the better team last year...
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">funny how Daniels is the only name you pulled out of there....Terry,Howard, and Stackhouse were WAY more important than Dirk in that series...had they not shown up (like their leader) Big D would've been swept...</div> Uh what? He was about as good as Terry and Stackhouse on some occasions just not every game IIRC. Wow get over it that's one series when Dirk didn't even have STRONG MVP PER that season. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> LOL, not this again....when you're up 2-0 and have a double digit lead with 6 minutes remaining in game 3 you have no right to blame the officials for losing the series for you........give credit where credit is due...Miami was just the better team last year...</div> LOL what? A few posts ago you were complaining about calls too. Was Miami a better team? Wade played better than Dirk but as a team that is debatable. Well what was the point of this thread? You haven't proved Dirk is soft, just not great in the Finals.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Uh what? He was also better than Terry and Stackhouse on some occasions just not every game IIRC. Wow get over it. </div> get over what?...the point I was trying to make is that using that Houston series to validate dirks "clutchness" is foolish, because he really wasn't the reason they won that series. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">LOL what? A few posts ago you were complaining about calls too. .</div> yeah I said there were some questionable calls, but I gave Dallas credit and said they deserved to win also <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Was Miami a better team? Maybe Wade played better than Dirk but as a team that is debatable. </div> Well last I checked Wade was apart of the team........so yeah Miami > Dallas last year....Posey,Haslem,Walker,Zo,etc. also played big roles eventhough Wade lead the way. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Well what was the point of this thread? You haven't proved Dirk is soft, just not great in the Finals</div> dirk and the mavs were criticized (before Avery got there) of not being able to do it on the big stage, and there are 3 series that stick out in my mind (the rockets, the finals, and this years series) that also back up my point.....
<div class="quote_poster">THE DREAM Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">get over what?...the point I was trying to make is that using that Houston series to validate dirks "clutchness" is foolish, because he really wasn't the reason they won that series.</div> I didn't use that as validation of clutchness just an arbitrary series I decided to mention. Of course he wasn't great in it, but not giving him any credit is foolish; you rank X role player over him which is ridiculous. Again, you must not have seen my edited post but Dirk that year didn't produce Strong MVP numbers that season so I DON'T CARE. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> yeah I said there were some questionable calls, but I gave Dallas credit and said they deserved to win also</div> Good. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> Well last I checked Wade was apart of the team........so yeah Miami > Dallas last year....Posey,Haslem,Walker,Zo,etc. also played big roles eventhough Wade lead the way.</div> That would mean Wade is better than Dirk, not that the Heat are necessarily better had he not gotten all the calls. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post"> dirk and the mavs were criticized (before Avery got there) of not being able to do it on the big stage, and there are 3 series that stick out in my mind (the rockets, the finals, and this years) that also back up my point.....</div> This year's series isn't done, and in that regular season the year that HOU series occurred he had "Steve Nash MVP PER" (hah no offense but it is true) not "strong" mvp PER.
