Click on link http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseacti...endID=213918307 to view the blog and feel free to leave comments....if you're to lazy to do that, then just read it below. _____________________________________________________ 2 Pac Shakur Is The Most Overrated MC Ever It all started last night at a 9 o'clock happy hour with 2 dollar drink specials. Me and some friends got together and shared laughs, stories, etc., then somehow we got on the subject of hip hop music. We were all a lil tipsy so the conversation got loud at times (I really contributed to the loud part), but nearly everyone at the table was in agreement that 2pac was the greatest rapper ever………except me and another dude. Let's all be honest with ourselves here, when he WAS living I can never recall 2 Pac even being referred to as one of the best MCs in the rap game. To be honest the hottest MCs on the west coast in the early and mid 90's were Ice Cube, Snoop, and Dr. Dre. Yes albums like Amerikkka's Most Wanted, Doggy Style, and The Chronic all received critical acclaim from magazines and fans. If you turned on the radio it was more likely that you'd here It Was A Good Day, The Next Episode, and Gin and Juice or even Pharcyde's "Passin Me By"………….Not 2 Pac songs like Trapped, Brenda's Got A Baby, etc. To get to my point the night Mr. Shakur was pronounced dead in a Las Vegas hospital is when all the "best rapper ever" talk came about. Albums like "Strictly 4 My Niggaz" were considered good, but not great. 2 Pac was better known for his roles in films like "Juice", "Above the Rim" and "Poetic Justice." He was charismatic, controversial, a movie star, the ladies adored his bald head, and he was the only straight male in history to ever get away with wearing a nose piercing……………this is why he was popular….not because of his actual skills. Speaking of skills let me get to that point. When looking at a MC from a total package there is no way in hell anyone should say this guy is the best MC ever. When it comes to lyrics, flow, creativity, albums, influence, impact, battle skills, etc. there are plenty of artists who have him beat by eons. One thing I will give 2 Pac is that he did have good mic presence along with a great voice for delivery………….but that's all I'm giving him. I'll go further into breaking down his skills Lyrics – yes he had "heart felt" lyrics, but part of the time they weren't that amazing when it comes to complexity. Seriously I want everyone to think here…how many times did 2 Pac say these following lines in his songs???? "I'm drinkin Crystal, Alize mixed wit weed and Hennesseeeeeeeeeeeey and ridin on my Enemieeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees" "I'm a reaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaal G, everytime I sleep I feel somebody's gonna kiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiil me!!!" "I'm hooooooooooopeless………………..and I'm tryna stay foooooooooocused!!" "I'm losing sanity……………………tryna feed my family" "When they bury meeeeeeee, tell my mama don't worry geeeeeeeeeeeee" AND my favorite "I'm rollin high til I die, because it's all about the west side, I think I'm gonna cry, now ask me why???" This is my favorite one, because it shows Pac's inability to come up with something different so he has to resort rhyming any word that ends with an "I" sound…nevermind that it makes absolutely no sense….you want me to "ask you why"???....why you cry while you're high til you die and say bye bye???? Those words might have come from the deepest and darkest corner of his heart, but they were basic as hell. A lyricist is someone (as stated by another head I respect) who can put a "rhyme within a rhyme." Rakim, GZA, Andre 3000, Ice Cube, Nas, Redman, KRS One, Eminem, Common, Ras Kass, Biggie, Big Pun are all what I'd call "great lyricists." You'll rarely catch them saying the same clich lines over and over, and when listening to their words you can actually not only take it for what it is, but also even break it down a step further. 2 Pac did this occasionally, but not nearly enough to be considered "great" or one of the best lyrically. Flow – pretty good, but not smooth enough to be put in the amazing category. Kool G. Rap, AZ, Biggie, Big Pun, Andre 3000, Nas, Jay Z, etc. all have amazing flows and know how to put words together smoothly. Creativity – I'll give him credit on this. Pac was actually pretty creative, but I still say there are some MCs who I think are better. One of his most creative songs "Me and My Girlfriend" was actually inspired by "I Gave You Power" by Nas (who is better than 2 Pac). Albums – Despite what The Source Magazine tells you 2 Pac has one classic album under his belt, and that is Me Against The World. All Eyez on Me is ruined by the 2nd disc. The first disc jams real hard and I listen to it often, but the 2nd disc has little to no replay value. Early albums like 2Pacalypse Now and the aforementioned Strictly 4 My Niggaz were okay at best, and while Don Killimunati 7 Day Theory was a great albums songs like "Crazy" and "Just Like Daddy" throw it off a little bit. And all of his posthumous material is either mediocre or wack because of wrong producers producing beats that don't fit Pac's style, Guests that 2 Pac would never work with if he were alive, and mediocre throw away verses that explains why Pac never used them on any of his tracks when he was living. Influence – A lot will disagree but when he was living Pac had little to no influence on the rap game. His style was really a combination of Chuck D, Ice Cube, and Scarface with a twist of LL for the ladies so he didn't really father any type of particular style. There weren't any rappers that were trying to be Pac….BUT after his death is when we had "attack of the 2 Pac clones" (Master P, 50 Cent, Ja Rule, etc.). After his death is when his "thugged out" influence was spread throughout the rap game. Battle Skills – "Hit Em Up" like 2 Pac's career was also overrated. While he did throw shots at having sex with Biggie's wife we all know that if Biggie would've retaliated on wax he would've lyrically annihilated 2 Pac. Biggie probably avoided retaliating mainly because of how dangerous of a man Suge Knight was (and is) and I don't blame him for that one. When I used to rap I would always think of MCs who I'd hate to battle on stage or wax. Names like KRS One, Eminem, Big L, LL Cool J, Supernatural, Chino XL, Canibus, Nas, Ice Cube, Common and Redman always came up…but never 2 Pac. His simple rhymes just didn't allow him to destroy someone with his words, because he just wasn't that clever or witty when it came to battling. Emotion – Yes 2 Pac was emotional….we all know that. This is usually the excuse given by Pac fans on why he's the best. The problem with this is that I can name a lot of MCs who are just as (if not more) emotional than Pac, and I can name you songs that are filled with TONS of emotion like "All That I Got is You" by Ghostface, "Retrospect For Life" by Common and Lauryn Hill, "Dead Homiez" by Ice Cube, "Never Seen a Man Cry" by Scarface, "Drunk By Myself" by Nas, "Fight The Power" by Public Enemy, "One Time 4 Ya Mind" by Paris etc. So where does all the love go to these artists for showing their emotions on wax??? Is 2 Pac the only human being capable of displaying emotions through his music??? Better yet have most people who say 2 Pac is the most emotional rapper ever even listened to these songs or artists I listed??? The answer is most of them either haven't or never will, because they've already been trapped in "Lock of Pac" and can't escape. With all of this being said I do want everyone to know that I am a fan of 2 Pac and when I was younger I to fell in the trap of thinking he was the best ever until I got older and expanded my CD collection and vocabulary. This blog might sound like I'm hating, but if you talk to hip hop fans who listen to a lot of music they would agree with me on at least 95% of my points. Tupac Amaru Shakur was talented, entertaining, emotional, creative and someone who I do consider a hip hop legend and a great artist, BUT never ever say that he's the greatest MC ever………..because when looking at the total package he just isn't. Have a good day, Jahari Kavi
"Alize and Crystal blows your mind" ^ Another line that 2Pac frequently uses. Anyways, nice article. I've always like 2Pac's music, but I agree, I never felt he was the greatest of all time by any means.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">You'll rarely catch them saying the same clich? lines over and over, and when listening to their words you can actually not only take it for what it is, but also even break it down a step further.</div> I get that vibe from Ice Cube... and despite him being overrated I still think he is top 5.
Tupac was good, but he isnt top 5 material. Top 5 most influencial? Yeah, but top 5 emcee? No. Tupac's meaningful songs dont match up against the likes of Common, Mos Def, Dead Prez etc. and his "street" songs dont compare to the likes of Nas, Mobb Deep, Kool G. Rap etc.
I used to think he was 1 or 2 with BIG but no way after I broadened my horizons, tbh I haven't listened to him for years unless you include the dave chappelle spoof hehe
I'm not up on today's rap like a lot of the younger guys on this board outside of souther rap that isn't really about lyrics, but back before I got into rock I was really into all sorts of underground and mainstream rap, and from everything I've listened to, I'll agree with the premise of this thread. Andre 3000 is twice the rapper Tupac is imo - DREAM, I saw you're a fan too in that UTM thread, didn't know you liked southern rap. Still, all arguments aside, Tupac's music does bring me back to being younger and listening to his tracks, so he's not leaving my playlist anytime soon.
There's way too many Tupac haters in the world. Take his music for what it is, value it how you want, and stop trying to take down his legacy. It gets old.
I dont think anyone is hating in here, I like Tupac, DREAM likes Tupac, its just this misinformed conception that he is the greatest emcee of all time, when that simply isnt true.
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I get that vibe from Ice Cube...</div> Cube didn't have the same vocab of a GZA, but he was still able to create great lyrics from simple words. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I used to think he was 1 or 2 with BIG but no way after I broadened my horizons, tbh I haven't listened to him for years unless you include the dave chappelle spoof hehe</div> I think that's most peoples problems that say 2 Pac is the best. When debating at the drinking table the other night people were laughing at me for saying Ice T is better than 2 Pac. Although I can see why someone wouldn't agree I don't feel like it should be a laughing matter.. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I'm not up on today's rap like a lot of the younger guys on this board outside of souther rap that isn't really about lyrics, but back before I got into rock I was really into all sorts of underground and mainstream rap, and from everything I've listened to, I'll agree with the premise of this thread. Andre 3000 is twice the rapper Tupac is imo - DREAM, I saw you're a fan too in that UTM thread, didn't know you liked southern rap. </div> I think one of the reasons Andre 3000 only gets love as a part of Outkast and not as an individual MC is because a lot of people think he's "weird" and dresses too funny to be one of the greatest of all time. 2 Pac just represents the hard ,tatoo wearing, urban black male that more people are comfortable with. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">Still, all arguments aside, Tupac's music does bring me back to being younger and listening to his tracks, so he's not leaving my playlist anytime soon.</div> I agree, the man made some great music when he was alive and I've been listening to AEOM Disc 1 the past few weeks. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">There's way too many Tupac haters in the world. Take his music for what it is, value it how you want, and stop trying to take down his legacy. It gets old. </div> I did take it for what it is, and I gave Pac props where I felt he deserved them, but I also constructively criticized areas where I think he was lacking in. <div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I dont think anyone is hating in here, I like Tupac, DREAM likes Tupac, its just this misinformed conception that he is the greatest emcee of all time, when that simply isnt true.</div> Yeah when viewing the total package I'm just not seeing it either.
I agree with you on Tupac being overrated, but you went a little overboard. Most overrated ever? In your UTM answers, you said that a case could be made for him to be considered the a top 5 MC. That requires a hell of a lot of talent, and can't just be written off because the dude got a ridiculous amount of hype after his death. Imagine if a lot of people began to make a case for Nas or Kool G Rap (other MC's you listed at 5) as being the greatest ever. A lot of us wouldn't agree and would believe that they're being overrated, but would we say they were the most overrated of all time? That's a bit too much exaggeration that downplays how good they were, IMO. Honestly, I think Snoop Dogg is the most overrated rapper of all time. I can barely call what he does rapping, because he just spouts the same simple, tired lyrics that either make no sense or get boring fast. Doggystyle is considered a classic, but there are so many crappy songs on it and every album he's released since then has been the same material (but worse than his debut).
<div class="quote_poster">Quote:</div><div class="quote_post">I agree with you on Tupac being overrated, but you went a little overboard. Most overrated ever? In your UTM answers, you said that a case could be made for him to be considered the a top 5 MC. That requires a hell of a lot of talent, and can't just be written off because the dude got a ridiculous amount of hype after his death. Imagine if a lot of people began to make a case for Nas or Kool G Rap (other MC's you listed at 5) as being the greatest ever. A lot of us wouldn't agree and would believe that they're being overrated, but would we say they were the most overrated of all time? That's a bit too much exaggeration that downplays how good they were, IMO.</div> by most overrated ever I mean the most overrated legend, which I think you could make an argument for.
<div class="quote_poster">Chutney Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">Doggystyle is considered a classic, but there are so many crappy songs on it and every album he's released since then has been the same material (but worse than his debut).</div> Whoa whoa whoa, hold on a second, did you just say Doggystyle had alot of crappy songs on it!?
<div class="quote_poster">A.F. Venom Wrote</div><div class="quote_post">lol no it didn't. I can listen to Doggystyle all the way through easy...Snoop did fall off though.</div> Definatley. He fell off not long after Doggystyle. Keeping in mind even Jay-Z bit some of Snoop's lines from Doggystyle.
Man Doggystyle was THAT album growing up..the beats were bangin and snoop was a pretty dope MC back then also.
