<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'><span id="intelliTXT"> </span> </p> <span id="intelliTXT"></div></span></p> </p> </p> LAS VEGAS (AP) - Under pressure in a feisty debate, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton accused her closest rivals Thursday night of slinging mud "right out of the Republican playbook" and leveled her sharpest criticism of the campaign at their records.</p> "People are not attacking me because I'm a woman, they're attacking me because I'm ahead," Clinton said, striving to protect her standing as front-runner in an increasingly competitive nominating campaign.</p> "What the American people are looking for right now is straight answers to tough questions, and that is not what we have seen from Senator Clinton on a host of issues," said Sen. Barack Obama of Illinois in the opening moments of a debate seven weeks before the first contest of the race for the Democratic presidential nomination.</p> "There's nothing personal about this," said former Sen. John Edwards of North Carolina, who joined Obama in bluntly accusing Clinton of forever switching positions on Social Security, driver's licenses for illegal immigrants and other issues, turning aside the suggestion that she was seeking to hide her positions. Long an advocate of universal health care, she said Obama's current proposal leaves millions uncovered and that Edwards did not support health care for all when he first ran for president in 2004.</p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="210" align="left" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td align="center"> <table bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="150" border="1"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"> <tbody> <tr align="center"> <td></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font face="Verdana,Sans-serif" color="#000000" size="1">(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., left, listens as Sen. Barack... <font color="#3366cc">Full Image</font></font></td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> The three-way confrontation at the beginning of a lengthy debate reduced the other Democratic presidential hopefuls on the debate stage to the uncomfortable role of spectator, yet it perfectly captured the race for the party's nomination. Clinton leads in the nationwide polls, but recent surveys in Iowa show she is in a virtual dead heat with Obama and Edwards.</p> For Richardson, Sens. Joseph Biden of Delaware and Chris Dodd of Connecticut and Rep. Dennis Kucinich of Ohio, the opening moments were frustrating - and they repeatedly tried to break in.</p> "Oh, no, don't make me speak," Biden said in mock horror when moderator Wolf Blitzer of CNN called on him roughly 15 minutes into the proceedings.</p> New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, who has campaigned in Nevada more than any other presidential hopeful, took verbal shots at Clinton and her two closest pursuers in the polls.</p> "Let's stop the mudslinging," he said.</p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="210" align="right" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td align="center"> <table bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="150" border="1"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"> <tbody> <tr align="center"> <td></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font face="Verdana,Sans-serif" color="#000000" size="1">(AP) Democratic presidential hopefuls, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., left, and Sen. Barack Obama,... <font color="#3366cc">Full Image</font></font></td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> He said Edwards is engaging in class warfare, Obama was trying to start a generational war and Clinton "with all due respect with her plan on Iraq doesn't end the war. All I want to do is give peace a chance."</p> Richardson was in the minority when the candidates were asked whether human rights could ever trump national security.</p> He said it could; Clinton said it could not, and Dodd said "obviously national security." Obama challenged the question, saying "the concepts are not contradictory."</p> Clinton seemed intent on redeeming what even she conceded was a sub-par performance at the previous debate, turning aside criticism from her rivals and answering questions with practiced ease.</p> Asked whether she was guilty of playing the "gender card" in her drive to become the first female president, she said she had not.</p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="210" align="left" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td align="center"> <table bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="150" border="1"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"> <tbody> <tr align="center"> <td></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font face="Verdana,Sans-serif" color="#000000" size="1">(AP) Democratic presidential hopefuls, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y. and Sen. Barack Obama,... <font color="#3366cc">Full Image</font></font></td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> "I'm not playing the gender card here in Las Vegas," a magnet for gamblers. "I'm trying to play the winning card," she said.</p> Obama was the first to challenge Clinton, saying it took two weeks to "get a clear answer" on whether she supports or opposes issuing driver's licenses for illegal immigrants. "The same is true on Social Security," he said.</p> For the first time in a debate since the campaign began, Clinton swiftly answered in kind. "When it came time to step up and decide whether or not he would support universal health care coverage he chose not to do that," she said of Obama. She added his plan would leave 15 million people without coverage - the population of Iowa and three other early voting states in the nominating campaign.</p> Edwards was next to accuse Clinton of trying to have it both ways - with the war in Iraq, Social Security and defining the scope of President Bush's power to use military force against Iran. "She says she will bring change to Washington while she continues to defend a system that does not work, that is broken, that is rigged, that is corrupt," added the former North Carolina senator.</p> "I've just been personally attacked again," Clinton broke in. "I don't mind taking hits on my record on issues, but when somebody starts throwing mud at least we can hope it's accurate and not right out of the Republican playbook."</p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="210" align="right" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td align="center"> <table bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="150" border="1"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"> <tbody> <tr align="center"> <td></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font face="Verdana,Sans-serif" color="#000000" size="1">(AP) Democratic presidential hopeful, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., left, answers a question as... <font color="#3366cc">Full Image</font></font></td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> The debate unfolded on a stage at the University of Nevada-Las Vegas. The state holds caucuses on Jan. 19 - following Iowa on Jan. 3 and most likely the New Hampshire primary several days later.</p> The focus on Clinton from the debate's opening moments was hardly surprising.</p> The New York senator herself has conceded she turned in a sub-par performance at the last debate, when she stumbled on a question about driver's licenses for illegal immigrants. Her husband, the former president, leapt to her defense in the interim, saying of her rivals: "Those boys have been getting tough on her lately."</p> The setting underscored Nevada's newly prominent role in the nominating process. The state is far more racially diverse than either Iowa or New Hampshire, with a population that is about 22 percent Hispanic and 10 percent black.</p> Democrats in Nevada hoped the focus on their state would prompt candidates to pay closer heed to Western issues like water, grazing and mining rights.</p> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="210" align="left" border="0"> <tbody> <tr> <td align="center"> <table bordercolor="#cbcbcd" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="1" width="150" border="1"> <tbody> <tr> <td> <table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"> <tbody> <tr align="center"> <td></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font face="Verdana,Sans-serif" color="#000000" size="1">(AP) Presidential hopeful Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y is shown at the start of the Democratic... <font color="#3366cc">Full Image</font></font></td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> </td> </tr> </tbody> </table> But it was more than an hour into the two-hour debate before the issue of energy came up.</p> Instead, Clinton drew the first question - and moments later the first barb from Obama.</p> Despite her critics, she said, "I think the American people know where I've stood for 35 years," adding she had been fighting for children, workers, families and universal health care.</p> More than an hour later, Dodd sought to turn the focus back onto Clinton, saying she had changed positions on trade by announcing her support for a deal with Peru at the same time she advocates a "time out" for such agreements.</p> Moments earlier, Clinton gave a careful answer when asked whether she now viewed the North American Free Trade Agreement - a product of her husband's administration - to be a mistake.</p> "NAFTA is a mistake to the extent it did not deliver what we hoped it would," she said.</p> And she fielded another question about NAFTA with a quip. Asked whether she now believes Ross Perot when he argued against NAFTA in a 1993 debate with her husband's vice president, Al Gore, she said: "All I can remember from that is a bunch of charts," a reference to Perot's penchant for presenting information in made-for-television format.</p>
Did anyone else watch the debate last night?</p> Even though I am against all the democratic candidates, I thought it would be interesting to tune into the debate last night since I am willing to bet our next president will unfortunately be a democrat.</p> A few things that stood out. The first was Hilary's comment that people were attacking her not because she was a woman but because she was ahead. That was hilarious and the LV crowd loved it.</p> One of the big reasons I wanted to watch the debate was to listen to them talk about illegal immigration. Its funny to me to listen to Obama try and sugar-coat the issue and make it sound like giving drivers liscences to illegals is actually a good thing.All the candidatesasked straight up (Yes or No)ifthey would support giving drivers liscences to illegals. Obama said yes and tried to make himself sound better by explaining how the issue isn't drivers liscensces. While overall that is defintely not the big issue, the fact still remains the same that he is in favor of drivers liscenses to illegals. Bad idea.</p> One thing is funny to me, some democrats think that they can get elected by supporting illegals getting drivers liscenses. This is one of the stupidest ideas that has ever been brought up. This issue honestly might give the Republicans some hope in the next election just for the sheer fact that some democrats might find this a big enough issue on if Edwards or Obama got the nomination.</p> Meh....anyways Clinton will win the nomination. The real question is who the Republicans will put up against her. I saw some polls last night on Fox News that McCain would do the best against her...</p> </p> </p>
Yea I watched it at times last night.</p> I'll be voting for a republican this time though. Hopefully it's McCain. (or romney)</p>
I have no idea who I'm going to vote for this time. I don't affiliate with any political party and coming into the elections I did like Obama. However, hearing him debate has been a major letdown. I'll probably end up voting Independent this time around.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (shapecity)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I have no idea who I'm going to vote for this time. I don't affiliate with any political party and coming into the elections I did like Obama. However, hearing him debate has been a major letdown. I'll probably end up voting Independent this time around.</p> </p> </div></p> </p> What were the big issues that made you change your mind on Obama? (Just curious)</p>
I don't know who I am voting for just yet, but I know who I am not voting for..</p> Hillary, Edwards, Obama.</p>
This debate reminded me of the old SNL sketch showing all the Democratic candidates banding together to give the Presidency to the Republicans.</p>
I'll be voting for Obama. He's the only candidate to bring a fresh perspective to the race, and that's really what America needs in my opinion. I wouldn't really mind Hillary or any other Democrat besides Joe Biden, but i'll definitely be voting Obama.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shard)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I'll be voting for Obama. He's the only candidate to bring a fresh perspective to the race, and that's really what America needs in my opinion. I wouldn't really mind Hillary or any other Democrat besides Joe Biden, but i'll definitely be voting Obama.</p> </div></p> Cosigned</p> Voting either Republican or Independant if Obama doesn't get the Democratic bid though.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shard)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I'll be voting for Obama. He's the only candidate to bring a fresh perspective to the race, and that's really what America needs in my opinion. I wouldn't really mind Hillary or any other Democrat besides Joe Biden, but i'll definitely be voting Obama.</p> </div></p> I felt he brought a new perspective originally, but he has drifted since the debates began. I think he's lost focus and has turned his campaign into reasons not to vote for Hillary, instead of reasons to vote for him.</p> </p>
I'm terribly anti-partisan when it comes to the Democrats. I cannot stand the party, what it actualy stands for, or many of the evil things it's done in its history. I supposed I could hold my nose and vote for Richardson, if I had to pick one.</p> Only one president in my lifetime (and that goes back to Ike) have I really liked, though I root for all of them. That guy is Reagan. Optimistic, and very libertarian. Times were good, too.</p> I thought Clinton was good, but the scandals and bimbo patrol (enemies list, attacks) and the way women were "abused" by his serrogates.</p> The rest were pretty bad.</p> </p>
Also I don't the Democrats because they pay attention more to the social programs which is actually our taxes and our money. All of this, when theres millions of jobs out there. Anyone that says they can't find a job is pretty much lying, but the Democrats believe them and then give out social programs.</p> I used to live in Nebraska for about 5 years and I've been here in Mass. now for 2 and a half and you could see where the difference is.</p> I voted for Kerry but if I could go back in time I would vote for Bush, so for me now its anyone that comes out of the Republican party will get my vote.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (CelticKing)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Also I don't the Democrats because they pay attention more to the social programs which is actually our taxes and our money. All of this, when theres millions of jobs out there. Anyone that says they can't find a job is pretty much lying, but the Democrats believe them and then give out social programs.</p> I used to live in Nebraska for about 5 years and I've been here in Mass. now for 2 and a half and you could see where the difference is.</p> I voted for Kerry but if I could go back in time I would vote for Bush, so for me now its anyone that comes out of the Republican party will get my vote.</p> </div></p> Meh, I have to agree with you to an extent. There are lazy idiots out there that claim they cant find a job and imo shouldnt really be given a lot of aid; however i think aid should definitely go to the ones who are jobless yet it is not because they cant find one, but rather they cant really get one to live sufficiently(for example-an overweight middle-aged woman with no high school diploma, has kids who are still in school, and husband or other source of income has left her)</p> </p>
To the ones that really can't work, because of known reasons, I say raise the aids even more, because they needed. But to healthy men and women, even without school theres plenty of jobs out there.</p> I'll tell you about my dad. We came to the United States in '99 because there was a war in my country Kosovo. Got here, not speaking a word of english, me, brother and parents. So me and my brother started school, while my parents started working right away. My father was an electrical engineer back in my homeland but when we came here there was no use to that because of the language barrier and also we didn't have any time to spend, since we needed to start life again in a new country. So he got a job at a hospital (in lincoln, ne) working as housekeeping. While doing that, he started going to a class to learn english. After a year he transfered to sterile processing (where they deal with all the things that the surgeons use), and then after 5 months transfered to the surgery as a nurse assistant. (all of this while learning english, supporting me and my brother while we went to school) and dealing with being away from home and the extended family.</p> Fast forward, 2 years ago we moved to here in Mass. since my father transfered to a hospital here and just a year ago he got a new job and now he is the equipment tech in surgery. He deals with all the computers, cameras, and other high tech stuff the surgeons use. And oh yeah, I'm proud of him. </p> </p> I've seen it myself, there are so many jobs out there, as well as companies that find jobs for you. The problem is like you said L, is that so many Americans are lazy and they expect things from the govt and thats where my problem with the democratic party is because they provide for them, while I think the govt should encourage people to get out and work, and support their families and not rely on getting a free ride.</p>
Its nice that Obama is planning on getting rid of the tax cuts for the wealthy. That is one thing that peeved me very much. The rich shouldn't get a cut. I say this as a person who one day plans to be rich.</p> Healthcare, I could care less about. I think I will never be in a situation where I am not getting free healthcare as a result of benefits.</p> His plan for raising the minimum wage more often to keep up with the times is good...not sure if I'll ever be working for the minimum wage, but if I'm working a 2nd job on weekends or whatever when I'm getting started out, a higher minimum wage would be nice.</p> More money for government grants for college education is always good....of course, they have to give me some free money before I say its a good thing.</p> Also, very important, Obama promised to reinstate net neutrality by the end of 2009. Thats a big plus.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shard)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I'll be voting for Obama. He's the only candidate to bring a fresh perspective to the race, and that's really what America needs in my opinion. I wouldn't really mind Hillary or any other Democrat besides Joe Biden, but i'll definitely be voting Obama.</p> </div></p> what do you have against biden?</p> i use www.ontheissues.org to figure out which candidates i like and where i agree with them or not.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (lukewarmplay)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Shard)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I'll be voting for Obama. He's the only candidate to bring a fresh perspective to the race, and that's really what America needs in my opinion. I wouldn't really mind Hillary or any other Democrat besides Joe Biden, but i'll definitely be voting Obama.</p> </div></p> what do you have against biden?</p> i use www.ontheissues.org to figure out which candidates i like and where i agree with them or not.</p> </div></p> I watched the debate replay last night. Biden was awesome. Thanks for the link I'll have to read up on him. Biden actually answered the questions he was asked and didn't go off on a tangent like the rest of canidates.</p> </p>
Biden's real presidential aspirations ended when he got busted for plagarism a few elections ago.</p> He gets plenty of air time on the talk shows, and comes across as a decent enough fellow. If only one could look past the big L branded on his forehead.</p> </p>
I'm not a Biden fan because he seems like too much of an emotional person. It seems like he would make more decisions based on feelings than what actually makes sense. That's my major gripe with Republicans as well, the fact that religion and outdated traditions rule their actions.</p> I agree with you Shape that Obama has strayed somewhat from his original ideas to bashing Hillary, but to me that part is just politics and even Obama is susceptible to it. All that matters to me is that after the elections that if Obama is president he will do the best job. Having followed him since his keynote speech like a lot of people, you'd think that he hasn't just changed completely but is just trying a probably unsuccessful tactic in campaigning.</p> And I couldn't disagree with you more CelticKing. It's easy to say, "get out there and work" but the reality is that a lot of people just can't up and get great jobs to provide for their families. Sure, you can go get a minimum wage job at McDonald's or something but is that going to provide for your children, bills, food, housing, etc? Are we supposed to cast aside the single mothers trying to raise their children because they can't go to college or have enough time and energy for a good paying job? Do they really deserve that? Pardon Democrats for trying to make it a happy place for the entire country not just the middle to upper class.</p>
A few things in response to Shard.</p> First, few people who are providing for families make minimum wage. The vast majority of those jobs are kids making extra bucks while in school, or are entry jobs where people do get raises and move upward. The greatest economic growth experienced by the lower 20% of wage earners was during the Reagan years (era of the end of the "Welfare Queen"), when more people from the bottom 20% moved to the next 20% level. This was true for every one of the 20% quintiles used in macroeconomic analysis, and more true for minorities than for white people.</p> Second, Democrats do not provide programs that truly help people, which is unfortunate. It would be way cheaper and easier to simply have govt. write poor people checks large enough to make them not poor anymore than to implement 150 programs to help uneducated single mothers get by.</p> Third, these programs are a trap and we really ought to figure out how to do it better. The programs put limits on people saving money or acquiring assets, so the people don't. Saving money and acquiring assets is how you get out of poverty!</p> Fourth, a little trivia question: Who was the first Democrat to propose universal health care? When you know the answer, you'll understand what the phrase "all talk and no action" means.</p> Fifth, govt. seems to do very few things well. Building a strong military is one, and providing infrastructure is another. By infrastructure, I mean highways, mail system, patent office, court system, and so on. Things that do not care if you're rich or poor, or the color of your skin. The two best (and I suggest the only working ones) social programs instituted by government are the GI Bill (higher education) and VHA (loans to buy homes). Both of these are vouchers, with few (if any) strings attached.</p> Sixth, the social programs (especially entitlements) do not change with the growth and needs of society, and end up being a huge financial liability. People talk about the national debt being a big deal at $9B, but the liabilities to pay off those social programs total $75B or more - enough to really bankrupt us.</p> Seventh, I'm confused as to who are the conservatives. When you talk about addressing the poor performance of social programs like public education or social security, the conservatives (i.e. Democrats) oppose change. Something wrong with that picture!</p> </p>
