<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (L)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Collins isour main stopperto Shaq yet he still got his second highest point total of the season.</p> </div></p> </p> Not rying to sound witty or like an ass, but exactly how many minutes did Collins play?</p> </p> Was he on Shaq for most of the game or was it the starter Magloire?</p> </p> (I ask cuz i did not see the entire game)</p> </p> </div></p> Magloire was on him the first half pretty much and IMO, kept him pretty much in check while Collins seem to get most of the ride in the second half where I believe Shaq really hurt us.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Collins isour main stopperto Shaq yet he still got his second highest point total of the season.</p> </div></p> </p> Universe, I think you're a good guy, and I find amny of your posts insightful. However, I have a problem with posts like that, because it implies that Collins is at fault--or at least did nothing beneficial--and it is based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. If you took ten minutes to look at the game log, you'd see that, during the roughly seven minutes that Collins was in the game at the same time as Shaq, Shaq was 1-3 from the field, with two rebounds (one offensive). He was also 3-4 from the line--one trip due to a Collins foul and one to a Sean Williams foul. So, when Collins was NOT in the game, Shaq was 5-9 in 18 minutes.</p> You'd also see that Mourning completely dominated when Magloire was in the game. I'll let you add that up.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dumpy)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Collins isour main stopperto Shaq yet he still got his second highest point total of the season.</p> </div></p> </p> Universe, I think you're a good guy, and I find amny of your posts insightful. However, I have a problem with posts like that, because it implies that Collins is at fault--or at least did nothing beneficial--and it is based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. If you took ten minutes to look at the game log, you'd see that, during the roughly seven minutes that Collins was in the game at the same time as Shaq, Shaq was 1-3 from the field, with two rebounds (one offensive). He was also 3-4 from the line--one trip due to a Collins foul and one to a Sean Williams foul. So, when Collins was NOT in the game, Shaq was 5-9 in 18 minutes.</p> You'd also see that Mourning completely dominated when Magloire was in the game. I'll let you add that up.</p> </p> </div></p> Oh by no means am I putting the blame on Collins fully. Turnovers crushed us like a bug. Also not being able to gaurd three point land allowing a rookie and a 40 year old wash up expose us really did us in. Collins more or less hurts himself due to the lack of scoring which is why he cannot get playing time over a rookie because the rookie is finding his way.</p> You also got to see those free throws assome of the blame, no?That's what really frustrates me.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dumpy)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Collins isour main stopperto Shaq yet he still got his second highest point total of the season.</p> </div></p> </p> Universe, I think you're a good guy, and I find amny of your posts insightful. However, I have a problem with posts like that, because it implies that Collins is at fault--or at least did nothing beneficial--and it is based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever. If you took ten minutes to look at the game log, you'd see that, during the roughly seven minutes that Collins was in the game at the same time as Shaq, Shaq was 1-3 from the field, with two rebounds (one offensive). He was also 3-4 from the line--one trip due to a Collins foul and one to a Sean Williams foul. So, when Collins was NOT in the game, Shaq was 5-9 in 18 minutes.</p> You'd also see that Mourning completely dominated when Magloire was in the game. I'll let you add that up.</p> </p> </div></p> Oh by no means am I putting the blame on Collins fully. Turnovers crushed us like a bug. Also not being able to gaurd three point land allowing a rookie and a 40 year old wash up expose us really did us in. Collins more or less hurts himself due to the lack of scoring which is why he cannot get playing time over a rookie because the rookie is finding his way.</p> You also got to see those free throws assome of the blame, no?That's what really frustrates me.</p> </div></p> I think the difference here is that I don't see Collins and Sean as mutually exclusive. If you take it as a given that Collins will play 15 minutes a game, who do you want on the court with him? Kidd, Carter, RJ, Sean, and Collins!</p>
This board is the same as the other. People are falling over themselves to blame Collins no matter what has really happened during the game.</p> Either way, the point is that the horrible officiating is what ultimately cost the Nets the game, not RJ's missed layup.</p>
The truth is I never see Collins's merits are much bigger than his flaws and leads us to win the games.</p> In this season, his crucial turnovers cost us some games.</p>
I prefer see</p> Kidd, Carter, RJ, Sean, Krstic or Kidd, Carter, RJ, Sean, Magloire.</p> You want to see Collins ? Of course, but he will come from the bench.</p> Magloire could handle Shaq, too. Magloire is a underrated low-post defender.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (furnace)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> This board is the same as the other. People are falling over themselves to blame Collins no matter what has really happened during the game.</p> Either way, the point is that the horrible officiating is what ultimately cost the Nets the game, not RJ's missed layup.</p> </div></p> </p> </p> The nets shot more FTs then the Heat!!! You blame the refs for eveything.</p>
Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool blame the referees for their team's own faults and inabilities.</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (purplehaze89)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool blame the referees for their team's own faults and inabilities.</p> </div></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool think that the team they root for is "theirs."</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (purplehaze89)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool blame the referees for their team's own faults and inabilities.</p> </div></p> </p> I said no such thing about the loss to the Hornets. I only point out the one sided refereeing when it is so, and I provide examples. Just cuz the Nets shot more free throw attempts doesn't mean the Heat weren't fouling them even more.
Furnace, the players themselves aren't even arguing the final play. Why are you? Look at that final possession, Mourning hardly touched RJ.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dumpy)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool think that the team they root for is "theirs."</p> </p> </div></p> The social psychologist would disagree with you. Thats normal, and anticipated, human behavior.</p> </p>
I find understanding in modern psychology. It's a matter of categorizing-and-comparison (social identity theory). By identifying as a fan of the team you might identify as part of "Nets basketball" and there for live vicariously to some extent. It's really not that uncommon to hear someone talk about how "we're doing great" or "we suck." And refer to other teams as "they;" specifically the fans as "you guys are bad." They're not playing the game and therefore its a logical fallacy, but I didn't say it was correct; just expected.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> I find understanding in modern psychology. It's a matter of categorizing-and-comparison (social identity theory). By identifying as a fan of the team you might identify as part of "Nets basketball" and there for live vicariously to some extent. It's really not that uncommon to hear someone talk about how "we're doing great" or "we suck." And refer to other teams as "they;" specifically the fans as "you guys are bad." They're not playing the game and therefore its a logical fallacy, but I didn't say it was correct; just expected.</p> </div></p> </p> Too many three-dollar words to be a fool, and you don't seem paranoid. Delusional, then.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Dumpy)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (purplehaze89)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool blame the referees for their team's own faults and inabilities.</p> </div></p> Only the paranoid, the delusional and the fool think that the team they root for is "theirs."</p> </p> </div></p> </p> Completely untrue, and I don't see why you're out to get us...</p>
Collins played great D on Shaq in the 4th. Shaq scored one field goal on which he laid the ball in while using his off hand on JCs shoulder for leverage. I think it is an embarassment that an obvious offensive foul like that was not called (only the Globetrotters should get that one). It was obvious from the furthest seat in the arena (I confirmed what I saw on the replay the next morning). I don't blame the refs for the loss though, the Nets made more mistakes than the refs. p.s. I thought the officiating for the Orlando game was up there among the worst I have ever seen....again, not the refs fault the Nets lost. The Boston game was bad too, I think the refs actually stopped calling fouls against the Celtics because the Nets couldn't hit a free throw anyway. That punk hit by Posey on Armstrong should have been a flagrant accompanied by a fine. I guess I'm saying, in comparison, the Heat game was well officiated.</p>
