<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'> Old habits are hard to break. But agreed - enough of the PP iso. Not necessary anymore, or as effect as other options. Like moving the damn ball.</p> Did I mention we are 11-1? </p></div>ThanksDanny?Maybe?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (aquaitious)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Old habits are hard to break. But agreed - enough of the PP iso. Not necessary anymore, or as effect as other options. Like moving the damn ball.</p> Did I mention we are 11-1? </p> </div> ThanksDanny?Maybe?</div></p> </p> YES!!! Thanks danny for gettin rid of that garbage team that you put together!!!! they are playin well out there in minny............................</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (aquaitious)</div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Old habits are hard to break. But agreed - enough of the PP iso. Not necessary anymore, or as effect as other options. Like moving the damn ball.</p> Did I mention we are 11-1? </p> </div> ThanksDanny?Maybe?</div></p> </p> YES!!! Thanks danny for gettin rid of that garbage team that you put together!!!! they are playin well out there in minny............................</p> </div></p> If that "garbage" brings us the best shot at Gold in about 20 years, was it ever really garbage?</p> </p>
o yes...its still garbage....we are just lucky to have kevin mchale who was willing to take our garbage to give us a chance at the Gold</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'> o yes...its still garbage....we are just lucky to have kevin mchale who was willing to take our garbage to give us a chance at the Gold</p></div> Idunno#1AWF,you'regivingDannytoolittlecredit.Afterall,heDIDmadetwochampionshipteamsinDetroitandtheHeat!</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Big Al is certainly not garbage.</p> </div></p> </p> 1 for 7 does not a good gm make...</p> </p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (aquaitious)</div><div class='quotemain'>Idunno#1AWF,you'regivingDannytoolittlecredit.Afterall,heDIDmadetwochampionshipteamsinDetroitandtheHeat!</div></p> this is true...he is partly responsible for mah main man getting a ring so i should lighten up on him huh</p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> 1 for 7 does not a good gm make...</p> </div></p> You don't like Rondo - for example? Ainge has done a hell of a lot more good than bring in one good player.</p> this debate will never end. You will not give Ainge credit. I think - especially based on the absolute junk he inherited - that Ainge has done an amazing job - including bringing in KG and Allen while keeping Pierce.</p> You are a huge fan of Walker, I think he's an (in his own mind) overhyped slug.</p> But I still like you. For what it's worth. </p> </p> </p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> 1 for 7 does not a good gm make...</p> </div></p> You don't like Rondo - for example? Ainge has done a hell of a lot more good than bring in one good player.</p> this debate will never end. You will not give Ainge credit. I think - especially based on the absolute junk he inherited - that Ainge has done an amazing job - including bringing in KG and Allen while keeping Pierce.</p> You are a huge fan of Walker, I think he's an (in his own mind) overhyped slug.</p> But I still like you. For what it's worth. </p> </p> </p> </div></p> </p> </p> ok ok...2 for 7...ill give him credit for that haha...but seriously,yes he managed to get pieces to put together to get garnett and allen, credit for that...how did he get those pieces though? he puta terrible product on the floor and got us lottery picks for 5 years that ended up turning into garnett and allen. At the expense of the teams success for 5 years, ainge managed to finally put together a great team...i believe you or I cw could have done the same job as what he did, which is why i dont give him credit...its not very hard to put out a terrible team and pile up draft picks...anyone could have done his job</p> we'll always agree to disagree on this one but the discussion never gets old for me and i hope it doesnt for you as well</p> and btw i think "overhyped slug" is a little harsh for a 3 time nba all star dont you think? </p>
</p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> ok ok...2 for 7...ill give him credit for that haha...but seriously,yes he managed to get pieces to put together to get garnett and allen, credit for that...how did he get those pieces though? he puta terrible product on the floor and got us lottery picks for 5 years that ended up turning into garnett and allen. At the expense of the teams success for 5 years, ainge managed to finally put together a great team...i believe you or I cw could have done the same job as what he did, which is why i dont give him credit...its not very hard to put out a terrible team and pile up draft picks...anyone could have done his job</p> </div></p> You give him even less credit than I thought. Anyone could of put together the best team the Celtics have seen in 20 years? Why don't other teams in that case do it? And why did it take 20 years? You make it sound much more simple than it was, or is.</p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'>we'll always agree to disagree on this one but the discussion never gets old for me and i hope it doesnt for you as well</div></p> Agreed.</p> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (#1AntoineWalkerFan)</div><div class='quotemain'>and btw i think "overhyped slug" is a little harsh for a 3 time nba all star dont you think? </p> </div></p> no, I was trying to be nice. </p> </p> </p>
I'm sorry Causeway, but did you just call Antoine Walker overhyped? Hehe, I never thought I'd see the day.</p> As for Danny's drafts, I think he has done a great job. It's not just Al Jefferson. Sure, that was his big prize, but he has made the most of pretty much every draft pick. Obviously Marcus Banks didn't pan out, but we traded two guys who are without NBA contracts right now (Troy Bell and Dahntay Jones) for Banks and Perk. Banks is a bust, but we still won that deal. Then he got Big Al at 15, Delonte at 24, and TA at 25 in the same draft. All three of those picks were excellent value. In 2005, we got Gerald Green at 18 and Gomes at 50. Green hasn't panned out, but it's pretty safe to say that aboutt 25-27 of 30 GM's would have taken Green at 18 without hesitating. Obviously, Gomes at 50 was a huge steal. In 06, he traded the 7th pick but brought back Theo's contract (huge component to us getting KG) and ended up with Rajon Rondo. I'd say that worked out beautifully in the long run, even though we could have kept the pick and gotten a guy like Rudy Gay or Brandon Roy.</p> The only real draft mistake for Danny, in my opinion, was Marcus Banks.</p>
Nice post <span class="bigusername"><span class="CM">CelticBalla32</span></span>! Fully agree. Except of course on Walker. What I mean by over-hyped was - when he was in Boston, with thanks to Obie, people thought he was much more of the player than he really was (or is). If someone early on had told him to simply work on grabbing boards, getting garbage points, and tossing a quick outlet pass - he would of been much more valuable. Instead he was treated like Magic Johnson, and he was not even close. Overhyped.</p>
are we forgetting that he took over an Eastern Conference Finals team and turned them into a team who couldnt win 25 games??? I dont care how the team looked on paper with kenny anderson erick stricland rodney rodgers etc...the team he took over was greater than the sum of its parts...and he didnt even give them a chance to see where they could go...he assumed they hit their cieling and dismatled them...its definitely not only me...anyone you ask who follows bball would have told you that danny turned the c's into a train wreckbefore this year...</p> </p> and we are also forgetting that ainge offere pierce and the number 5 pick for oden before the draft...yea, that was smart...if portland accepted do you realize just how bad of a team we'd have now...or even if we got one of the top 2 picks...we'd be terrible still...ainge had a lucky leprachaun up his ass and the best thing to ever happen to him was getting the number 5 pick and not one of the top 2</p>
We've ben over this many many times. That ECF team had not only peaked, but over-achieved. It had no shot at a title, which is all the Celtics should care about. We have never been, and hopefully never will be, a team that hangs ECF banners in the rafters. So we had little choice with the slop that we had but to take a few step back. Seems like it paid off. I would not trade this tea for that ECF team.</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'> We've ben over this many many times. That ECF team had not only peaked, but over-achieved. It had no shot at a title, which is all the Celtics should care about. We have never been, and hopefully never will be, a team that hangs ECF banners in the rafters. So we had little choice with the slop that we had but to take a few step back. Seems like it paid off. I would not trade this tea for that ECF team.</p></div> Yes,theECFteam"peakedandover-achived,"butwhynotaddtothat?We'velostkeyplayersthatyearinErickStrickland,RodneyRogersandKennyAndersontoaddVinnyfreakingBaker.Nooneissaying"tradethisyearsteamtothatteam,"butpeoplearepissedoffthatwe'veprettymuchwasted four years, did not keep the team together and completely changed directions a good ten times along the way to getting where we are.So please stop repeating this bullshit of "the team overachieved, and it peaked" when the team lost about 30-40% of the key parts of the team that went to the ECF.</p>
i hate the "peaked" arguement...how is anyone to know if that team peaked??? ainge blew them up as soon as he got there!!! its not like they made it to the ecf 4 straight years and couldnt go any further...they made it once and werent given a chance to make it again! noone will ever know if they peaked</p>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Causeway)</div><div class='quotemain'></p> Yes,theECFteam"peakedandover-achived,"butwhynotaddtothat?We'velostkeyplayersthatyearinErickStrickland,RodneyRogersandKennyAndersontoaddVinnyfreakingBaker. Nooneissaying"tradethisyearsteamtothatteam,"butpeoplearepissedoffthatwe'veprettymuchwasted four years, did not keep the team together and completely changed directions a good ten times along the way to getting where we are. So please stop repeating this bullshit of "the team overachieved, and it peaked" when the team lost about 30-40% of the key parts of the team that went to the ECF.</p> </div></p> Where are Eric Strickland, Rodney Rodgers and Kenny Anderson today? Most of that team is not even in the NBA anymore, and if they are, not doing too much.</p> I don't see it as a "waste of 4 years" when the end result is KG, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce etc - it's been 20 years since we had a team like this. If it took "4 wasted years" to get there, fine by me.</p> And no, it's not bullshit. Eric Strickland, Rodney Rodgers, Kenny Anderson...no big loss in my book. We overachieved and peaked in a weak East. It was not popular to rip it down and rebuild, but it was the right thing to do - and effective.</p> </p> </p>
alright....i cant see where you are coming from with that arguement even though i might not agree...but defend ur boy on the 2nd part of my previous post...</p> and we are also forgetting that ainge offere pierce and the number 5 pick for oden before the draft...yea, that was smart...if portland accepted do you realize just how bad of a team we'd have now...or even if we got one of the top 2 picks...we'd be terrible still...ainge had a lucky leprachaun up his ass and the best thing to ever happen to him was getting the number 5 pick and not one of the top 2</p> wed have a rotation of telfair, gerald, gomes, al and perk with an injured oden on the bench and a long gone pierce for expirings and draft picks...ainge is a terrible decision maker...sure he may have drfted well but his trades are god awful</p> </p>
I have to side with Causeway on this one. Because we're Boston fans and we're dying for a competitive team, we don't tolerate rebuilding and youth. If Ainge had done this with a smaller-market team like Atlanta - with the same roster - he wouldn't have gotten as much heat for it as he did in Boston. This city demands excellence, and if you don't bring that from day one, you're verbally shafted. A lot of people just don't understand, or want to understand, that everything is a process. Things take time to get done. We weren't going to somehow add a big piece of the puzzle to Pierce, Antoine, and 6 washed up role players, and become contenders. We didn't have the trading chips, player interest, or financial flexibility to do so.</p> Going through a rebuilding process for 4 years was painful in many ways, but it got us to the exact point we wanted to be at all along. I agree with Patrick Gilroy wholeheartedly when he says that Danny Ainge's biggest mistake was not trading Antoine Walker and blowing it up - it was announcing the fact that he was going to rebuild during a playoff series.</p> Has Danny made questionable decisions throughout his tenure? Sure, but in the end, we're in the position we wanted to be in. Danny's plan looked to be undefined for so many years. He was trying to rebuild and put together a playoff team at the same time. That pissed me off, and I never understood why he did that. Well, in the end, he did exactly what he said he was going to do - gather young assets through the draft, build them up, then cash them in for veterans to put around Pierce in order to contend. That happened, and here we are, 11-2 and talking about the possibility of playing in May/June.</p>
[quote name='Causeway'] Where are Eric Strickland, Rodney Rodgers and Kenny Anderson today? Most of that team is not even in the NBA anymore, and if they are, not doing too much.[/QUOTE]You'vecompletelymissedthepointandarearguinigwith"Wherearetheseplayersnow?"Great,where'sLarryBirdnow?WherewillRayAllen,PaulPierceandKGbefiveyearsfromnow?Heck,maybeweshouldnotevenplaythegameofbasketballandjustkeepasking"wherearetheseplayersnow?"But for the hell of it, if you must know:Rodney Rogers went to the finalsandtheECFsemi-finals the two years after he left the Celtics, with the Nets.Postingnumbersof7pointsand4rebounds,and8pointsand4.4rebounds,respectively,injust20minutesofplay.Thefollowingyear,ErickStricklandposted6.5pts,3assistsand2reboundsinjust18minutesofplay. Kenny Anderson did roughly the same the next two season.Were they all-stars? Definetely not, were they good role-players? You betcha!Yet, that was not my point,farfromit.I understand that Danny was not here when we lost Rogers, Strickland and Anderson (and I hated Anderson, by the way) and we had Gaston as our owner, the whole freaking point was: There is no evidence to support that the team "had peaked" and would not have achieved the same as they did if they had added talent.They weren'tabletokeep significant players and lost to a MUCH superior New Jersey Net team in 03/04. </p> [quote name='Causeway']I don't see it as a "waste of 4 years" when the end result is KG, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce etc - it's been 20 years since we had a team like this. If it took "4 wasted years" to get there, fine by me.[/QUOTE]So this was the plan all along? Get a very young team and trade them all to get KG and Ray Allen in the 2007/08 season. Great job Danny, thanks! Great decision on not to "win now" and "rebuild" and then four years later we go back to "win now" mode. That's a great, great plan. I wish I could predict the future like this also.</p> [quote name='Causeway']And no, it's not bullshit. Eric Strickland, Rodney Rodgers, Kenny Anderson...no big loss in my book. We overachieved and peaked in a weak East.[/QUOTE]How do you "overachieve" in a "weak conference?" How does that make sense? We had two all-stars that year (even ifyou believe we only had one, the choaches voted Antoine in) that carried this team on their shoulders.Asfaras"peaked"pleaseshowmehowtheydidso.BecauseI'dreallylovetoseesomefactsofthat.[quote name='Causeway']It was not popular to rip it down and rebuild, but it was the right thing to do - and effective.</p>[/QUOTE] The Twolves do have a bright future ahead of them.</p>
