I think the best-case scenario for Boone is Anderson Varajeo. Athletic enough, noted for defense and hustle, grim haircut, and he can't create for himself on offense; he relies on put-backs, and assisted lay ups.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> If you put today's Boone on those Nets teams, he wouldn't put up those numbers either. Likewise, if you put that Twin on this Nets team, he would be putting up better numbers. When Twin had his mobility, he didn't need to any more than be the 5th wheel and keep the ball moving. Boone would have killed the offense on those teams and his defensive weaknesses would have hurt the team too. In the playoffs in May of 2003, Twin had a double double against Ben Wallace
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (GMJigga @ Dec 21 2007, 02:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think the best-case scenario for Boone is Anderson Varajeo. Athletic enough, noted for defense and hustle, grim haircut, and he can't create for himself on offense; he relies on put-backs, and assisted lay ups.</div> Andy without the defense or the hands. That is another good comparison
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 02:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> If you put today's Boone on those Nets teams, he wouldn't put up those numbers either. Likewise, if you put that Twin on this Nets team, he would be putting up better numbers. When Twin had his mobility, he didn't need to any more than be the 5th wheel and keep the ball moving. Boone would have killed the offense on those teams and his defensive weaknesses would have hurt the team too. In the playoffs in May of 2003, Twin had a double double against Ben Wallace </div> Look right now Boone is 1000 times better than Collins. Its simple really.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> Some of this is true, but some is hyperbole. you probably don't know that, in Collins' first season, he started 9 games--in those nine games, he averaged 9.1 points in 28 minutes, on 48% FG shooting and 76% FT%, 6.9 rebounds, 2.6 assists, nearly a block and a steal a game, and less than one TO per game. Over his first four seasons, as a starter, he averaged about 6.5 points, 5.5 rebounds (about a third of them on the offensive end), 73% FT%, 1.5 assists, and nearly a block and steal per game in about 28 minutes. Boone will never be able to match that FT% or have the passing ability Collins exhibited back then, but Boone can do other things. Collins had a number of double-doubles back then--just check the game logs. That's not to say that I don't agree about Boone--I strenuously argued that the nets should draft him as a future Collins replacement.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 02:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> If you put today's Boone on those Nets teams, he wouldn't put up those numbers either. Likewise, if you put that Twin on this Nets team, he would be putting up better numbers. When Twin had his mobility, he didn't need to any more than be the 5th wheel and keep the ball moving. Boone would have killed the offense on those teams and his defensive weaknesses would have hurt the team too. In the playoffs in May of 2003, Twin had a double double against Ben Wallace </div> I disagree...our offense currently stifles the ability of our frontcourt scoring as the rely on the big men for screens in the high post and general pick and roll. In the Byron Scott years the big men had to run the floor and saw more touches within 5 feet of the basket allowing a quick post up. With Boone's superior athleticism he would have more oppurtunities off the break. Also remember Boone has to help defensively more than Collins did during those years...Kerry Kittles and Kenyon Martin were far superior defenders to Vince and Allen plus Kidd was quicker therefore Collins didn't have as much responsibility in the paint as Boone currently does defensively...if put on that team he would easily grab 2-3 more rebounds defensively. Kmart made it easier on Collins...everyone forgets that...Boone has no help in the frontcourt defensively and is putting up better numbers than Collins...Boone has a lot of potential and honestly I've heard just way to many arguments against that potential that carry no weight. It's my opinion, you have yours only time will tell if I'm right or you are.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 02:25 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> If you put today's Boone on those Nets teams, he wouldn't put up those numbers either. Likewise, if you put that Twin on this Nets team, he would be putting up better numbers. When Twin had his mobility, he didn't need to any more than be the 5th wheel and keep the ball moving. Boone would have killed the offense on those teams and his defensive weaknesses would have hurt the team too. In the playoffs in May of 2003, Twin had a double double against Ben Wallace </div> I disagree...our offense currently stifles the ability of our frontcourt scoring as the rely on the big men for screens in the high post and general pick and roll. In the Byron Scott years the big men had to run the floor and saw more touches within 5 feet of the basket allowing a quick post up. With Boone's superior athleticism he would have more oppurtunities off the break. Also remember Boone has to help defensively more than Collins did during those years...Kerry Kittles and Kenyon Martin were far superior defenders to Vince and Allen plus Kidd was quicker therefore Collins didn't have as much responsibility in the paint as Boone currently does defensively...if put on that team he would easily grab 2-3 more rebounds defensively. Kmart made it easier on Collins...everyone forgets that...Boone has no help in the frontcourt defensively and is putting up better numbers than Collins...Boone has a lot of potential and honestly I've heard just way to many arguments against that potential that carry no weight. It's my opinion, you have yours only time will tell if I'm right or you are. </div> 100% agree. Also Boone will be a very good starter for the nets he is getting better and doing it quicker than I thought he would.
Josh_Boone, I know you like Boone but you are overrating him so much. I mean, he has some skill but he isn't going to be a top Nets player. And if he is, unless he scores 20 and 9 then you need someone else. He has a lot of work to do and right now he defense is still not good enough to be a great starter.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Master Shake @ Dec 21 2007, 03:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Josh_Boone, I know you like Boone but you are overrating him so much. I mean, he has some skill but he isn't going to be a top Nets player. And if he is, unless he scores 20 and 9 then you need someone else. He has a lot of work to do and right now he defense is still not good enough to be a great starter.</div> Josh will be fine, I am not overrating him I know his skill set and what he can do. He will be a good starter for this team to come. Josh and Swat are the bigs of the future for this team. Wait you are the one who said I was Josh Boone, i know you know.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I disagree...our offense currently stifles the ability of our frontcourt scoring as the rely on the big men for screens in the high post and general pick and roll.</div> Allen and Krstic are the only Nets big men that have any semblence of offensive ability. Sean and Boone have to be spoonfed in order to score. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>In the Byron Scott years the big men had to run the floor and saw more touches within 5 feet of the basket allowing a quick post up. With Boone's superior athleticism he would have more oppurtunities off the break. Also remember Boone has to help defensively more than Collins did during those years...Kerry Kittles and Kenyon Martin were far superior defenders to Vince and Allen plus Kidd was quicker therefore Collins didn't have as much responsibility in the paint as Boone currently does defensively...if put on that team he would easily grab 2-3 more rebounds defensively.</div> Boone can't hold a candle to Deke and Deke only averaged 7 RPG in November of 2002. Twin averaged 5 RPG as a starter that season. Your suggestion that Boone could reach Deke numbers is laughable. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Kmart made it easier on Collins...everyone forgets that...Boone has no help in the frontcourt defensively and is putting up better numbers than Collins...Boone has a lot of potential and honestly I've heard just way to many arguments against that potential that carry no weight. It's my opinion, you have yours only time will tell if I'm right or you are.</div> Boone is the one that is no help on defense. Sean is a significantly better defender than Boone.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan)</div><div class='quotemain'>Boone can't hold a candle to Deke and Deke only averaged 7 RPG in November of 2002. Twin averaged 5 RPG as a starter that season. Your suggestion that Boone could reach Deke numbers is laughable.</div> Oh man...how badly I wish Deke could've worked out for us. <div><object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/XAFSD2RW3yU&"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/XAFSD2RW3yU&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350" /></embed></object></div> *sigh*
OK.... 1) I was referring to a fast break offense which I think better suits the dynamic of this team...your right Boone is not as good offensively as Malik or Nenad because frankly they have good jump shots...Boone still needs to develop his offense but there is no reason to believe a second year player who is just starting to get minutes can't get better. It mayt take time but Boone does have the potential to develop offensively. 2) Overall...no Boone can't hold a candle to Deke...Deke had an amazing career and for a time was one of the best centers in the league...nobody knows how good Josh Boone can become over time but yes it's highly unlikely he will ever be the player Deke was... HOWEVER...DEKE SUCKED THAT YEAR! Everyone thought getting Zeke would put us over the top but the reality was that he didn't fit our style of play and he was in decline from the player he was. The argument is Boone now to Zeke at that moment...not overall. your argument is laughable. you CANNOT compare a player in his second year to a player's whole career...maybe to a season but not a career. 3)Yeah Sean block shots, yeah Sean is quicker but currently against a Center Josh Boone is a better defender...sean is wayyyy tp light to defend a big body like Shaq but Boone was able to body Shaq up and box him out consistently...
I'm not comparing Boone to Deke's entire career, rather, I am comparing him to the 2002-2003 Deke. Deke only appeared to suck because he was consistently misused by Scott and he had trouble adapting to the Princeton offense. There were times where Kenyon would go over and shove Deke into place.
Collins is just not good enough to do much at that 4 position hes older and doesn't seem to have much energy on the floor, as boone is emerging to more of a hustle player collins is just running back and forurth as the money piles up but that wont be the case for long
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> Five games is not much of a streak, especially considering the teams they have been playing - Heat, Kings, Knicks, Cavs, Clippers - are all sub .500. In addition, his numbers have been inconsistent 11/8, 5/4, 10/6, 15/8, and 7/14 respectively. Similarly to Collins, most of Boone's points are spoon fed from Jason Kidd passes or, unlike Collins, from put backs dunks. Boone is a solid defender, but is too thin and is able to be backed up easily. Collins was always a good defender with an NBA-ready body, so he can endure contact better than Boone. Plus his jumper was always solid, whereas Boone's range is from five feet in. Adding credence to this is his awful free throw percentage: 22%. That's totally unacceptable for any basketball player on any level. And coincidentally, Collins is shooting virtually the same percentage right now at the nadir of his career. Both of them are different players with different skills, but their careers could be similar in terms of stats and overall impact.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Mr. J @ Dec 21 2007, 03:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 02:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I watched all the 2001 and 2002 games with Twin and I know he never put up a 5 game stretch were he averaged 9.6 points and 8 rebounds a game...this is the 1st real opportunity Boone has gotten and he's taking advantage. Collins may be the most overrated player in NBA history. Too say his athleticism was ever anywhere comparable to Boone's is an insult. Even out of College Collin's weakness was his athleticism and laterall quickness which happen to be 2 of Josh Boone's better attributes...the knock on Boone was that he was 6'10 and might be too small to play center and that he lacks a faceup offensive game. Bottom line Twin has only gotten worse as time has passed and currently Josh Boone is a major upgrade.</div> Five games is not much of a streak, especially considering the teams they have been playing - Heat, Kings, Knicks, Cavs, Clippers - are all sub .500. In addition, his numbers have been inconsistent 11/8, 5/4, 10/6, 15/8, and 7/14 respectively. Similarly to Collins, most of Boone's points are spoon fed from Jason Kidd passes or, unlike Collins, from put backs dunks. Boone is a solid defender, but is too thin and is able to be backed up easily. Collins was always a good defender with an NBA-ready body, so he can endure contact better than Boone. Plus his jumper was always solid, whereas Boone's range is from five feet in. Adding credence to this is his awful free throw percentage: 22%. That's totally unacceptable for any basketball player on any level. And coincidentally, Collins is shooting virtually the same percentage right now at the nadir of his career. Both of them are different players with different skills, but their careers could be similar in terms of stats and overall impact. </div> Unfortunately I can't take the whole season because the numbers are schewed by Boone's inconsistent minutes earlier this year as some of his 3 and 4 min nights don't farely show his abilities...I will however bump this thread in 15 games when Boone proves my point. As for saying Boone backs down to easily...well he showed toughness last night and honestly the frontcourts in the NBA are lighter than ever. Also...when has Jason Collin's jumper ever been solid...I mean yeah there's been a few games where it fell but usually he bricked like a mason.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 03:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm not comparing Boone to Deke's entire career, rather, I am comparing him to the 2002-2003 Deke. Deke only appeared to suck because he was consistently misused by Scott and he had trouble adapting to the Princeton offense. There were times where Kenyon would go over and shove Deke into place.</div> Ok...I get what your saying on that but my argument is that Josh Boone's game was better suited for that offense anyway and therefore his numbers would in fact be even better and therefore he could feasibly average 8 rebounds a night.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (jloc857 @ Dec 21 2007, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 03:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I'm not comparing Boone to Deke's entire career, rather, I am comparing him to the 2002-2003 Deke. Deke only appeared to suck because he was consistently misused by Scott and he had trouble adapting to the Princeton offense. There were times where Kenyon would go over and shove Deke into place.</div> Ok...I get what your saying on that but my argument is that Josh Boone's game was better suited for that offense anyway and therefore his numbers would in fact be even better and therefore he could feasibly average 8 rebounds a night. </div> Boone can be a double double guy when given the Playing time.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 21 2007, 04:07 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Nets would need to play all double OT games</div> Thats Bull shit and I think you know that. It's your thoughts however I think they are very wrong and off base, i respect it none the less.
