Smith writes: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>You hire Skiles as a coach and you get better, like with Brown. He's smart and demanding. Those are good things. He sees the game more quickly and clearly than most coaches working today. He has a plan and a system of play that's appealing to watch. He emphasizes the right things: defense, teamwork and accountability. I'd recommend Skiles to just about any team in the NBA. Like Brown, he tires of his players, in part because his standards are so high. Which is why the firing of Skiles has been coming; not from the day he was hired, as they say about all NBA coaches, but earlier this season when Skiles began to doubt his team. Players are not stupid. They know. Why can't they play above it because they are professional and are paid so much? They just don't, and Brown had eight NBA jobs on his way to the Hall of Fame. Skiles will have a job next season, and his team will improve. I wonder about Miami—Pat Riley has become a big fan of Skiles and the two spent time together at the coach's annual meeting in September. The Knicks, Nets, and 76ers probably will give him a hard look. They won't be sorry. And then he'll go somewhere and make a team better. Though it was a surprise to everyone as to when Skiles was fired—certainly me; I hardly expected Christmas Eve—those around the team have doubted Skiles would last beyond this season, with next year his lame-duck season. The thinking was general manager John Paxson would wait until midseason before making determinations about everyone. He got fed up more quickly after consecutive blowout losses last week, but associates say he was leaning in that direction long before. One said it started the first week of the season when the Bulls opened badly again and Skiles supposedly told Paxson the team wasn't responding, might not be up to it and he wasn't sure he could do anything about it. It sounded a lot like the circumstances when Skiles was fired in Phoenix with the Suns 25-26 after he'd taken them to the playoffs twice and to the second round once, just as he'd done with the Bulls. Suns insiders complained that Skiles didn't believe he could coach the team anymore. Skiles' allies say he is honest and direct to a fault and was merely telling management the team wasn't good enough after trading Jason Kidd. It sounds sort of like what occurred here.</div> It does, but I think the thing I'd come back to is that while maybe Skiles was right about not being able to coach that Suns team any more, he was even more right about them not being any good. Apparently Skiles was still better at coaching them than anyone else was because they were 25-26 with him and 11-20 without him. Smith's article is pretty interesting and I do think we'll see improved play from several of the players, especially the younger guys - Thabo, Noah and Thomas, who seemed to get very inconsistent burn.
Mike, how much feedback do you need? The owner bent to multimillion dollar crybabies that are dribbling the ball. Skiles is just fine, and will find work elsewhere.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (The Return of the Raider @ Dec 25 2007, 09:35 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Mike, how much feedback do you need? The owner bent to multimillion dollar crybabies that are dribbling the ball. Skiles is just fine, and will find work elsewhere.</div> True enough, but unfortunately I remain a Bulls fan and won't be following Skiles to greener pastures. For me, I want to see what these guys do, and as far as I can tell, we need to make some changes. Even though they're a bunch of crybabies, I'm all about getting the most out of them in the end, and I think someone will be able to come in here and get more out of the younger guys. Maybe the right coach can salvage them. The danger I see is that the move seems most made at the behest of the older multimillion dollar crybabies we ain't gonna get anywhere with. I think the next move that needs to be made is for the Bulls to unload him and start building for the longer term instead of pretending a has-been like Wallace is going to get us anywhere.
Those who know me know I've never been a fan of Skiles as coach (he was an awesome player tho, and I was always a fan when he played). When Skiles was hired, there were many of us who expected the situation to end up exactly as it did in Phoenix, interestingly. We were saying things like "how long before Skiles quits on the team like he did in Phoenix?" I've always sided with the players when it comes to issues between players and management... So maybe this won't be much of a surprise. How the hell can anyone say the players are crybabies? They've dutifully played for Skiles and played hard. They've shown nothing but respect for Skiles in their interviews all along, and that includes Wallace. I _never_ thought the Bulls were winning because of Skiles. I've seen nothing to indicate he's taken a bunch of NBDL guys and won games outright due to his coaching. In fact, the opposite is true - they lost more games than any season under Cartwright (who I did and still do like) coaching NBDL guys (and Hinrich). Doc Rivers was a "great" coach last year, right? LOL. He's a great coach now, though. The situation in Boston is similar to what it was here, when Paxson handed Skiles Gordon, Deng, Duhon, and Nocioni in his best (only good one?) draft so far. Even Doc would win 40+ games with that core. Skiles' drill sergeant act wore thin with me as a fan in just a few days, imagine what it did for the players. It musta sucked the life out of them, as they haven't grown to be what they should have by now. His offense was boring and unimaginative and inflexible to suit the talents of the players. The team dutifully won games, but was not very fun to watch. His rotations were insulting to the players and frustrating for the fans. He's gone, time to move on with a better coach.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 25 2007, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I've never been impressed with Skiles in-game management nor his player development</div> They aren't strong points on his resume. But the guy knows defense. Eddy Curry, Ben Gordon, and Nocioni are some of the weaker defenders in the league, and Skiles has been able to build some elite defensive teams with those players playing big minutes. It's pretty difficult to coach a good offense when you are forced to play Ben Wallace 34 MPG and you don't have a guy who can create a shot reliably, too. To answer the thread topic - I think Skiles is probably right about the Bulls. Of course, I hadn't considered the possibility that the players had quit on him. But it's hard for me to imagine that any hate or dislike or weariness caused by Skiles would be chiefly responsible for Gordon and Hinrich shooting 38%, or our offense dropping to last in the league.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 25 2007, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I've never been impressed with Skiles in-game management nor his player development</div> I've always thought his in-game management was actually rather masterful: the way he would put together line ups in the fourth of some mixed group of regulars and pine-riders who would somehow exploit an opponent deficiency. A fifth of the league's GM's think that Skiles is/was the best at it. http://www.nba.com/preview2007/gmsurvey_coaches.html Which head coach makes the best in-game adjustments? 1. Gregg Popovich, San Antonio 26.9% 2. Don Nelson, Golden State 19.2% Scott Skiles, Chicago 19.2% 4. Jerry Sloan, Utah 11.5% 5. Phil Jackson, L.A. Lakers 7.7% Pat Riley, Miami 7.7% Others receiving votes: Mike D'Antoni, Phoenix; Lawrence Frank, New Jersey Last year's pick: Gregg Popovich
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (such sweet thunder @ Dec 26 2007, 01:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 25 2007, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I've never been impressed with Skiles in-game management nor his player development</div> I've always thought his in-game management was actually rather masterful: the way he would put together line ups in the fourth of some mixed group of regulars and pine riders who would somehow exploit an opponent deficiency. A fifth of the league's GM's think that Skiles is/was the best at it. http://www.nba.com/preview2007/gmsurvey_coaches.html Which head coach makes the best in-game adjustments? 1. Gregg Popovich, San Antonio 26.9% 2. Don Nelson, Golden State 19.2% Scott Skiles, Chicago 19.2% 4. Jerry Sloan, Utah 11.5% 5. Phil Jackson, L.A. Lakers 7.7% Pat Riley, Miami 7.7% Others receiving votes: Mike D'Antoni, Phoenix; Lawrence Frank, New Jersey Last year's pick: Gregg Popovich </div> Bulls players failed him....
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (such sweet thunder @ Dec 26 2007, 01:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 25 2007, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I've never been impressed with Skiles in-game management nor his player development</div> I've always thought his in-game management was actually rather masterful: the way he would put together line ups in the fourth of some mixed group of regulars and pine-riders who would somehow exploit an opponent deficiency. A fifth of the league's GM's think that Skiles is/was the best at it. http://www.nba.com/preview2007/gmsurvey_coaches.html Which head coach makes the best in-game adjustments? 1. Gregg Popovich, San Antonio 26.9% 2. Don Nelson, Golden State 19.2% Scott Skiles, Chicago 19.2% 4. Jerry Sloan, Utah 11.5% 5. Phil Jackson, L.A. Lakers 7.7% Pat Riley, Miami 7.7% Others receiving votes: Mike D'Antoni, Phoenix; Lawrence Frank, New Jersey Last year's pick: Gregg Popovich </div> I can name more than 5 GM's that are idiots...
I have another POV about the Bulls' defense. http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/stor...&id=1580507 <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>Bach returns to Bulls' bench as assistant As they continue free-agent discussions to bring back Scottie Pippen, the Chicago Bulls have negotiated the return of another familar face from their championship run. ESPN.com has learned that the Bulls are fortifying the bench staff of coach Bill Cartwright by re-hiring John Bach, who spent eight seasons with the Bulls as an aide to Doug Collins and Phil Jackson. Bach spent the last two-plus seasons in Washington under Collins and alongside Michael Jordan. He was last with the Bulls in 1992-93, for Chicago's third of six championships in the 1990s and the last season before Jordan's first retirement. "Coming home is always special," Bach said on Monday. "Chicago has always been close to my heart -- I don't think my heart ever left Chicago."</div> Bach was the architect of the Bulls famous "Doberman Defense" during the championship years. He retired after last season, I do believe. He's not listed on the NBA.com Bulls staff page anymore. http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/staff_directory.html Seems to me Skiles was a great defensive coach as long as it was really Bach coaching the players to play defense. Now that Bach is gone, maybe Skiles is a tad exposed as not being that good at it after all.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (rwj @ Dec 26 2007, 12:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Dec 25 2007, 11:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I've never been impressed with Skiles in-game management nor his player development</div> They aren't strong points on his resume. But the guy knows defense. Eddy Curry, Ben Gordon, and Nocioni are some of the weaker defenders in the league, and Skiles has been able to build some elite defensive teams with those players playing big minutes. </div> It's a little bit of a tangent, but Ithese guys (and I'd add Ben Wallace) are good examples of how hard it is to establish what constitutes good defense. Noc is slow and generally a fairly bad man to man defender. But he does a couple of things, like draw charges, ridiculously well. That should figure in, and positively, because it's getting a stop for your team. But adding it to man defense to get some kind of sum total of "defense" doesn't work out very well. Wallace is kind of like that too. He's a guy that's won defensive player of the year but I've never seen much evidence that he's a great man defender. On the flip side, you've got Curry and Gordon, neither of whom seem to be good defenders in any sense of the word, but neither of whom are bad defenders in the sense that they can't play major roles on fairly strong defensive teams. I mean, looking at the 04-05 Bulls, it's not as if the reason they lost was because of poor defense. <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div><div class='quotemain'>It's pretty difficult to coach a good offense when you are forced to play Ben Wallace 34 MPG and you don't have a guy who can create a shot reliably, too. To answer the thread topic - I think Skiles is probably right about the Bulls. Of course, I hadn't considered the possibility that the players had quit on him. But it's hard for me to imagine that any hate or dislike or weariness caused by Skiles would be chiefly responsible for Gordon and Hinrich shooting 38%, or our offense dropping to last in the league.</div> Well, they sure didn't create a lot of good shots for themselves, and they didn't push much in transition. Those things I can see being effort based, and the transition scoring constituted a lot of the Bulls easy baskets. Just not having those would reduce shooting percentages some, and maybe things just snowballed a bit from there. That's not to say I think hatred of Skiles and the players quitting was the only thing going on, just pointing out how it could change things a fair amount on the margin and send shooting percentages down.
