<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JAMES.SLIMM @ Feb 10 2008, 01:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Feb 10 2008, 01:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Major blah, blah, blah throughout this thread. Carter averaged 25/6/4 last year. With Krstic out and RJ playing at 70% when he played and at 0% for 21 games, he was the team's only legitimate scoring option. So this year, he gets hurt and is averaging a mere 21/5/5. He isn't demanding a trade. He isn't complaining and for all this hoot and holler about his contract, his salary isn't even in the top 35 this season. Ratner owns the team. He pays the bills. Of course, it was his decision. Are you that naive to think he let someone else commit $66 million of his money? You think he made this decision without running it through his vaunted marketing mechanism? Please. Moreover, you think this team's lack of success has to do with Carter?! Here's a bulletin for you: the bench sucks. You can start there. You want to blame Thorn and/or Ratner for something: blame them for wasting money--$5.5 million on Magloire, Allen and Armstrong. And don't give me all this wonder about Darrell Armstrong. He's 39 and can barely play 15 solid minutes a game. No one--let me repeat NO ONE--would give him guaranteed money this summer, not the Nets, not the Pacers, not the Mavs. Same goes for Allen. Nachbar has been inconsistent, to be kind. Williams has been hurt. Wright has been awful on offense and often hurt. They cannot shoot. Here's another: one starter and one key backup have yet to get into game shape after missing the first half of the season. Here's a third: the team captain demanded an $13 million extension, first faked a migraine in protest--knowing the team's first two backup PG's were out, then stopped caring and demanded a trade. You think Kidd would have demanded a trade if he had gotten that extension? You would be completely naive if you did. Until this board gets by conventional wisdom, it will not rise to its potential.</div> You know some people on this board can't go a day with out blaming Carter for this teams poor record , for Kidd wanting a trade and so on and so on Blame Carter for everything wrong with the world </div> who is blaming Carter. No one has said this is Carter's fault or he is not producing. The point is the Nets signed VC to a long term contract. So at one point the Nets felt that VC fitted in to their long term plans but two months into the season the Nets are willing to trade him. What was the point in signing him in the summer if you are willing to trade him in winter???? Now if Carter brings the Nets a value piece. I'll retract my statement but from where I am standing that was a dumb move.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (killa kadafi191 @ Feb 10 2008, 01:45 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Now if Carter brings the Nets a value piece. I'll retract my statement but from where I am standing that was an dumb move.</div> He won't now, that's for sure. He would have last year, the year before, the year before that or if he picked up his option.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Feb 10 2008, 02:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Carter averaged 25/6/4 last year. With Krstic out and RJ playing at 70% when he played and at 0% for 21 games, he was the team's only legitimate scoring option. So this year, he gets hurt and is averaging a mere 21/5/5. He isn't demanding a trade. He isn't complaining and for all this hoot and holler about his contract, his salary isn't even in the top 35 this season. Ratner owns the team. He pays the bills. Of course, it was his decision. Are you that naive to think he let someone else commit $66 million of his money? You think he made this decision without running it through his vaunted marketing mechanism? Please. Moreover, you think this team's lack of success has to do with Carter?!</div> This team's lack of success when Carter was healthy had an upper cap on the number of playoff series they could win. This group is still, at best, a second round exit, and that's with everyone playing to their peak potential. MAYBE we sneak through to the ECF, but is this team going to beat Boston, or LA, or San Antonio or Dallas, or Detroit, or Phoenix? I say the probability is low. Add on top of that Carter's above-average propensity to get hurt. I don't think this has caused him to miss time, per say - he's played more minutes and more games than any other Net over the last 3+ years. But I do think it's become an integral part of how he plays - every drive he's making a decision about whether he's going to risk his body and health to get a score. I'm not surprised he doesn't like to drive, run the floor or play intense defense - those are all effort plays that tend to get people hurt. Now, add on top of that that he's an inward-focused introvert on a team without a vocal leader. Considering his age, fame and experience, any large contract is going to implicitly tag him as one of the leaders of the team. Guys said it all of last year - Vince and Kidd are the leaders of the team - when neither of them has any natural talent for leading, except for the fact that Jason Kidd really, really, really wants to win. The sum of this was a lack of a market for Vince at the price we signed him at. And now (SHOCK!) everyone's looking at his contract as a bad investment because he's suddenly (SHOCK!) hurt again. The issue isn't just that Thorn didn't realize this - it's the fact that EVERY OTHER GM IN THE LEAGUE DID! To the point where they were TELLING THE PRESS BEFORE FREE AGENCY EVEN STARTED! The bottom line is this: if you're going to compete against yourself and sign a 31-year old player, one who isn't a leader, and who can't be coerced to play defense or run the floor, one with no other options, to an escalating contract to be part of a roster with a rapidly closing window of opportunity, you deserve to take the blame when the window shuts all of 6 months later and you suddenly can't rebuild because NO-ONE WANTS HIS CONTRACT!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Feb 10 2008, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NetIncome @ Feb 10 2008, 02:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Carter averaged 25/6/4 last year. With Krstic out and RJ playing at 70% when he played and at 0% for 21 games, he was the team's only legitimate scoring option. So this year, he gets hurt and is averaging a mere 21/5/5. He isn't demanding a trade. He isn't complaining and for all this hoot and holler about his contract, his salary isn't even in the top 35 this season. Ratner owns the team. He pays the bills. Of course, it was his decision. Are you that naive to think he let someone else commit $66 million of his money? You think he made this decision without running it through his vaunted marketing mechanism? Please. Moreover, you think this team's lack of success has to do with Carter?!</div> This team's lack of success when Carter was healthy had an upper cap on the number of playoff series they could win. This group is still, at best, a second round exit, and that's with everyone playing to their peak potential. MAYBE we sneak through to the ECF, but is this team going to beat Boston, or LA, or San Antonio or Dallas, or Detroit, or Phoenix? I say the probability is low. Add on top of that Carter's above-average propensity to get hurt. I don't think this has caused him to miss time, per say - he's played more minutes and more games than any other Net over the last 3+ years. But I do think it's become an integral part of how he plays - every drive he's making a decision about whether he's going to risk his body and health to get a score. I'm not surprised he doesn't like to drive, run the floor or play intense defense - those are all effort plays that tend to get people hurt. Now, add on top of that that he's an inward-focused introvert on a team without a vocal leader. Considering his age, fame and experience, any large contract is going to implicitly tag him as one of the leaders of the team. Guys said it all of last year - Vince and Kidd are the leaders of the team - when neither of them has any natural talent for leading, except for the fact that Jason Kidd really, really, really wants to win. The sum of this was a lack of a market for Vince at the price we signed him at. And now (SHOCK!) everyone's looking at his contract as a bad investment because he's suddenly (SHOCK!) hurt again. The issue isn't just that Thorn didn't realize this - it's the fact that EVERY OTHER GM IN THE LEAGUE DID! To the point where they were TELLING THE PRESS BEFORE FREE AGENCY EVEN STARTED! The bottom line is this: if you're going to compete against yourself and sign a 31-year old player, one who isn't a leader, and who can't be coerced to play defense or run the floor, one with no other options, to an escalating contract to be part of a roster with a rapidly closing window of opportunity, you deserve to take the blame when the window shuts all of 6 months later and you suddenly can't rebuild because NO-ONE WANTS HIS CONTRACT! </div> wow thank you for blessing us with that intelligent post.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Feb 10 2008, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>This team's lack of success when Carter was healthy had an upper cap on the number of playoff series they could win. This group is still, at best, a second round exit, and that's with everyone playing to their peak potential. MAYBE we sneak through to the ECF, but is this team going to beat Boston, or LA, or San Antonio or Dallas, or Detroit, or Phoenix? I say the probability is low. Add on top of that Carter's above-average propensity to get hurt. I don't think this has caused him to miss time, per say - he's played more minutes and more games than any other Net over the last 3+ years. But I do think it's become an integral part of how he plays - every drive he's making a decision about whether he's going to risk his body and health to get a score. I'm not surprised he doesn't like to drive, run the floor or play intense defense - those are all effort plays that tend to get people hurt. Now, add on top of that that he's an inward-focused introvert on a team without a vocal leader. Considering his age, fame and experience, any large contract is going to implicitly tag him as one of the leaders of the team. Guys said it all of last year - Vince and Kidd are the leaders of the team - when neither of them has any natural talent for leading, except for the fact that Jason Kidd really, really, really wants to win. The sum of this was a lack of a market for Vince at the price we signed him at. And now (SHOCK!) everyone's looking at his contract as a bad investment because he's suddenly (SHOCK!) hurt again. The issue isn't just that Thorn didn't realize this - it's the fact that EVERY OTHER GM IN THE LEAGUE DID! To the point where they were TELLING THE PRESS BEFORE FREE AGENCY EVEN STARTED! The bottom line is this: if you're going to compete against yourself and sign a 31-year old player, one who isn't a leader, and who can't be coerced to play defense or run the floor, one with no other options, to an escalating contract to be part of a roster with a rapidly closing window of opportunity, you deserve to take the blame when the window shuts all of 6 months later and you suddenly can't rebuild because NO-ONE WANTS HIS CONTRACT!</div> The reasons for a "cap" on their playoff success have more to do with factors other than Carter and how much he is making. Things like, oh, a crappy bench, frontcourt issues and injuries have something to do with it. And don't forget they have been knocked out by teams like Miami and Cleveland who went on to represent the East in the finals, with Miami winning it all a couple of years back. You pick on and over exaggerate the importance of Carters flaws and how it translates over to the state of the team, while also ignoring the good things he has done in his time with the Nets. The bottom line is, what ever injuries Carter has had with the Nets he hasn't missed many games because of them and has still managed to be a key player for them and their ability to get into the playoffs through turmoil and injuries since he joined them. Only this season (so far) he has been slowed down some because of injuries. Also for the umpteenth time, Carter wasnt' overpaid. He makes around the same as other similar caliber swingmen in the league. And the whole overpaid argument some of you cry about is based on that Carter had no other options which is false. HE HAD A PLAYER OPTION. If the Nets never showed interest in coming to the bargaining table last season, Carter's side would have just more pro actively started looking around the league for other suitors and if they found someone, he would have opted out and signed with another team and Nets end up losing him for nothing. But that never happened. Carters side and the Nets management were in negotiations and seemed keen on getting a reasonable deal done with each other which is what happened. Carter took a pay cut this season and the last year of his contract is a team option. He makes less than guys like McGrady, Pierce, Allen, Redd.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 12:50 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Feb 10 2008, 11:10 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>This team's lack of success when Carter was healthy had an upper cap on the number of playoff series they could win. This group is still, at best, a second round exit, and that's with everyone playing to their peak potential. MAYBE we sneak through to the ECF, but is this team going to beat Boston, or LA, or San Antonio or Dallas, or Detroit, or Phoenix? I say the probability is low. Add on top of that Carter's above-average propensity to get hurt. I don't think this has caused him to miss time, per say - he's played more minutes and more games than any other Net over the last 3+ years. But I do think it's become an integral part of how he plays - every drive he's making a decision about whether he's going to risk his body and health to get a score. I'm not surprised he doesn't like to drive, run the floor or play intense defense - those are all effort plays that tend to get people hurt. Now, add on top of that that he's an inward-focused introvert on a team without a vocal leader. Considering his age, fame and experience, any large contract is going to implicitly tag him as one of the leaders of the team. Guys said it all of last year - Vince and Kidd are the leaders of the team - when neither of them has any natural talent for leading, except for the fact that Jason Kidd really, really, really wants to win. The sum of this was a lack of a market for Vince at the price we signed him at. And now (SHOCK!) everyone's looking at his contract as a bad investment because he's suddenly (SHOCK!) hurt again. The issue isn't just that Thorn didn't realize this - it's the fact that EVERY OTHER GM IN THE LEAGUE DID! To the point where they were TELLING THE PRESS BEFORE FREE AGENCY EVEN STARTED! The bottom line is this: if you're going to compete against yourself and sign a 31-year old player, one who isn't a leader, and who can't be coerced to play defense or run the floor, one with no other options, to an escalating contract to be part of a roster with a rapidly closing window of opportunity, you deserve to take the blame when the window shuts all of 6 months later and you suddenly can't rebuild because NO-ONE WANTS HIS CONTRACT!</div> The reasons for a "cap" on their playoff success have more to do with factors other than Carter and how much he is making. Things like, oh, a crappy bench, frontcourt issues and injuries have something to do with it. And don't forget they have been knocked out by teams like Miami and Cleveland who went on to represent the East in the finals, with Miami winning it all a couple of years back. You pick on and over exaggerate the importance of Carters flaws and how it translates over to the state of the team, while also ignoring the good things he has done in his time with the Nets. The bottom line is, what ever injuries Carter has had with the Nets he hasn't missed many games because of them and has still managed to be a key player for them and their ability to get into the playoffs through turmoil and injuries since he joined them. Only this season (so far) he has been slowed down some because of injuries. Also for the umpteenth time, Carter wasnt' overpaid. He makes around the same as other similar caliber swingmen in the league. And the whole overpaid argument some of you cry about is based on that Carter had no other options which is false. HE HAD A PLAYER OPTION. If the Nets never showed interest in coming to the bargaining table last season, Carter's side would have just more pro actively started looking around the league for other suitors and if they found someone, he would have opted out and signed with another team and Nets end up losing him for nothing. But that never happened. Carters side and the Nets management were in negotiations and seemed keen on getting a reasonable deal done with each other which is what happened. Carter took a pay cut this season and the last year of his contract is a team option. He makes less than guys like McGrady, Pierce, Allen, Redd. </div> Another post that misses the point entirely. Signing McGrady, Allen or Redd if they were available would be just as pointless as signing Carter. This idiot tied up huge long-term money in an aging player when the team is on the verge of rebuilding. So in addition to being a bad team with no discernable plan and no foundation for the future, Thorn is now actively trying to trade a player whose (already low) trade value was intentionally reduced to zero just months ago. What kind of management is that? They can't seriously be trying to win. What a crock of shit.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 01:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Another post that misses the point entirely. Signing McGrady, Allen or Redd if they were available would be just as pointless as signing Carter. This idiot tied up huge long-term money in an aging player when the team is on the verge of rebuilding. So in addition to being a bad team with no discernable plan and no foundation for the future, Thorn is now actively trying to trade a player who's (already low) trade value was intentionally reduced to zero just months ago. What kind of management is that? They can't seriously be trying to win. What a crock of shit.</div> But that necessarily doesn't have to be the case. Depending on the type of deals they are getting for their players (all of them), they could decide to retool the team with Carter being part of that process - either as a trade piece or a piece of the puzzle on the court.
As in the famous words of Juno, "That ain't no etch-a-sketch. This is one doodle that can't be un-did, homeskillet." We are stuck in between a rock. Thorn cannot blow it up due to Brooklyn and we cannot win with no bench and pissed off players.
I have no problem with the Carter signing, to tell you the truth. The guy just came off the two best offensive seasons in Nets history. He's hurt right now. If healthy, he might not be a bargain, but he'd be worth every penny. I don't blame Thorn for Collins' contract, which has proven to be an albatross, either. Collins was paid the going rate for backup troll centers at the time, and I believe he was offered the deal in part to placate the fans after the rest of the team was broken up--in effect, to prove that those decisions were not financial. It was a necessary business decision. I don't blame them for being suckered in by Boki's season last year and thinking he could do it again. That was a reasonable mistake. I don't really blame them for drafting Wright. Everyone harps on Granger, but at the time there were an equal number of people who wanted the Nets to draft McCants, Graham, Warrick, Gerald Green, or even Simien, and the team would not have been any better with any of them. It's not like Brandon Armstrong pick, which was followed by Dalembert, Gerald Wallace, Jamaal Tinsley, Trent Hassell, and Gil Arenas. And Raul Lopez. Besides, he has gotten very good value in Boone and Sean Williams since then. I don't blame him for drafting Marcus Williams. To do so would be completely revising history--every expert, pundit, and analyst thought it was a steal. I DO fault Thorn for the bench, specifically, the ongoing decision to invest millions in multiple middling veterans every season without any potential to improve, instead of signing at least ONE young unsigned (and possibly undrafted free agent) to gradually develop. Not only have the vets not been any good, but there has not been ANY continuity, as the supporting staff nearly completely turns over every season. As I mentioned in another thread, I see no reason why Kevin Pittsnogle wouldn't be every bit as good as Malik Allen.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 01:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 01:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Another post that misses the point entirely. Signing McGrady, Allen or Redd if they were available would be just as pointless as signing Carter. This idiot tied up huge long-term money in an aging player when the team is on the verge of rebuilding. So in addition to being a bad team with no discernable plan and no foundation for the future, Thorn is now actively trying to trade a player who's (already low) trade value was intentionally reduced to zero just months ago. What kind of management is that? They can't seriously be trying to win. What a crock of shit.</div> But that necessarily doesn't have to be the case. Depending on the type of deals they are getting for their players (all of them), they could decide to retool the team with Carter being part of that process - either as a trade piece or a piece of the puzzle on the court. </div> It has to be the case. As much as people would like you to believe the Pistons are not going no where. As much as they want you to believe their reign is over they're always in Conference Finals. Boston is proving they can compete without all of their big three (something this team can't do with all of their three) and you have a team like the Magic on the rise. Depending on what the Nets get they will not be competing anytime soon.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (killa kadafi191 @ Feb 10 2008, 02:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>It has to be the case. As much as people would like you to believe the Pistons are not going no where. As much as they want you to believe their reign is over they're always in Conference Finals. Boston is proving they can compete without all of their big three (something this team can't do with all of their three) and you have a team like the Magic on the rise. Depending on what the Nets get they will not be competing anytime soon.</div> No it doesn't have to be the case. Retooling the team is not limited to this one season. For example, they could end up trading Kidd for a lesser but starting type PG and get other pieces like shorter contracts, young prospects + picks (not necessarily great prospects or great picks) that they could later repackage in the offseason or next trade deadline in an offer for a talented big man and bench depth. That's pretty much what Boston did to become contenders this season. Accumulated assets which they packaged in an offer for Garnett and paired him up with Pierce and Allen. Voila, Eastern contender. Same route available for the Nets to take. They could take whatever assets they get from a Kidd trade and package them with whatever other assets they have, and use it all to retool the roster around Jefferson, Carter and Krstic.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 01:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 01:10 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Another post that misses the point entirely. Signing McGrady, Allen or Redd if they were available would be just as pointless as signing Carter. This idiot tied up huge long-term money in an aging player when the team is on the verge of rebuilding. So in addition to being a bad team with no discernable plan and no foundation for the future, Thorn is now actively trying to trade a player who's (already low) trade value was intentionally reduced to zero just months ago. What kind of management is that? They can't seriously be trying to win. What a crock of shit.</div> But that necessarily doesn't have to be the case. Depending on the type of deals they are getting for their players (all of them), they could decide to retool the team with Carter being part of that process - either as a trade piece or a piece of the puzzle on the court. </div> But the time to use him to retool was before signing him to a contract no one wants. As for using him on the court, that's not the way to rebuild. First you build the core, then you add the pieces around it. Maybe Vince could be one of those useful pieces if there was a rebuilding process underway right now, but there isn't. The Nets are years away. They don't have a single player on the roster to build around. Commit to him at this price for no reason and hope to build a team around players the Nets don't even have yet with whom he could theoretically fit in several years from now - that plan sounds great.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>But the time to use him to retool was before signing him to a contract no one wants. As for using him on the court, that's not the way to rebuild. First you build the core, then you add the pieces around it. Maybe Vince could be one of those useful pieces if there was a rebuilding process underway right now, but there isn't. The Nets are years away. They don't have a single player on the roster to build around. Commit to him at this price for no reason and hope to build a team around players the Nets don't even have yet with whom he could theoretically fit in several years from now - that plan sounds great.</div> I'm not talking about keeping Carter around in a rebuilding process where you are trying to build through draft picks and develop a young core and dump long term contracts. I'm talking about retooling the team with Carter and as an example use the pieces from a possible Kidd trade to do it. If they want to completely rebuild and can find expiring contracts and some young prospects and/or draft picks for Kidd, Carter and maybe Jefferson then thats one direction to go in. But there is also the other direction I mentioned about retooling the roster by getting some assets and using them later on to land a marquee player to add to Jefferson, Carter, Krstic and whatever else.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 04:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>But the time to use him to retool was before signing him to a contract no one wants. As for using him on the court, that's not the way to rebuild. First you build the core, then you add the pieces around it. Maybe Vince could be one of those useful pieces if there was a rebuilding process underway right now, but there isn't. The Nets are years away. They don't have a single player on the roster to build around. Commit to him at this price for no reason and hope to build a team around players the Nets don't even have yet with whom he could theoretically fit in several years from now - that plan sounds great.</div> I'm not talking about keeping Carter around in a rebuilding process where you are trying to build through draft picks and develop a young core and dump long term contracts. I'm talking about retooling the team with Carter and as an example use the pieces from a possible Kidd trade to do it. If they want to completely rebuild and can find expiring contracts and some young prospects and/or draft picks for Kidd, Carter and maybe Jefferson then thats one direction to go in. But there is also the other direction I mentioned about retooling the roster by getting some assets and using them later on to land a marquee player to add to Jefferson, Carter, Krstic and whatever else. </div> ...A la Boston..? Although, that took a few seasons. So I'm not too sure about that.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 10 2008, 04:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>...A la Boston..? Although, that took a few seasons. So I'm not too sure about that.</div> Well, a complete rebuild also has the potential to be even longer and more grueling to endure through.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 04:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>But the time to use him to retool was before signing him to a contract no one wants. As for using him on the court, that's not the way to rebuild. First you build the core, then you add the pieces around it. Maybe Vince could be one of those useful pieces if there was a rebuilding process underway right now, but there isn't. The Nets are years away. They don't have a single player on the roster to build around. Commit to him at this price for no reason and hope to build a team around players the Nets don't even have yet with whom he could theoretically fit in several years from now - that plan sounds great.</div> I'm not talking about keeping Carter around in a rebuilding process where you are trying to build through draft picks and develop a young core and dump long term contracts. I'm talking about retooling the team with Carter and as an example use the pieces from a possible Kidd trade to do it. If they want to completely rebuild and can find expiring contracts and some young prospects and/or draft picks for Kidd, Carter and maybe Jefferson then thats one direction to go in. But there is also the other direction I mentioned about retooling the roster by getting some assets and using them later on to land a marquee player to add to Jefferson, Carter, Krstic and whatever else. </div> What kind of star players are they going to add to Carter and Jefferson that will lead to the Nets being championship contenders? What assets will they use to acquire these players?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 04:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What kind of star players are they going to add to Carter and Jefferson that will lead to the Nets being championship contenders? What assets will they use to acquire these players?</div> If things don't turn around in Clipper land maybe Elton Brand becomes available. And I know some people hate him but Jermaine O'Neil is another option if you could get him for little. And who knows, maybe some player gets disgruntled with his team or some team under achieves and gets disgruntled with a player and looks to deal. Maybe that could happen with Boozer in Utah. And they use expiring contracts like Swifts next season and other contracts from a possible Kidd trade that become expiring next season. Throw in some young prospects and/or picks.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 04:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 04:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What kind of star players are they going to add to Carter and Jefferson that will lead to the Nets being championship contenders? What assets will they use to acquire these players?</div> If things don't turn around in Clipper land maybe Elton Brand becomes available. And I know some people hate him but Jermaine O'Neil is another option if you could get him for little. And who knows, maybe some player gets disgruntled with his team or some team under achieves and gets disgruntled with a player and looks to deal. Maybe that could happen with Boozer in Utah. And they use expiring contracts like Swifts next season other contracts from a possible Kidd trade that become expiring next season. Throw in some young prospects and/or picks. </div> that's a lot of maybes but stranger things have happen. So I guess you never know
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (killa kadafi191 @ Feb 10 2008, 05:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 04:58 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 04:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>What kind of star players are they going to add to Carter and Jefferson that will lead to the Nets being championship contenders? What assets will they use to acquire these players?</div> If things don't turn around in Clipper land maybe Elton Brand becomes available. And I know some people hate him but Jermaine O'Neil is another option if you could get him for little. And who knows, maybe some player gets disgruntled with his team or some team under achieves and gets disgruntled with a player and looks to deal. Maybe that could happen with Boozer in Utah. And they use expiring contracts like Swifts next season other contracts from a possible Kidd trade that become expiring next season. Throw in some young prospects and/or picks. </div> that's a lot of maybes but stranger things have happen. So I guess you never know </div> Well, even if those maybe don't work out the Nets could still go nuclear and try to dump Carter and Jefferson's contracts which would have one less year on them for expiring contracts + some picks or prospects.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 04:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Feb 10 2008, 04:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Feb 10 2008, 03:56 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>But the time to use him to retool was before signing him to a contract no one wants. As for using him on the court, that's not the way to rebuild. First you build the core, then you add the pieces around it. Maybe Vince could be one of those useful pieces if there was a rebuilding process underway right now, but there isn't. The Nets are years away. They don't have a single player on the roster to build around. Commit to him at this price for no reason and hope to build a team around players the Nets don't even have yet with whom he could theoretically fit in several years from now - that plan sounds great.</div> I'm not talking about keeping Carter around in a rebuilding process where you are trying to build through draft picks and develop a young core and dump long term contracts. I'm talking about retooling the team with Carter and as an example use the pieces from a possible Kidd trade to do it. If they want to completely rebuild and can find expiring contracts and some young prospects and/or draft picks for Kidd, Carter and maybe Jefferson then thats one direction to go in. But there is also the other direction I mentioned about retooling the roster by getting some assets and using them later on to land a marquee player to add to Jefferson, Carter, Krstic and whatever else. </div> What kind of star players are they going to add to Carter and Jefferson that will lead to the Nets being championship contenders? What assets will they use to acquire these players? </div> What percentage of the time does a complete rebuild a la Minnesota actually result in the team eventually becoming contenders? Usually, they peak at mediocre. I think you have a better chance of eventually contending if you keep half your core intact. For one thing, it gives you the flexibility to make in immediately splash like Boston did.
