It would be kinda silly if the traded ended up to be just a HUGE rumor. I must be the only one still hoping it is, just a bit.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (FOMW @ Feb 13 2008, 04:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Petey @ Feb 13 2008, 04:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>My thinking is actually the complete opposite. There are tons of teams build around depth that have faltered and can't upgraded to trade for an impact player. Look at the Bulls of the past few years. The Grizzles past few years. It's hard to move for a impact player while at times 1 will fall into your lap (Gasol/Lakers; Carter/Nets). While Thorn made solid late picks, he has made poor picks in the 1st third of the draft, and later parts too. What you are talking about is a bunch of 'what ifs'. Moving quality parts for a bunch of 'what ifs' doesn't excite me. -Petey</div> It's well known that James has a HUGE financial incentive for moving to a team in the NY metro area. Though the east is weak, I don't see Cleveland as having either the coach or the type of roster flexibility and assets to substantially improve Cleveland's supporting cast to a championship level. They got a little lucky last year beating Detroit, and I don't expect that lightning to strike twice. And even if they get to the finals again with Lebron, they will not stand a chance against any western power. So there will be at least major financial and perhaps some basketball incentives for him to move to NY. Even if the Knicks fire Thomas today and install a competent GM and coach, the hole he put the franchise in is too deep to fill any time soon. So the Nets will be the only game in town. Is this speculation? Of course, but it's reasoned speculation that comports with the kinds of things that superstar athletes usually put first (money, big media exposure, and the social status and pecking order they help establish). So I still think you can't dismiss the assets acquired in this trade, which could be instrumental in acquiring James or some other big impact player in a couple of years, as "meaningless" until you see what those assets in fact purchase. </div> If nothing comes of it, which is the more likely chance than James... do we get to think this deal stinks twice as much in 2 years? -Petey
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think when you buy out a player, his contract doesn't count against the cap anymore. Isn't that the difference between buying out and releasing/waiving? You pay the player most of his contract on the spot, and then you don't have to pay him more money the following years? So by that logic, if we buyout Stackhouse it actually helps our cap. But I'm not sure about it. EDIT: Never mind, just found out it counts against the cap. That sucks... Anyway, it's a decent trade. I like Diop, I think he can really help us in the paint. He's a solid center, good rebounder and shotblocker and we haven't had someone like him since Mutombo and 'Zo, really. I'm for extending his contract, for around 3-4 million dollars a year for a few years if he agrees to it, though that doesn't seem likely. Still, his expiring contract is an asset. Harris is obviously a good player, he's extremely fast and hopefully he'll return good as new from his injury. Stackhouse (if he doesn't get bought out) and George (also expiring) are two decent vets who'll give us some much needed scoring off the bench. Ager has potential and I think he'll be an important part of the rotation in the future. Right now, 5-10 minutes a game should be enough for him. The two picks, well, I don't really expect much out of them. I believe Dallas will finish with around the 27th pick this season, which is decent because of the deep draft but still not something to get all excited about. In 2010, with Dirk and Kidd past their primes, they'll probably have a pick in the 22-23 range. I have no idea who's who in that draft, but that's 22 is a pretty good pick (See: Marcus Williams). The 2nd round pick will probably be some Euro project who'll never make it to the NBA. But just as important as the fact that we're getting a pretty good return is the fact that we're dumping two mediocre (is it really the right word...) players in the proccess. Kidd's time has come. We all knew it was coming. It's been a fun ride, but all eras have to end someday. Let's hope this new one will be even more successful than the Jason Kidd Era.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobimel @ Feb 13 2008, 05:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think when you buy out a player, his contract doesn't count against the cap anymore. Isn't that the difference between buying out and releasing/waiving? You pay the player most of his contract on the spot, and then you don't have to pay him more money the following years? So by that logic, if we buyout Stackhouse it actually helps our cap. But I'm not sure about it. Anyway, it's a decent trade. I like Diop, I think he can really help us in the paint. He's a solid center, good rebounder and shotblocker and we haven't had someone like him since Mutombo and 'Zo, really. I'm for extending his contract, for around 3-4 million dollars a year for a few years if he agrees to it, though that doesn't seem likely. Still, his expiring contract is an asset. Harris is obviously a good player, he's extremely fast and hopefully he'll return good as new from his injury. Stackhouse (if he doesn't get bought out) and George (also expiring) are two decent vets who'll give us some much needed scoring off the bench. Ager has potential and I think he'll be an important part of the rotation in the future. Right now, 5-10 minutes a game should be enough for him. The two picks, well, I don't really expect much out of them. I believe Dallas will finish with around the 27th pick this season, which is decent because of the deep draft but still not something to get all excited about. In 2010, with Dirk and Kidd past their primes, they'll probably have a pick in the 22-23 range. I have no idea who's who in that draft, but that's 22 is a pretty good pick (See: Marcus Williams). The 2nd round pick will probably be some Euro project who'll never make it to the NBA. But just as important as the fact that we're getting a pretty good return is the fact that we're dumping two mediocre (is it really the right word...) players in the proccess. Kidd's time has come. We all knew it was coming. It's been a fun ride, but all eras have to end someday. Let's hope this new one will be even more successful than the Jason Kidd Era.</div> The portion the player gives up comes off the cap. A player has a 7M dollar salary, gives up 1M, takes a 6 M buyout, the 6M is on the cap. -Petey
I'm pumped up about this trade. Harris seems like a good piece, even if he doesn't really have an NBA position. Someone made the point earlier that we might run a Harris-Carter backcourt where Vince was the PG - that seems like a great idea to me. I'm not too worried about Harris' lack of three-point ability. I mean, we're coming from Jason Kidd, it won't be that big a shock... I love Diop as a player and hope we resign him. He's like Collins without the bad knees and a much, MUCH better shotblocker and rebounder. Don't know what to think about Maurice Ager. I like that we get Devean George's expiring contract, although I'm worried about the Stackhouse buyout. I hate the idea of paying 4-5 million a year for a guy playing for another team. Even still, that's less than we'll be paying Kidd. I also like the 2010 first rounder - Kidd's declining faster than people seem to realize, and Dallas just gave up two of their three main young assets. Considering that there wasn't really anywhere else Kidd COULD go, I think this is a steal for Thorn. If Harris is as good as everyone seems to talk about him being (I'm skeptical) than I think it could be franchise saving.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobimel @ Feb 13 2008, 05:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>In 2010, with Dirk and Kidd past their primes, they'll probably have a pick in the 22-23 range. I have no idea who's who in that draft, but that's 23 is a pretty good pick (See: Josh Boone).</div> fixed it for ya
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 13 2008, 05:11 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kobimel @ Feb 13 2008, 05:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>In 2010, with Dirk and Kidd past their primes, they'll probably have a pick in the 22-23 range. I have no idea who's who in that draft, but that's 23 is a pretty good pick (See: Josh Boone).</div> fixed it for ya </div> <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Petey)</div><div class='quotemain'>The portion the player gives up comes off the cap. A player has a 7M dollar salary, gives up 1M, takes a 6 M buyout, the 6M is on the cap. -Petey</div> Thanks Petey. Good to know. So hopefully, Stack gives up a lot of money in the buyout.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (soul driver @ Feb 13 2008, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>it's official now, just waiting for league approval.</div> League approval? The league has to approve of trades? ...how the hell did the Gasol trade get approved??
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 13 2008, 06:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (soul driver @ Feb 13 2008, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>it's official now, just waiting for league approval.</div> League approval? The league has to approve of trades? ...how the hell did the Gasol trade get approved?? </div> That made me laugh out loud. I love the idea of GMs whining to David Stern about why so-and-so trade isn't fair, like some fantasy league or something. I mean, if the Sheed-to-Detroit trade didn't get vetoed for being unfair, nothing ever will...
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ly_yng @ Feb 13 2008, 05:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 13 2008, 06:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (soul driver @ Feb 13 2008, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>it's official now, just waiting for league approval.</div> League approval? The league has to approve of trades? ...how the hell did the Gasol trade get approved?? </div> That made me laugh out loud. I love the idea of GMs whining to David Stern about why so-and-so trade isn't fair, like some fantasy league or something. I mean, if the Sheed-to-Detroit trade didn't get vetoed for being unfair, nothing ever will... </div> Thorn was there to bitch about that one. -Petey
Considering how much the media has been talking about Kidd's complaints, I think the Nets did pretty damn well. Harris and Diop are both young players that fit in w/ guys like Jefferson, Boone, and SWAT. No one believed the Nets were going to win a championship w/ "The Big Three" and it's obvious that this trade helps two, three, four years from now. For all of Stackhouse having a huge contract, it could be a nice piece to a trade in the future, or give management some extra money to sign a free agent someday. And how many people predicted the Blazers would win the lottery? I don't think the Mavs are going to fall off in next two or three years though, so thinking the picks will be in the teens or any lower than that might be asking a bit too much. Josh Howard is only 27 and Nowitzki is only 29. And don't forget Mark Cuban is still the owner. If they need something, he'll shell out the money to get it.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (pegs @ Feb 13 2008, 05:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (soul driver @ Feb 13 2008, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>it's official now, just waiting for league approval.</div> League approval? The league has to approve of trades? ...how the hell did the Gasol trade get approved?? </div> I believe "league approval" is just when the NBA makes sure salaries match and there are no contract issues.
Not for nothing, but people have been advocating for the Nets to stop signing overused, washed up veterans... The Nets got Maurice Ager in the trade today. He's a former first rounder, only in his second year, hasn't really had much of a shot in Dallas it would seem. Who knows, maybe he could suprise.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Carter15Nets @ Feb 13 2008, 05:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>stack has 1 year left not 2</div> Incorrect. He has two years left on his deal after this season. He signed a 3 year deal last July.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jizzy @ Feb 13 2008, 05:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>stack is going to be bought out, he isnt even taking a plane here</div> Source about the plane?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (JCB @ Feb 13 2008, 05:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Carter15Nets @ Feb 13 2008, 05:35 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>stack has 1 year left not 2</div> Incorrect. He has two years left on his deal after this season. He signed a 3 year deal last July. </div> WFAN said 1 year left maybe the 3rd year was team option? If its 2 years left then no way they should buy him out, they would be paying him 2009/2010 season, kidd expires 2008/2009 season.
